Talk:John McAfee/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Initial text

nice way to sanitize the article, erase everything that might be considered 'negative', and whitewash historical fact.

thank god for 'past versions' being kept by wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.185.250.195 (talk) 13:47, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Factual problem

I believe there is a problem and inaccuracy in the article. Revision Old revision of John_McAfee from user Jdavidmcafee (claiming to be John McAfee) added a claim, which said weapon charges were dropped, but no cited source claims it. Doing a web search for it, [[1]] , I find that the only articles that say anything about "charges dropped" are ones from today/yesterday, or ones citing McAfee's earlier own statement. I believe am strongly convinced this is a case of citogenesis as humorously portrayed in xkcd 978 ., i.e. news cited wikipedia, which wrongfully cited news.

I had not actually thought about that. I had noticed some flaws in this article, but I didn't think that it would have any large repercussions. --Harizotoh9 (talk) 00:17, 14 November 2012 (UTC)
I strongly recommend that everyone go over the article to ensure that it only contains factually correct information. Anything that is questionable should be removed. There are going to be many people looking at this page in the next few days. --Harizotoh9 (talk) 00:24, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

According to the NBC TV show "Dateline" that ran a special about the Belize incidents, the name "John McAfee" should be spelled "John MacAfee" but his anti-virus software is indeed McAfee Antivirus. Wikipedia should probably have a search link to the alternate spelling MacAfee, about which Dateline was very consistent. Google the alternate spelling to confirm that "John MacAfee" Dateline will hit repeatedly from several news sources.

John McAfee vs UDP politician

John McAfee has alleged to be currently having legal problems due to a feud with a UDP Cabinet Member. McAfee has declared his intent to stay out of the politics of Belize. He was approached by a UDP politician for a campaign contribution and refused on principle of neutrality, this was taken as an insult. This has been refuted by the Prime Minister http://edition.channel5belize.com/archives/78435 RichardBond (talk) 20:07, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Arrested in Guatemala

McAfee is being reported by [| Reuters], [| The Associated Press], and [| Vice], who have a video of the incident. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cawhee (talk • contribs) 03:57, 6 December 2012 (UTC) [| McAfee's blog] is now reporting him arrested. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cawhee (talk • contribs) 04:06, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Reuters is reporting that Guatemala is [|seeking expulsion from Guatemala]
Guatemala is hoping to expel McAfee from country by early Thursday morning. [2] --Cawhee (talk) 04:30, 6 December 2012 (UTC)--Cawhee (talk) 04:24, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
If he is wanted for questioning by the authorities in Belize, why has he been deported to the US, rather than extradited to Belize? Jim Michael (talk) 08:38, 13 December 2012 (UTC)
I believe that he still holds his U.S citizenship.--Cawhee (talk) 02:02, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
If the authorities consider him a murder suspect, why would Guatemala not extradite him there, regardless of his citizenship? The article implies that his health problems had something to do with him being deported to the US instead of extradited to Guatemala, but does not say whether or not Belize's pursuit of McAfee has been abandoned. A real or faked heart attack or anxiety attack would not make a country drop proceedings against someone in a murder enquiry. Jim Michael (talk) 03:35, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Slashdot interview May 2013

McAfee was interviewed on Slashdot recently. He says some interesting stuff about himself ... if the interview counts as a WP:RS, some of it should/could be added to this article. (I'm too busy.) Cheers, CWC 14:02, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

Rumors of his death, Sep 2013

He is very much alive. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.238.141.74 (talk) 19:58, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Residence update?

The article says that he lives in Portland, but this article about a DUI indicates he lives in Tennessee. I don't feel that it's a strong enough source to override the other one. Thoughts? --Jorm (talk) 04:25, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

Well, The Register - a widely read news service for people in IT - has the story and has what purports to be the bottle containing his prescription Xanax. The exact address has been blurred but it doesn't look like a Photoshop job. Register story here.87.244.73.92 (talk) 16:44, 13 August 2015 (UTC)

Place of birth

There's a fundamental misunderstanding in the footnote: the services registering births in England and Wales are entirely separate from those in Scotland. If McAfee was born in England, the only candidate is a John D McAfee, birth registered in the October to December quarter of 1945 (under English law you have six weeks from date of birth to register, so that is a perfectly good fit). The registration is in the Forest of Dean, the area west of Gloucester and east of the Welsh border. The records are easily available via Ancestry.com.

Scottish records are available via Scotlandspeople.com, but even running a search requires a registration. 87.244.73.92 (talk) 16:54, 13 August 2015 (UTC)

Based on his paperwork for his recent presidential campaign, it seems like he is the John David McAfee you mentioned. FallingGravity (talk) 04:13, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Running for President

How can he run for President if he was born in Scotland? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ericp-nh (talk • contribs) 03:38, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

He wasn't born in Scotland, seems like that's an error in the article that should be fixed. According to The Hill, it's because he was born on a US Army base in the United Kingdom. FallingGravity (talk) 04:13, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Is this confirmed? 2 weeks after his official announcement [3], the coverage is dwindling or ambivalent: [4]; also questionable if the Cyber Party is worth mentioning as there is virtually no information about it, even on its promotional website [5].--ScryptKitty (talk) 05:06, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

Nothing about him offering to eat his own dick on live TV?

In July 2017, John McAfee said that if Bitcoin doesn't reach $500,000 in three years, he will eat his own dick on live TV. This was covered in all the press. Why isn't it part of this article? Just wondering. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 16:13, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

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Media attention and false news

I don't have much experience editing BLPs. As such, I don't feel comfortable adding a sensitive topic like this to the article directly. On this topic, I've drafted the following.

McAfee has publicly stated on Twitter that his 2020 campaign is solely for getting media attention about cryptocurrencies (tweet 1, tweet 2, tweet 3), and has "no interest in being President" (tweet 4).

He's also gotten a lot of attention about an alleged "E911 chip" that would exist in everyone's phones and allow government remote access to location, audio, video and other device capabilities. He then claimed that the "Presidential alerts" (Emergency Alert System) are broadcasted in a way that can utilise this chip's capabilities. (tweet 5)

Both claims have been publicly rejected and disproven by the Electronic Frontier Foundation ([6]), Snopes.com ([7]), EarnTheNecklace ([8]), and various others.

While McAfee has yet to publicly respond to this, he later celebrated his decredited tweet as having successfully reached a larger audience than Donald Trump. (tweet 6)

Thoughts? --Krinkle (talk) 04:25, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

Veracity of "47 Kids" claim

This page currently reports John Mcafee has 47 kids, and this sourced to a twitter post he made saying that.

One, I think this may be a joke on Mcafee's part, and two, even if it was a serious statement, there's no secondary source confirming that.

For that reason, I propose removing that claim.

Gardenofaleph (talk) 14:35, 23 January 2019 (UTC)

You're right - I just removed it. Korny O'Near (talk) 15:02, 23 January 2019 (UTC)
thanks!

Gardenofaleph (talk) 16:50, 23 January 2019 (UTC)

Under the influence

How can one possibly drive under the influence of a firearm? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.139.82.82 (talk) 23:22, 19 October 2015 (UTC)

It appears the language being objected to by the IP Address (above) has been fixed, however while reading, it occured to me that the Article should specify what the "impairing" substance was. So I did a cursory search, expecting to confirm it was alcohol, and considered including this information in the Article, along with McAfee's BAC. Found no references citing alcohol, but a non-reliable source (IMO) gave a quote supposedly from McAfee saying "The Xanax made me do it", which I think makes the whole question even more interesting. If RS can be found that the intoxicating substance was either Xanax alone, or a combination of Xanax + (whatever), I think this information should be included in the Article.Tym Whittier (talk) 21:03, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

Removed material in violation of WP:BLP policy.

I have removed unsourced contentious material in keeping with wikipedia's WP:BLP policy. Remember that allegations against public figures require multiple reliable sources to be included in BLP under WP:PUBLICFIGURE. 98.179.184.17 (talk) 22:41, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

"Sex Worker"?

Why is the Article describing Janice Dyson as a "sex worker", and not a "prostitute"? Does the Encyclopedia describe other illegal behaviors in such fringe, minority-held terms? Are murderers described as "Life Removal Workers"? Bank Robbers "Funds Transfer Employees"?Tym Whittier (talk) 20:55, 24 April 2019 (UTC)

Well, "sex worker" isn't exactly a euphemism - it's a broader term than "prostitute", according to its article. But I agree that "prostitute" should be used here - it's clearer and more specific. Korny O'Near (talk) 01:56, 25 April 2019 (UTC)
I just checked a bunch of online dictionaries, and every one includes "sex worker." Sometimes it is defined as a prostitute, and sometimes as work that is sexual. It's a term in common parlance, so it's improper to refer to it as "fringe," and no dictionary I consulted suggests that is. It is often used to refer to non-prostitutes, such as strippers. Prostitution is not illegal in much of the world, so Tym Whittier's opinion is provincial and distorted. Nowhere in the world is murder or bank robbery legal, so the analogies are inapt. Nicmart (talk) 12:14, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

It's a tricky subject to discuss people but I think sex worker is an euphemism Thato Nkomo (talk) 00:21, 10 August 2019 (UTC)

As Korny said, it is used more broadly than as a synonym for prostitute, but it includes prostitute, as dictionaries often state, and in that case would be a synonym, not a euphemism. Nicmart (talk) 12:14, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

Suicide Rumors

I just reverted an edit showing his death. I do see rumors online, but nothing confirmed yet. - PabloMartinez (talk) 18:59, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

El Mundo has a story confirming the death: https://www.elmundo.es/tecnologia/2021/06/23/60d38594e4d4d8c47b8b4699.html - Mattficke (talk) 19:24, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

New York Post has it, but it's not considered a reliable source. Solipsism 101 (talk) 19:34, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

No cause of death should be mentioned until it is confirmed by more than one or two potentially unreliable sources. He “has died” in prison, and that’s all we really know. Daedal45 (talk) 19:45, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Are you suggesting the reference we used is not considered reliable? Also The Daily Beast has it.[9] Solipsism 101 (talk) 19:51, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

The Catalan Justice Department has issued a statement denoting it's belief in McAfee committed suicide https://reut.rs/3d6VhZP DieSonneUnsLacht (talk) 20:03, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

The Daily Beast article is marked "This story will be updated." AdityaShankar50 (talk) 20:17, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Merger proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
The result of this discussion was merge . SecretName101 (talk) 20:24, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

I propose to merge John McAfee 2020 presidential campaign into John McAfee. I think that the content in the John McAfee 2020 presidential article can easily be explained in the context of John McAfee, and the John McAfee article is of a reasonable size that the merging of John McAfee 2020 presidential campaign will not cause any problems as far as article size is concerned. Additionally, since we haven not even created a separate article for his previous 2016 run (nor do I think we should), it does not make sense to have a separate article for his 2020 run, which arguably has even less notability. SecretName101 (talk) 21:41, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

I created that article. I no longer stand by its notability. I support the merge. --Vrivasfl (talk) 13:28, 13 July 2020 (UTC)
 --I support the merge. It can easily be appended to the main article. (No User)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:8C:4580:F330:F4E9:6181:680D:80A4 (talk) 19:05, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
Support. It easily appends to his entry. Nicmart (talk) 12:18, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
Support per argument of the nominator. The campaign lacks strong enough notability to justify a standalone article, but merging content into the McAfee bio article is sensible and appropriate.Sal2100 (talk) 15:07, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

Closing discussion, and merging now SecretName101 (talk) 20:24, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Semi-protected edit request on 23 June 2021

he did not commit suicide let me edit this page ya plonkers Mcafeedidntkillhimself (talk) 20:24, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

The article does not say that he committed suicide, only that it is currently suspected he committed suicide. While I think skepticism and investigation into his death is warranted, unless you have a citable source that contradicts current reports, you cannot put meaningless conjecture about McAfee's cause of death in the article. Ithinkiplaygames (talk) 20:27, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

 Already done It is stated that it was suspected suicide. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 20:37, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Thank you guys for your opinion. However, I believe Wikipedia cannot unlock the semi-protected edit only because there will be bots, and random supporters without clear evidence editing about his death. If you think that Mcafee didn't kill himself, maybe refer to the other Talk pages on this page. Thanks for your effort on Wikipedia. Jukki0522 (talk) 00:33, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

tweets

Tweets from the subject aren't sourced to secondary sources known for a neutral point of view. I am inclined to rip out everything solely sourced to the subject's own words. Mcfnord (talk) 03:39, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

If the claim is that the subject said something, and you provide a tweet of him saying it, how is that not a valid source? Fredo699 (talk) 20:51, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Vandalism

Vandalism by conspiracy theorist under Death section. LordAthenos1017 (talk) 21:42, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

That section is well sourced by reliable news outlets, Reuters, AP news, BBC, etc. WP:PROVEIT and WP:RELIABLE seem relevant to this conversation. Zinnober9 (talk) 21:52, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Zinnober9 I think they were referring to this edit, which has already been reverted. 192.76.8.91 (talk) 21:57, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Ah, right you are. Thanks. I've struckout my statement as it was incorrectly thinking LordAthenos1017 was contradicting the sourced suicide reports. My apologies. Zinnober9 (talk) 22:03, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Section order: "Death" before "Legal issues"?

Right now, the "Death" section coming before the "Legal issues" section feels slightly out of order. The end of the legal issues section directly covers his imprisonment in Spain and his pending extradition, which leads directly into his death. For better article flow, I think the two should probably swap positions. Ithinkiplaygames (talk) 20:25, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Agreed DieSonneUnsLacht (talk) 20:41, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Agreed, but semi-protected status means that only golden retrievers or their human counterparts may edit the page. Rainbow-five (talk) 20:49, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

I have swapped the positions. Thank you for the input. Phillip Samuel (talk) 22:40, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Washington Examiner

I have raised the question of the appropriateness of the Washington Examiner as a source, at WP:RSN. It's a poor source with a patchy reputation and I would suggest should never be used in a WP:BLP, and preferably never used at all. Guy (help!) 16:35, 13 February 2020 (UTC)

This is a BLP where sourcing needs to be tight - the subject is given to getting self-aggrandising nonsense into low-quality publications. Anything in this article needs RSes to show its notability - David Gerard (talk) 19:38, 13 February 2020 (UTC)
Is there objective evidence that the Washington Examiner is less accurate than, say the Washington Post or the New York Times? Reputation is not evidence. Nicmart (talk) 13:43, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Perennial_sources#Sources -- Beardo (talk) 22:45, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Lead

I believe the lead is far too long, especially on the mobile version. Yes he had many hobbies and been at many companies and lived in many places, but is it really so notable as to be in the lead? Could easily be shortened to key bits; McAfee, global sucess, departure, problems with the law, death. Abcmaxx (talk) 23:27, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Janice as prostitute

Is there any credible proof that his wife was ever a prostitute, or is this another claim of a fabulist? Nicmart (talk) 13:41, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

I was curious about that too. I checked. According to the ABC News source,

...McAfee’s wife Janice. He met her the day after our interview in Miami. She was a prostitute. He says he used that wad of cash to pay her for a day, and the night. A good time that lasted a long time. Four years already.

— Tracking down John McAfee, mysterious cybersecurity tycoon, Reporter's notebook
yes, she was.--FeralOink (talk) 02:51, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Living unarrested in Tennesse

As of 2020 McAfee was living in Tennessee, not arrested by the US authorities he had always claimed to be evading. Is there evidence that can square his fugitive and tax evasion claims with living freely in the US? Nicmart (talk) 14:36, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

He must have spent a fair amount of time in Tennessee since he was arrested there for DUI in 2015. Nicmart (talk) 14:40, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
Do you have reliable sources that he was living in Tennessee ? By August he was in Norway and October was arrested in Spain. -- Beardo (talk) 22:35, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Yes, we have reliable sources that he lived in Tennessee as of 2015. The article has local affiliate of a news source, a video, and a photo of him being booked for DUI and some other, not horrific, legal violation. It is all there in the article.--FeralOink (talk) 02:55, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Conspiracy theory and murder

Reliable sources are reporting the conspiracy theories about McAfee's death, from his past Tweets to QAnon. Here the Guardian explicitly mentions edits made by conspiracy theorists to the Wikipedia article, Conspiracy theorists have already seized on McAfee’s death, editing his Wikipedia page to state he was murdered. McAfee’s apparent suicide comes after he shared tweets about the poor conditions in prison, stating “there is much sorrow in prison, disguised as hostility”. The conspiracy theory is becoming part of the story and might be worthy of inclusion into the article. Solipsism 101 (talk) 23:10, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

 Done sorta, I mentioned it and will continue to discover citations :) Scaledish! Talkish? Statish. 01:05, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
I think it sets a poor precedent if editors can get allegations added to an article by vandalizing it until a reporter notices. 73.71.251.64 (talk) 01:09, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
While I agree it is unfortunate, per WP:POV we should report what is being said in publications. We have no room for deciding not to include something because we are worried about precedent Scaledish! Talkish? Statish. 01:41, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not compelled to include anything and everything that is published, and there is certainly "room" to omit original research from an article even after its insertion into that article has been noted in the press. 73.71.251.64 (talk) 02:59, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Reference 117, the link to the instagram Q post is just a link to the Instagram login page. I have been trying to clear it up by trying to archive the proper JohnMcAfee Instagram but it will not let me archive that page. Could the original poster of the link could please fix the reference with a proper archive please? I will keep trying CurrentlyResearching (talk) 02:07, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

thank you, its fixed CurrentlyResearching (talk) 02:13, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

October 2020 twitter post

he writes here that if he dies of an apparent suicide he would have played no part in it. --1.152.104.79 (talk) 01:20, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

 Already done Already addressed in the Death section. Scaledish! Talkish? Statish. 01:35, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
Please consider whether, in adding this material so eagerly, you are feeding a rumor mill. 73.71.251.64 (talk) 03:03, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
I don't think it's inherently feeding a rumor mill as you put it. Widespread denial over an official cause of death can be notable, and although we have to be even handed due to the sway Wikipedia holds, simply mentioning that such denial exists due to the actions and personality of the figure in question is not inherently wrong. Paragon Deku (talk) 03:24, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Please don't gratuitously remove the "in use" tag

I inserted the "in use" tag. It was removed by another editor within two minutes! I was having lots of edit conflicts so I used the tag. I have been editing the article for all of 30 minutes! I need five more minutes and then I will remove the "in use" tag per its stated use. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FeralOink (talk • contribs)

@FeralOink: Apologies, I believe I visited the page in the period while the In Use tag was removed and as a result made an edit without seeing it. Scaledish! Talkish? Statish. 01:07, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
@Scaledish: No problem! I finished my edits and removed the "in use" tag. Sorry if I seemed bitey. I had already had two edit conflicts so grumpiness set in. I'm done now.--FeralOink (talk) 01:33, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
No problem, have a nice night! Scaledish! Talkish? Statish. 01:36, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
It seems the "in use" tag was removed by someone who did not understand its significance. -- Beardo (talk) 04:21, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Spelling error in Death section

In the death section there is a spelling error

Change: "His death has sparked internet conspiracy theories in a manner resmbling "Epstein didn't kill himself"."

To: "His death has sparked internet conspiracy theories in a manner resembling "Epstein didn't kill himself"." CornishCyclist (talk) 09:47, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

 Done Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:10, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Conspiracy Theory Separation

Simply put I understand the need for the conspiracy theory allegations to be addressed in the wikipage, however, they should be kept separate from the facts related to his death.

The facts concerning the conspiracy theories are not facts about his death. DieSonneUnsLacht (talk) 06:25, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

But they are *about" his death. Linking conspiracy theories makes it pretty clear? Martinevans123 (talk) 10:13, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Date of birth

FreeBMD records the only McAfee birth in 1945 as being registered in the last quarter here: District = Forest of Dean, mother's name = Williams. Martinevans123 (talk) 07:28, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

  • Let's inspect the claims here more closely and analyze them in light of the sources cited plus FreeBMD.
    • Born on September 18, 1945: No source supports this specific date.
      • Chris Woodford's book contradicts it, saying he was born on an unspecified day in September 1946. It also says he graduated in 1967, which would make him 20 if he graduated in the summer. I think Americans normally graduate in the academic year they turn 22 so this would be highly unusual. I suspect 1946 is a mistake, and this also casts doubt on reliability of the 1967 date which is currently only supported by this source.
      • El Diario claims 1945 but nothing more specific.
      • The BMD record is for a registration in the third quarter of 1945; although September is in the third quarter, the registration may have happened a few weeks afterwards. Unfortunately, it doesn't connect to the subject at all beyond the name.
    • Born in Cinderford: None of the sources support this.
    • Born in the Forest of Dean: FreeBMD supports that someone of the same name was born there, but the birth date doesn't match that given by Chris Woodford's book, and there is no other connection to the subject. No other source mentions the Forest of Dean.
    • Born in Gloucestershire: Yahoo News supports this. However, this is suspected to be a circular reference.
    • Born on a US army base: The Hill supports this.
    • Born on a base of the 596th Ordnance Ammunition Company: None of the sources support such a specific claim.
    • Born to a US serviceman: The BBC and The Hill support this.
    • The serviceman was stationed at the mentioned base: This is a natural inference, but not directly supported by the sources; perhaps he was there temporarily. IMO it's an improper synthesis.
    • Born to an English woman: The BBC source supports this. This does not connect to the BMD record which only notes the mother's maiden name, not her nationality.
  • Without more, we can't conclude that he was born specifically in Cinderford, and I don't think the relevance of the BMD entry is established. Hairy Dude (talk) 12:30, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
I've added The Times as a source for place and date of birth. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:57, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Previous tweet concerning possible suicide

I feel like the following tweet should be added to the Article.

John McAfee Twitter
@officialmcafee

I am content in here. I have friends.

The food is good. All is well.

Know that if I hang myself, a la Epstein, it will be no fault of mine.

October 15, 2020[1]

Crockett623 (talk) 21:17, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

I think this, along with the other tweet (https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/1200864283766251521?s=19) should probably be added eventually, but only once there starts to be official statements or articles expressing doubts about his death. Until we have sources re:the suicide/murder debate, we can't really document it in the article. Ithinkiplaygames (talk) 21:46, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, not our place to speculate, nor is it for us to include tabloid speculation. If it's covered by reliable sources, then an argument could be made for inclusion (although it still might not be appropriate). Solipsism 101 (talk) 22:27, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
It seems like some crucial context, no? If someone publicly tweets "I'm not going to hang myself" on <date> and then they are found hanged on <date>, doesn't the tweet itself constitute the most useful reference for the former? Craig131 (talk) 22:45, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
We rely on reliable sources to analyse primary sources, per WP:OR. Some have actually mentioned the Whackd tweet as background to his legal issues and conflict with prosecution (suggesting it's politically motivated etc), for example, but none have analysed the tweets to suggest the method of death is wrong. It might be pertinent background, but placing it in the death section implies to the reader that we think the official account is wrong. Solipsism 101 (talk) 22:51, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
CNBC mentions the first tweet, The Verge mentions both tweets and points to them leading to conspiracy theories. --Yair rand (talk) 23:21, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for finding those. So we have sources. He clearly predicted his own death by hanging while in Spanish custody and I think it should be noted in the Death section that he was accurate in that prediction. Craig131 (talk) 23:51, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
However, I believe we just can't call it off as suicide or not, because one of his other tweets say that the US officials said that "We're coming for you, McAfee!" [10], so I think we can't really decide that it was clearly a suicide. The officials would definitely announce that it was a suicide, but we'll have to wait for more sources by other newspapers. I think before acting out, we should standby for the leaks, and the newspapers to report this. I think it wouldn't be a good idea if Wikipedia just posts the details without official investigation because it'll just ruin the reputation of Wikipedia.Jukki0522 (talk) 00:23, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
WP:BLP has been noted in template here at top of talk page, and I fwiw share opinion toward consensus that it applies. WP:BDP explicitly allows living persons treatment as "exception would be for people who have recently died" + "apply particularly to contentious or questionable material about the subject that has implications for their living relatives and friends, such as in the case of a possible suicide". I think all info in secondary sources does pass verifiability under WP:BLPPRIMARY, WP:BLPPUBLIC, but policy does allow due weight without false balance for denial by subject and treatment as allegation until proven, if covered by secondary sources (which I think protects Wikipedia's reputation). As such preemptive denial of alleged circumstances upon imprisonment might be appropriate to note in article introduction and in sections, as the primary tweet has been covered in secondary sources, notably El País[2]. Perhaps also note the secondary source El País's paraphrase, citing a Reuters interview, that his lawyer said it was suicide, giving a quote asserting reasons. --DougEMandy (talk) 15:27, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
Also see recent request answered that added semi-protection to article. --DougEMandy (talk) 15:53, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
"Know that if I hang myself, a la Epstein, it will be no fault of mine" sounds a little self-contradictory to me. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:59, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ @officialmcafee (October 15, 2020). "I am content in here. I have friends. The food is good. All is well. Know that if I hang myself, a la Epstein, it will be no fault of mine" (Tweet) – via Twitter.
  2. ^ Carranco, Rebeca (June 23, 2021). "El fundador del antivirus McAfee, John McAfee, se suicida en una prisión de Barcelona". El País. Ediciones El País, S.L. Retrieved 24 June 2021.

place of birth

Johns place of birth is Broadway worcestershire.. could someone please change this.. I am a family member so i do know this to be correct. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kotk1957 (talk • contribs) 10:41, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks User:Kotk1957. Unfortunately, "being a family member" is not considered to be a reliable source. If you could supply a good written source, in the public domain, this could be added. But your claim is at odds with the current source, which is The Times, here. Cinderford is also supported by the entry at FreeBMD (see "Date of birth" above). Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:53, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

McAfee doesn't endorse religious liberty

From the Political Positions section: 'McAfee advocates religious liberty, saying that business owners should be able to deny service in cases that contradict their religious beliefs, and, "No one is forcing you to buy anything or to choose one person over another. So why should I be forced to do anything if I am not harming you? It's my choice to sell, your choice to buy."' That's not an endorsement of religious liberty, that's an endorsement of state sponsored religious discrimination. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 51.37.196.253 (talk) 17:56, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

Well, that's how conservatives spin religious liberty: the freedom to impose your beliefs on others. It's not what the Founders had in mind, but it's now the official position of the Supreme Court so I guess it must be mainstream, even though it's a minority view and would have been considered fringe a couple of decades ago. Guy (help! - typo?) 13:00, 8 October 2020 (UTC)
No, it is NOT how conservatives "spin" religious liberty. Even if the customer doesn't like you, and you don't like the customer, the Colorado Civil Rights Commission told Christian bakers, "BAKE THE CAKE". The US Supreme Court reversed the decision in one instance, because of Colorado's "overt hostility to religious freedom". But that wasn't the end of it. The same bakers are still being ordered to bake cakes that they don't want to bake as of last week. I am unaware of the Founders having such coercion in mind, despite the comment prior to mine. In contrast, McAfee supported the religious freedom of Christian-, Muslim- and Jewish-owned bakeries, so they would NOT be coerced by The State to accept a special order to bake a wedding cake for a homosexual marriage, if they didn't want to. John McAfee's beliefs on this matter were not conservative, but rather, consistent with the US First Amendment.--FeralOink (talk) 18:02, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
Yeah, we had Nor'n Ir'n gay cake gate, here in UK, back in 2018. Not sure if McAfee weighed in on that one. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:16, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
Refraining from preventing something or not punishing something is not sponsorship. State sponsored discrimination would be when a state mandates or incentivizes discrimination, what you are referring to can be described as state tolerated discrimination.--2A01:4B00:867A:A800:88F2:3FEC:F781:FCBC (talk) 17:52, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
In general terms, I don't see that a (potential) customer has a right to demand anything of a private supplier/business, unless there's some kind of legally-binding contract in place. That's quite unconnected with the religion, ethnicity, gender identity or sexual orientation of either the customer or the supplier, i.e. "I bake the cakes I want to bake. If you don't like them, go elsewhere or bake your own". Perhaps this is old-fashioned and shamefully unwoke. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:02, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

"wanted for questioning on suspicion of murder"

The "on suspicion of murder" part doesn't appear in the source. While the Belize authorities might have had private suspicions, their public position was that they wanted to question him as a person of interest in the case. 73.71.251.64 (talk) 01:02, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

I came here to make a similar comment - but also that reference was beind a privacy declaration I wasn't prepared to proceed with. Please edit the point of substance raised above or do we need to raise a semi-protection request? Thanks94.126.214.30 (talk) 19:31, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

Cause of death in infobox

I believe the cause of death in the infobox should be changed to "Suspected suicide by hanging" rather than just "Suicide by hanging" as the cause of death has not been definitively determined. Additionally, I believe the source should be changed (see the death section for sources) to one that addresses cause of death in the text body rather than just in the headline. --2A01:4B00:867A:A800:88F2:3FEC:F781:FCBC (talk) 14:40, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, according to WP:DEATHS (which is more specific to article names though still useful) we wait for an official determination. A determination of the manner of death should be made by some official authority, such as a coroner, coroner's inquest, medical examiner or similar expert person or organization. Solipsism 101 (talk) 19:46, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
The NBC source given says plainly McAfee died of suicide, and attributes it to official sources. This isn't "just in the headline" as you claim: "John McAfee, the tech innovator whose name is synonymous with antivirus software, died by suicide on Wednesday hours after a court approved his extradition from Spain to face U.S. tax evasion charges, officials said." AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:41, 24 June 2021 (UTC)
RSs do say suicide in their own voice or attributed to the justice department officials, but this seems to flow from the provisional investigation from the justice department officials, not a coroner's (or similar) official report. Someone with more knowledge of the Spanish system might be able to comment on when the metho of death would be officially ruled. Solipsism 101 (talk) 00:17, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
That'd be us doing original research, in spite of what actual journalism says. We have a green RS at WP:RSP saying simply, with no ifs/ands/buts, that this was a suicide. How on earth is that not enough to verify? AllegedlyHuman (talk) 00:29, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
I am not arguing the merits of the policy; just that a somewhat (but not absolutely) relevant policy would suggest we wait for an official determination of the method of death. The reference by the ABC are, seemingly, from the justice department's press release, rather than a conclusive coroner's or medical examiner's official determination. It probably is pointless to wait to announce this as suicide given that a large number of sources say it in their own voice that it was. On WP:OR, as it applies to inquiring about the Spanish procedure, I do not believe it applies to talk page discussions. Solipsism 101 (talk) 01:48, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
What policy are you talking about? AllegedlyHuman (talk) 02:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
I don't see why NBC should be given more weight than for example AP that calls it an "apparent suicide" and other sources that only refer to it in quotation. When different sources make a claim with varying degrees of certainty based on the same primary information, it makes sense to use the source that is the most cautious, not the least. Also, I totally missed that NBC mentions suicide in the text body, sorry about that. 2A01:4B00:867A:A800:88F2:3FEC:F781:FCBC (talk) 17:41, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
Note: Reuters came out with "dies in Spain by suicide" here on 23 June. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:56, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
No, that's what his lawyer says. Reuters is not speaking in their own voice. The headline says: "Larger-than-life software mogul John McAfee dies in Spain by suicide, lawyer says". The text body says "British-born U.S. technology entrepreneur John McAfee died on Wednesday by suicide in a Barcelona prison after the Spanish high court authorised his extradition to the United States on tax evasion charges, his lawyer told Reuters". While his lawyer is probably a good authority on the subject, Reuters are just reporting on what they are being told. I would put them in the 'most cautious' category because they (as opposed to NBC and Wikipedia) cannot be said to have been wrong even if it turns out he did not die by suicide. Reuters is reporting the truth as long as his lawyer told them it was suicide, regardless of whether the lawyer is right or wrong. 2A01:4B00:867A:A800:8D36:3747:60D9:34EC (talk) 01:33, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
I had assumed that Reuters' headlines were written in their own voice. I'd also agree that McAfee's lawyer is a very good authority on the subject. Probably the best available, alongside the Catalan Justice Department which said "everything indicates he killed himself by hanging". Martinevans123 (talk) 08:00, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

The headline is Larger-than-life software mogul John McAfee dies in Spain by suicide, lawyer says. The headline is not in their voice and all claims int he body are linked explicitly to the lawyer. Others have it in their own voice, however, like the obit in The Times which says John McAfee, computer programmer and antivirus manufacturer, was born on September 18, 1945. He killed himself on June 23, 2021, aged 75. All this falls short of an official determination, unless that info has come out. Solipsism 101 (talk) 18:18, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

If this guy was Russian, Chinese or Venezuelan it would already be marked as "assassinated". But since he's American, it will remain at "suicide". Prinsgezinde (talk) 09:22, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
He's British-American. Or was anyway. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:13, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

$WACKD

What a cool tattoo- Michaelterryleary (talk) 09:28, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

$WHACKD Nov. 30, 2019 "Getting subtle messages from U.S. officials saying, in effect: 'We're coming for you McAfee! We're going to kill yourself'. I got a tattoo today just in case. If I suicide myself, I didn't. I was whackd. Check my right arm. $WHACKD available only at McAfeedex.com :)" Michaelterryleary (talk) 09:33, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Which source(s) were you suggesting in support of this addition? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:47, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

"McAfee didn't Epstein himself" listed at Redirects for discussion

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect McAfee didn't Epstein himself. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 July 2#McAfee didn't Epstein himself until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. – bradv🍁 06:49, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Spouses

Janice Dyson (Div. 2019)Alsacefrit (talk) 07:10, 11 December 2021 (UTC)

John McAfee Edits

I am a little confused about how to use this section. I uploaded an image of page 1 of the divorce documents of John McAfee / Janice Dyson McAfee.

John and Janice were divorced in 2019. All references to Janice Dyson McAfee being John's widow / wife at time of death are not factual and should be immediately removed and corrected.

John McAfee has only one biological child, a daughter. John had a vasectomy shortly after her birth and cannot possibly have other living children. I can provide photos of his only daughter as a toddler. All references to him having more than one child are not factual and are erroneous and was a rumor created by Janice Dyson. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KevinS10101 (talk • contribs)

Hi KevinS10101. What do you mean by "uploaded an image"? I don't see any of your edits other than the one made to post this comment. Regardless, please see WP:BLPPRIMARY: Do not use trial transcripts and other court records, or other public documents, to support assertions about a living person, so I don't think divorce documents would be usable in the first place. I also don't know what you mean by McAfee having multiple children being a "rumor created by Janice Dyson", as it's something McAfee himself claimed.[11][12] Also, please sign your talk page comments with four tildes ~~~~ so people know who left it. ‑‑Volteer1 (talk) 17:51, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

It is correct that John has only one biological child, a daughter and one granddaughter. His daughter is from his first marriage.Alsacefrit (talk) 07:19, 11 December 2021 (UTC)[1]

References

  1. ^ https://www.9news.com/article/news/investigations/john-mcafee-family-statement/73-e25430e7-17d8-493a-9d08-75146152412e

Children

John McAfee had one daughter, who was born from his first marriageAlsacefrit (talk) 07:39, 11 December 2021 (UTC)[1]

References

  1. ^ https://www.9news.com/article/news/investigations/john-mcafee-family-statement/73-e25430e7-17d8-493a-9d08-75146152412e
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