Talk:Juan Cuadrado

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Club[edit]

He still plays for Fiorentina for the moment - transfer gossip isn't a source for Wikipedia edits. Ruudboy (talk) 20:51, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 9 August 2014[edit]

201.190.18.117 (talk) 21:12, 9 August 2014 (UTC) FC Barcelona[reply]

 Not done Do you have any source? He will not be addded until new club has confirmed transfer. QED237 (talk) 21:37, 9 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 31 January 2015[edit]

chelsea

86.97.126.172 (talk) 10:14, 31 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  •  Not done - No reliable sources presented for the change, no proper explanation for the change, and he still hasn't officially signed yet. Lukeno94 (tell Luke off here) 10:48, 31 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 1 February 2015[edit]

182.65.62.134 (talk) 05:19, 1 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to update his club info. He plays for Chelsea now and not Fiorentina.

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Mlpearc (open channel) 05:45, 1 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 1 February 2015[edit]

He's at Chelsea now... ffs Hodzis23 (talk) 19:11, 1 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Well provide sources...... ffs. –Davey2010Talk 19:27, 1 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Cuadrado[edit]

Transfer fee believed to be in the region of £23.3 million

Done with BBC source. The previous source from Chelsea omitted the fee, which led the user to believe it was undisclosed '''tAD''' (talk) 19:00, 2 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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Effective date of Juventus deal in 2017[edit]

I don't want to dig into WP:OR on the loan to definite deal still require transfer window or not. But the interpretation of Italy international transfer window on 1 July and concluded Cuadrado's deal effective on 1 July , by some user, is a WP:OR. Matthew_hk tc 08:58, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Rcclh: Look like original research, but in article 103.2 and 103.3 of NOIF of Italian Football Federation, look likes any such loan with option/obligation to buy, much have a special player contract signed, that runs beyond the loan period, so, excising the option was just a flip on contractual level (in other hand, not excise the option automatically void the player contract by its own clause), but not the matter of transfer window open or not. If Juventus signed Cuadrado in a pure loan, it was bounded by transfer window, but the clause already inserted in player and transfer contract as well as documented originally at the start of loan period, it is WP:OR to say it still required transfer window and re-registered. Matthew_hk tc 09:42, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Registering with the federation is not really relevant. The permanent deal doesn't become effective until the transfer window opens. That's the whole point of a transfer window. Had Cuadrado not been on loan when they signed him on a permanent deal, would he then be able to play during the 2016-17 season? Of course not. He can only play because he is still technically on loan. Check out all the transfers on the list of players signing permanently whilst still on loan. Note that their infobox shows 0 appearances under their new club and the permanent signing is not in effect until the transfer window opens. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_football_transfers_summer_2017 --Rcclh (talk) 10:09, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It is not WP:OR to say that a permanent transfer cannot take place outside a transfer window. That is the definition of a transfer window. Which is a fact. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transfer_window --Rcclh (talk) 10:12, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Rcclh: the whole point it is not a pure loan. Italian Football Federation allowed that (and specific the excise of option BEFORE 1 July the day (international) transfer window open), with OBLIGATION or OPTION and a player contract with the new club that BEYOND the expected loan period. Or in other word, Italian transfer window open for such deal. Matthew_hk tc 10:26, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I am not disputing that the Italian federation may have allowed the option to be exercised before the window opens, and even registered the transfer, I am saying that the transfer doesn't come into effect until the window opens, otherwise that is breaking the rules and rendering the window invalid. The test is that if the player had not been on loan, would he be immediately available for selection in 2016-17, if a permanent transfer is registered in May. The answer has to be no, and therefore the only reason Cuadrado is available for selection is that he is technically on loan. --Rcclh (talk) 11:16, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Rcclh: he is not a new player. He already arrived Italy and already registered at FIGC in May 2017 before the international transfer window start. For other new signing or loan without option and obligation they need to wait the Italian transfer window open, but the case of Cuadrado i don't see any source support the deal is effective after the window open. The claim of effective date is certainly a WP:OR. Matthew_hk tc 11:27, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
or the claim such loan to definitive deal was registered by the FIGC already, still need to wait for transfer window to make the deal effective, is a WP:OR. Matthew_hk tc 11:51, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I have already said i am not disputing his registration, I am saying the transfer is not effective until the window starts, otherwise the window rules would be broken. It is only because he is already on loan that he is allowed to play. --Rcclh (talk) 14:18, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]


Look at all these players here. Look how many are permanent deals before the transfer window shuts. The deal is ratified but is not effective until the new season. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_football_transfers_summer_2017 Tom_Cleverley, Craig_Gardner, Christian_Atsu are examples. They all start with 0 in the new season even though the permanent transfer was made during their loan period. --Rcclh (talk) 14:21, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It is English window not Italian one. Matthew_hk tc 14:56, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

There is no difference. The transfer is ratified, but doesn't come into effect until the loan contract has completed. More evidence - Cuadrados signed a three-year-deal that finishes June 30th 2020. Hence it started July 1st 2017. --Rcclh (talk) 19:02, 4 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

English FA may ratified it on 1 July, but Italian FIGC ratified before that date. The whole thing was assume all deal effective on transfer window open as a MoS in wikipedia (However, English transfer window open in June not 1 July, so the whole assumption may wrong, despite no official match usually in June). Moreover, the press release only said he signed a contract in May that would last until 2020, not a single word to describe 3-year deal. ACQUISIZIONE DEFINITIVA DEL CALCIATORE JUAN CUADRADO
If assume end of loan, it should be 2019. ACCORDO CON IL CHELSEA FC PER L’ACQUISIZIONE DEL CALCIATORE JUAN CUADRADO Matthew_hk tc 09:01, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't say the English FA ratified it on 1 July, they ratify it immediately, the same as Italy, and it comes into effect on July 1 when the player's contract ends. Cuadrado's 3 year loan deal ends June 30. A permanent deal can't come into effect outside a transfer window. It's a three year deal [1] --Rcclh (talk) 09:44, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It still looping on the fact that you can't give out source for came into effective on 1 July/transfer window open (given it is not a normal loan, it is with conditional obligation) , just giving the MoS on English signing. Also, Juventus press release less accurate than dailymail? Even dailymail was argued in Footy Project, is that really reliable? Matthew_hk tc 10:00, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@Rcclh: Reading some case law in Court of Arbitration for Sport and FIFA regulation, it look WP:OR, but the international transfer window was only for a mechanism called "ITC (International Transfer Certificate)", which only the new football association that his new club belongs, receive this from the old football association, than he can play for his new club. For loan deal, the ITC must return to old association to inform the old association after the loan, to inform the old association the old contract re-activate, for permanent deal, the ITC only send once. For such conditional obligation loan, it just a flip on the switch on a clause of the transfer contract, so it doesn't need any transfer window to make the deal effective, the ITC did not return to old association, just documented in new association is enough. Since FIGC ratified in May and no source indicated Juventus specially chose 1 July nor FIGC chose to effective the transfer on 1 July, the MoS on English football just a original research invention. Matthew_hk tc 21:23, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

A conditional obligation makes no difference, all that means is that the club is obliged to purchase the player, it doesn't allow them to sign players outside the transfer window. It is not 'looping' on the fact i can't give a source because my source is the transfer window rules. If you buy a player, it can't come into effect until the transfer window starts otherwise there is no such thing as a transfer window. It is 'looping' on the fact that there is no evidence to suggest the loan contract was ripped up and a 3 year plus 1 month a few days contract was signed. There was simply no such thing, it was a three year contract. I wouldn't cite the Daily Mail for it's news content, but the sports journalism is no more or less reliable than any other newspaper. I don't understand your English for the rest of that. --Rcclh (talk) 23:35, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It is looping that the came into effect for such loan to definitive deal, i give you the FIGC regulation that such deal does not require transfer window, and you did not give me the actual The FA or FIFA link of the regulation, the exact clause of the "effective date", fresh new signing require transfer window, but such special loan does not. Matthew_hk tc 23:52, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
You can't even describe the actual mechanism of international transfer: the "ITC". Matthew_hk tc 23:55, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Rcclh: the loan in FIFA regulation mean temporary transfer of registration rights. It actually two transfer, loan and loan return. During loan period, the contract with mother club was "suspended", mean the new club is responsible for medical, wage and other compensation. For ITC, it is a document to indicate the player was transfer from one country's FA to another, so in normal loan, it returned. However, in loan to definite deal: instead of "loan, loan return and then definite deal", the practice was just not loan return and directly documented the transfer , so it doesn't need transfer window. In some case , just like Ricky Alvarez, the CAS ruled that even the new club did not offered the new contract for such obligation to buy, the transfer is done by activating the clauses. It does not require transfer window . Matthew_hk tc 08:13, 6 July 2017 (UTC) Matthew_hk tc 08:13, 6 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I think we've reached the point where we will have to agree to disagree. Usually when I encounter these type of arguments, my opponent is quite aggressive and arrogant, but refreshingly you have not once been rude or insulting so I will not revert any further edits you wish to make. Rcclh (talk) 14:31, 6 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It just a MoS set up by wikipedian for English football. It look consistent to have a common date to start with. Matthew_hk tc 14:48, 6 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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No longer playing for juventus now free agent[edit]

Juan cuadrado no longer play for Juventus and is now a free agent Ididsomething (talk) 17:40, 27 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Officially announced as a player for Inter Milan by their twitter account[edit]

I have now edited in that he plays for Serie A club Inter Milan. Rawsar6 (talk) 18:41, 27 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrect goals data[edit]

His goals data seems to dwindle that of the world's best strikers. 45.249.85.77 (talk) 07:40, 23 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Club is incorrect[edit]

Club Lecce shows as Fortnite Battle Pass 47.201.83.19 (talk) 18:25, 23 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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