Talk:Leinster Senior Football Championship

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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:06, 13 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

2010 championship - Meath vs Louth[edit]

Would the IP address associated with the recent edits to this article please refrain from inserting biased, inaccurate, unreferenced material into the article. What I have done so far is simply revert the content and even provided a link to show how the info being entered is invalid. This is an encyclopaedia, not a forum for spouting personal opinions. Whether or not you agree with the outcome has no place here. Suggesting the replay is likely is simply opinion if not backed up by references. However sportsnewsireland and RTÉ are both saying that replay unlikely. You may if you wish create a subheading regarding the final and describe the game pointing out the controversy but remember it must be referenced and NPOV. --MacTire02 (talk) 14:49, 13 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Also, as an aside, if the game is to be played again it will not strictly be a replay but a refixture, as replays are ONLY played when the first game ends in a draw. --MacTire02 (talk) 14:53, 13 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

One should at least mention the controversy instead of removing it completely as though there was none. ~ TheSun (talk) 15:22, 13 July 2010 (UTC) ~[reply]

Controversy was not removed. No-one at any point inserted any information regarding a controversy. An anonymous editor simply inserted incorrect, inaccurate details without providing any references to back it up. I do not write anything for the English language version of Wikipedia, instead I focus those energies on other wikipedia projects. However I do patrol this project for inaccuracies such as those inserted on this page. If the editor, who I already contacted but who failed to respond, wished to note the controversy, or had inserted a footnote beside the contentious piece which showed that there was an ongoing controversy surrounding the match I would have been fine with that, as long as it was referenced. Again I reiterate - this is an encyclopaedia, not a forum for discussing opinions on what should or should not be or for preempting decisions by sporting bodies without providing any reference. --MacTire02 (talk) 15:40, 13 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I have added a new section under the 2010 championship briefly outlining the final. More info is welcome on the topic, and references would be greatly appreciated. In case anyone jumps down my neck over what I have written, bear in mind this is the first piece I have written for this project (I usually write for other projects), and although I am from Meath and support Meath GAA, I do feel the game should have been replayed at the very least. --MacTire02 (talk) 11:57, 15 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The date for the Leinster Championship final is given as June 11th, when it should be July 11th. Needs fixing. ~ Tuath —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.46.200.76 (talk) 00:16, 16 July 2010 (UTC) [reply]

Move?[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was moved by Brocach. --BDD (talk) 18:23, 8 February 2013 (UTC) (non-admin closure)[reply]

Leinster GAA Senior Football Championship → Leinster Senior Football Championship –

  • Its actual name as shown on its page. A user moved it against consensus. 86.40.107.199 (talk) 22:12, 12 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • And a bunch of other controversials that were submitted before as uncontroversial:- Anthony Appleyard (talk) 09:09, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose To avoid problems with county-based GAA-units in Northern Ireland (where a name Derry is controversial, but Derry GAA seems acceptable) and to make clear that a GAA-county is not identical to a government-county. For instance: there is an official County Fingal, but there is no Fingal GAA (that is part of Dublin GAA. Beside that, the present official administrative regions of Northern Ireland are totally different from the present GAA-counties, who more or less follow the lines of the historic counties. The Banner talk 14:16, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
And regarding specifically to the Leinster move: the official name is [Leinster GAA]. Nothing more, nothing less. The Banner talk 14:20, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support: the competitions run by GAA counties and provinces are known as "county/province Senior Football Championship" (etc.), without "GAA" in the title, with a very small number of exceptions usually to do with coupling in the name of a sponsor. (While the Leinster page linked above shows an exception, many, many more pages on the Leinster GAA website give competition names in the usual format without "GAA", and it is best to be consistent for all counties and provinces.) Unless there is a possibility of confusion with some other Senior Football Championship in the same county or province, the long-established name should be used. The same applies in relation to Derry, where there is no need to add the "GAA" as there is no other entity organising competitions in football, hurling etc. with which any confusion might arise. There is nothing "controversial" about referring to Derry (Senior/Minor/Intermediate Football/Hurling/Camogie Championship/League) in the context of Derry GAA competitions, because that is and always has been the form used, without the insertion of GAA. All the competitions listed above, and others which were unilaterally and without discussion moved to pages with "GAA" inserted into the titles, should move back to their historic names. Brocach (talk) 17:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

a very small number of exceptions?? I don't think so: Clare GAA, Leitrim GAA], Mayo GAA, Rosscommon GAA, Sligo GAA, Wicklow GAA, Offaly GAA, Meath GAA, Longford GAA, Louth GAA, Laois GAA, [Kilkenny GAA, Kildare GAA, Carlow GAA, Down GAA, Fermanagh GAA, [Tyrone GAA, Derry GAA, Cavan GAA, Armagh GAA, Antrim GAA, Tipperary GAA and Limerick GAA. Your exceptions are Dublin GAA and GAA in Cork, both informal names of the County Board. (The other websites would not load, non-island counties not checked). So at least 23 GAA-counties bear a name of the type "county-name GAA". A small exception of 23 (at least) out of 32 GAA counties. And for the provincial councils: Connacht GAA, Leinster GAA, Munster GAA and Ulster GAA. All have a name of the type "province-name GAA". As the competitions are organised by the counties or provinces, the naming of the competitions should follow the name of the organiser. The Banner talk 18:49, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The issue is not whether the organising body is called Leinster GAA, Clare GAA, Derry GAA etc etc - of course they are. The issue is what the competitions are called. In Clare it's "Clare Senior Football Championship", in Derry it's "Derry Senior Football Championship" and so on. WP:COMMONNAME says that we title articles according to their common name. The name of the organising body sometimes appears in competition names, e.g. FIFA World Cup and sometimes doesn't, e.g. The Championships, Wimbledon which would otherwise be "The All England Lawn Tennis and Croquet Club Championships, Wimbledon". Brocach (talk) 19:24, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Did you check with the County Boards what the official name was? I don't think AIB Munster GAA Football Junior Club Championship will be a red herring or one of a few number of exceptions. The Banner talk 19:49, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
As I mentioned, there are exceptional cases where "GAA" is temporarily inserted into a competition name to go alongside the name of a commercial sponsor; in this case AIB. This ("AIB Munster GAA") is the formal legal name for the duration of the deal, and may appear on official GAA publications for so long as the sponsorship rolls in, but for all practical purposes - in the media, and as WP:COMMONNAME - that particular competition will remain the Munster Junior Club Football Championship, and we don't need to create new article title commemorating what is often short-lived business sponsorship of a competition that lasts for many years if not decades. Brocach (talk) 22:40, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Common name can be a red herring as well. Disambiguation is the bigger issue. Have a look at the debate on Category:Tipperary hurlers to see what other editors think. Laurel Lodged (talk) 20:28, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Disambiguation is not an issue at all given that neither the current administrative counties that share their name with GAA counties, nor the defunct administrative counties whose names are still used by GAA counties, organise sports competitions. Brocach (talk) 22:40, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Just stop it, my friend. The moves are controversial, if you like it or not. And as long as they are controversial, they should not be done at all. And you can scream loud and clear that mr. Lodged is the evil himself with his moves, no one will take that argument serious. And you can wave WP:COMMONNAME everywhere you like, as an argument it is rather flimsy. So please, stop with your loud WP:IDIDNOTHEARTHAT and come up with some real arguments. The Banner talk 23:45, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
At least we agree that the moves are controversial. This is a request to revert the moves. Brocach (talk) 00:09, 16 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
A revert is also a move, sir! So out of the question. The Banner talk 00:26, 16 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There is absolutely no need for the GAA in Leinsteir GAA Senior Football Championship. There can be no confusion with any other sports to use GAA to specify and the counties for the GAA are exactly thesame as the traditional 32 counties Finnegas (talk) 20:20, 17 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support proposed move of all articles back to their proper titles i.e. without the added "GAA". The name of the competition should be the title of the article. There is no need for disambiguation since there is no Leinster FAI or any other Senior Football Championship. The resulting redirects should also be speedily deleted, as nobody is ever going to type "Leinster GAA Senior Football Championship" into the search box. Scolaire (talk) 20:05, 20 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Completely agree with Scolaire and Brocach. Articles should be moved back to their actual titles.Finnegas (talk) 20:09, 20 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

OK, 9 days since proposal, looks to me like 4-1 for reverting those undiscussed moves. Brocach (talk) 22:30, 21 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support Articles aren't categories. No need for the DAB Gnevin (talk) 10:55, 22 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Just to get it on the record books. All these proposals should be scrapped pending the outcome of a larger arbitration at WT:GAA. Laurel Lodged (talk) 22:41, 31 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Everyone please note that there is one central discussion ongoing at WT:GAA in relation to the naming conventions for GAA articles. Please participate. Brocach (talk) 01:10, 1 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Use common name of competition[edit]

The actual name of this competition is Leinster Senior Football Championship. A move was effected without discussion. Please do not move it again to any other name without discussion and consensus. Brocach (talk) 12:22, 17 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

So you just press on and ignore the discussion above? The Banner talk 13:19, 17 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reverted and move protection requested this wider and related discussion is finished. The Banner talk 13:27, 17 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I think I know the reason for the sudden spate of re-namings. Brocach seems to have done it in a fit of pique that the CFD decision went against him. We now have Category:Tipperary GAA hurlers which he vigourously opposed with the same tired arguments. And he had the nerve to accuse me of disrutive behaviour. So it turns out that he's the disruptive one and his arguments just don't stack up. What to do with him now? Some disciplinary action seems to be unavoidable. Laurel Lodged (talk) 22:13, 17 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Four to one is good enough for me. The move, made by Laurel Lodged without discussion, is reverted. Brocach (talk) 00:12, 22 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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