Talk:List of World War I flying aces from the Russian Empire

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Special thanks[edit]

The compiling of this list would not have been possible without the translations, cerebrations, and corrections of EugeneZelenko, as can be seen below.

Georgejdorner (talk) 03:07, 9 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Notes[edit]

I don't think that nation have sense, since all of them was born in Russian Empire. Actually, all reference to modern states should be referred as present day. Related articles should be fixed too. Also at the time of Russian Empire major subdivisions were Governorate, Oblast appeared after revolution. --EugeneZelenko (talk) 13:50, 4 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Probably links to Russian articles should be removed too. Only names in lang-ru will remains. May be order of last/first names should be same as in English, so you'll need to move everything before comma (last name) to the end. For people of other nationalities, like Pulpe, Leman will be good idea to add names on native language, but I don't know it :-( --EugeneZelenko (talk) 14:02, 4 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

List of revisions:

Deleted links to Russian WP from list.

Placed Russian names in same order as English names: first, middle, last name.

Linked Russian names to English WP articles.

Dealt with the "oblast problem".

Filled in name of nations in every case possible.

Added explanatory lead, so that readers realize that aces' national origins are expressed in today's geography.

Remaining problems:

Where is Dambovka? Is Polish Russia the same as Poland?

Also, why not dub in Russian names for Leman, Pulpe, etc.? They were in Russian service, after all.

Georgejdorner (talk) 02:13, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I still think that Nation column is useless. It may mean present day location of place of birth, but not nationality of person.

I was not able to find current Dambovka location.

I meant other language in addition to Russian. Makeenok, for example was Pole. I guess, Leman was German.

EugeneZelenko (talk) 14:38, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The "Nation" column is disappointing; I hoped that, even as the "Nation" column of the List of World War I flying aces from Austria-Hungary showed the varied origins of the A-H aces, this column of this list would show the ethnic diversity of the Imperial Russian Air Service. Do you have suggestions on how to show the ethnic identity of these aces?

I know you meant that Leman, Makeenok, etc were non-Russian, and that they probably spelled their names in their native language. I thought that their names might be dubbed in Russian anyhow, on the grounds that they served in the IRAS. However, I will honor whatever decision you make on this matter.

I will begin reading through the biographies linked to the list in progress, with an eye toward adding significant information to the Notes column. In the meantime, do you have any suggestions for further improving this list?

I believe we have a good start on this list. It would not have been possible without your help. Thank you.

Georgejdorner (talk) 19:53, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it's easy to claim nationalities of people. Will be good idea to do so according to reliable printed source. Internet is full of words dog fights over this matters :-( --EugeneZelenko (talk) 13:54, 6 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I do believe you are correct. I find it disappointing that I cannot find the reliable printed sources needed. I will either eliminate the Birthplace and Nation columns, or retitle them and use them for some other information, rather than start a flame war. Can you think of another use for those columns?

Georgejdorner (talk) 16:43, 6 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I think place of birth is not controversial, but nations is definitely may be :-) I think it's fine to leave place of birth column. --EugeneZelenko (talk) 13:58, 7 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]