Talk:Love/Hate (The-Dream album)

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Genre[edit]

Hip-Hop I would say is part of the genre of this album --Louis Taylor (talk) 03:03, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hip hop music is defined by rapping, DJing, sampling, scratching and beatboxing, none of which r on the album, w/exception of first track w/a rap. It is not a primary/prominant genre of the album. Dan56 (talk) 04:32, 21 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not really, some songs The-Dream raps, e.g she needs my love and ditch that, but its defenatly an urban album--Louis Taylor (talk) 23:12, 26 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

He slows down his singing into a slow spoken word style on those two songs, but singing is prominant and those are only two songs w/minimal sung rhythmic style raps. So, the first track is the one hip/R&B song, while some others contain minimal hip hop elements. According to the wikipedia article, Contemporary R&B draws on hip hop elements such as flow and beats, similar to the album, but it is still R&B. "Urban" constitutes a radio format, which plays hiphop, dance, R&B-oriented music that is popular in urban areas. Dan56 (talk) 23:54, 26 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Im pretty sure he sampled somthing on a few tracks--Louis Taylor (talk) 21:38, 12 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Pretty sure? Can u cite that? Regardless, it is not primary, and whatever its influence or incorporation on the album is, that is covered by "R&B" as in the previous paragraph on this discussion. Dan56 (talk) 21:58, 12 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The song structure/composition on the album is pop and R&B, as is its sound. Critics of the album have acknowledged it as R&B/pop as well. Dan56 (talk) 17:50, 20 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Love Hate = correct title[edit]

This is not an arguable issue, the facts are clearly in place. See his OFFICIAL MySpace and his OFFICIAL Def Jam page and it clearly says LOVE HATE... Even Amazon uses the title (conjoining the two).

MySpace here
Def Jam here
Amazon here (uses the words altogether, but still says Love Hate nevertheless)

If the reverts continue, you will be reported for vandalism. The title was originally Love Me All Summer, Hate Me All Winter, but was obviously changed due to length and because it's the general meaning behind the title (hence why it appears on the cover but LOVE HATE are the large words...). --Ayoleftyz (talk) 21:12, 20 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The page should stay at the title Love Hate. There are many reliable sources shown above which clearly show that this is the correct title. If anybody is going to move this page they must have a valid reason, backed up by reliable sources, before doing so. --¤ The-G-Unit-฿oss ¤ 22:36, 20 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I would suggest that both of you try to establish a consensus here about what link should be displayed rather than continually reverting each others edits. Maybe you should both take a break from editing this article? Thanks --¤ The-G-Unit-฿oss ¤ 16:14, 22 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sales[edit]

Is that all, I though hw would of moved way more than that! I was thinking that he would of at least got in the top twenty or even top 10. Trimy67 (talk) 00:10, 20 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Love/Hate (The-Dream album)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Wetrorave (talk · contribs) 16:34, 29 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]


From a quick look, here's my opinion:

Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Infobox and lead[edit]

  • Image nees |alt= text – NFCC seems fine
    • Okay
  • A possibly better way to summarize The Dream's roles: "American singer, songwriter, and producer" > "American musician"[a]
    • Okay
  • "is the debut album by" – remove album wikilink
    • It should stay as a contextual link to an elementary topic of this article (MOS:CONTEXTLINK).
  • "producer The-Dream. It was released" > "producer The-Dream, released"
    • I don't find this kind of construction the most sophisticated grammatically.
  • "2007, during his" > "2007. With his"
  • "pop music. [line break] The-Dream pursued" > "pop music, The-Dream pursued" (without the line break)
    • That would change the meaning of the sentence by directly connecting his emergence to his musical direction for the album. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Love/Hate, drawing" > "Love/Hate. The album drew"
    • The word works best as an adverb referring to The-Dream and his direction, rather than the album itself, which is more a product of the direction and inspirations than an acting agent. isento (talk) 20:11, 29 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "native Atlanta. Recording" > "native Atlanta. [line break] Recording"
  • "Recording alongside fellow songwriter-producers Tricky Stewart and Carlos McKinney, he employed" > "Recorded alongside fellow songwriter-producers Tricky Stewart and Carlos McKinney, the album employs"
  • For info on critical reception, add this before the first sentence of the third paragraph:

Background[edit]

  • "As The-Dream recalls, "I called [Island Def Jam executive] Karen Kwak and I told her I wanted to [...] shit. I figured" > "The-Dream stated he remembers calling Island Def Jam executive Karen Kwak and telling her he "wanted to [...] shit." The-Dream said: "I figured"
    • I've paraphrased much of it instead. "Stated" means to say something clearly and definitely, which phrases like "artist shit" and "figured" do not. isento (talk) 00:59, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Writing and recording[edit]

  • "and McKinney[4] – were [...] Angeles.[5]" > "and McKinney – were [...] Angeles.[4][5]"
    • WP:CITEFOOT says to place the citation after the adjacent punctuation and close to the material it is supporting. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "approach[6] and wrote some of its songs responding" > "approach,[6] writing some of its songs as a response"
    • I've split the clauses into two sentences. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "life, most notably "Nikki", which was inspired" > "life. An example is "Nikki", a track inspired"
    • Apparently, whoever added that sentence in the past misused the source. So I've replaced it with something more faithful to the source. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "from past artists" > "from artists" – past is redundant, since there's no way someone can be influenced by a future artist[b]
    • Well, there is also the present, and the sentence mentions "contemporary", so I believe the "past" distinction is still useful. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "elements,[4] as the" > "elements.[4] The" for the sentence not be too large
    • I've replaced the period with a semicolon, so the connection remains. isento (talk) 02:07, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "resolutely luminescent" with" > "resolutely luminescent", with" for readers to have a pause on this sentence

Title and packaging[edit]

  • Change to Title and album cover
  • Make this section a level 3 header since it's three/four lines long
    • I would prefer to keep as is. As a subsection, it wouldn't belong under any of the other sections, topically. Perhaps I will expand it in the future, actually. isento (talk) 02:17, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Actually, it can work also if merged into marketing and sales. isento (talk) 04:03, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Marketing and sales[edit]

  • "Around the time of "Bed"'s release," > "Near the release of "Bed","
    • Near is defined primarily as proximity, i.e. physical distance, so I think the current phrasing makes it clearer that we are defining a period of time. isento (talk) 02:21, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Critical reception[edit]

  • Ref 25 redirects to Vibe's news page; use this
  • "year" because of The-Dream's ability to write catchy songs." > "year",opining that The-Dream is a skilled songwriter."
    • Well, the critic specifies it's his "tune-sense", tune meaning melody or melodic song, so I've revised it to "The-Dream's instinct for composing melodies". isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Some reviewers had reservations." – this is a very vague statement; what reservations did they have, and why?
    • It's merely a summary and no more or less vague than the album having received acclaim. The subsequent sentences elucidate those reservations. isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "remained impressed by the consistent quality" > "opined that the album has consistent quality"
    • I don't want to get too wordy here. I'll just remove "consistent", since that was the only problematic element in stating what she "remained impressed by" as fact. isento (talk) 02:27, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Legacy and influence[edit]

  • Endash with other dash might be confusing, so "the West–Jay-Z song" > "West's collaboration with Jay-Z"
    • That would complicate the remaining structure of the sentence and make a long one even longer. MOS:ENBETWEEN says the dash can be used this way for compound constructions indicating "and". isento (talk) 02:46, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "proved highly innovative" > "is considered highly innovative"
    • The Pitchfork source, cited at the end of the second sentence, verifies it this. And writing "considered ..." without attribution would be weasel-y. There's no reason to doubt the veracity of this statement, with other sources verifying it too ([1]). isento (talk) 02:46, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Also, phrasing it in the past tense suits the narrative tone of the section, as events happening after the album. isento (talk) 03:57, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Track listing[edit]

Personnel[edit]

Charts[edit]

  • Seems fine

Certifications[edit]

  • Change to Certification since it's only one

See also[edit]

  • Fine

References[edit]

  • Cite SOHH as |website= or |work= on ref 3
  • Use Cite AV media notes rather than Cite web for ref 5, since it seems the intent is to cite the liner notes
  • Ref 10 is |url-access=limited and not paid, since the NYT does give you some free articles

Further reading/External links[edit]

  • Fine

Overall[edit]

  •  On hold for now; I may not be able to respond in the following hours though. Wetrorave (talk) 16:34, 29 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thanks. I'll get thru the rest later though. isento (talk) 20:12, 29 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • You seem to have addressed all the issues. The ones you didn't seem fine, since there is a stated reason for not doing each one of them.[c] I'm still not entirely happy with the article not having a combination of the artist's name with the release date separated only by a comma, like other articles do, but 'brilliant' prose is not a requirement of GA so it's not necessary.

In conclusion, this article is good to go: ✓ Pass. Wetrorave (talk) 12:52, 1 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  1. ^ This would also reduce mentions of "songwriter-producer", a term that is mentioned at "prominent songwriter-producer"
  2. ^ Except if you have a time machine, as I do
  3. ^ Although relatively advanced, I'm not a native English speaker, which probably makes you more qualified to work on the prose than I do. I still think I'm doing reasonably well on the English Wikipedia with my work on the album portraying the stages of dementia but it's still imperfect.
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