Talk:Marcell Jacobs

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No more than one month in the US[edit]

as declared by his mother to newspapers several times, after his father was assigned in South Korea.--Arorae (talk) 16:23, 1 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Jacobs did not acquire Italian citizenship until 2010[edit]

This claim seems to be wrong. Children born in Italy from two foreign parents can acquire the Italian citizenship only as young adults. However, Marcell as a son of an Italian mother was eligible by birth and being living in Italy from an early age should have definitely received the citizenship earlier (if not at birth if, as it is usually the case, the birth had been communicated to the Italian consulate). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.218.233.211 (talk • contribs) 04:27, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

He was born in the U.S., not Italy. The source here states that he "did not acquire Italian citizenship until 2010...". So, we should accept it unless and until there is a reliable source stating otherwise. Ghmyrtle (talk) 07:06, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

He was born in the U.S., so he is automatically American by birth (ius soli), by an Italian mother, so he is automatically also Italian by birth (ius sanguinis). Following his victory, there has been a great debate in Italy because, hadn't his mother being Italian, despite having grown up in Italy since he was one-month-old, under current Italian Nationality Law, he wouldn't had been eligible for automatic citizenship at the age of consent (18 years) being born abroad. He should have had to apply for the normal naturalization process, that can be started only once 18-yrs-old.

Here is one of many italian articles on the subject:

https://www.avvenire.it/opinioni/pagine/la-cittadinanza-sportiva-un-interesse-nazionale

In 2010 Marcell Jacobs was only 15-16 yo. So he could not have "become" italian in any way. The "2010" date is not reported in any italian newspaper or offical website. It had probably wrongly inferred by the journalist. Jacobs stated in an Italian interview that "Per quanto riguarda la cittadinanza americana in realtà mi è scaduta nel 2015 e non l’ho più rinnovata" ("As far as I am concerned, my American citizenship expired in 2015 and I didn't renew it anymore").

https://www.sportmediaset.mediaset.it/sprintnews/road-to-tokyo-marcell-jacobs_29609469-202102k.shtml

Any American knows that the "US Citizenship" doesn't "expire" and you don't have to "renew" it. The Passport does, and correctly Wikipedia is reporting the implied meaning, not the literal meaning of Jacobs' words. As far as we know, he never formally relinquished his US Citizenship and it has never being revoked (e.g. for having joined a foreign military corp. Jacobs is an Italian Policeman, but he never joined the Italian Army).

Probably the journalist wrongly inferred that he was not "able" to renew his passport in 2015, because he acquired the Italian nationality. Since a US passport for someone younger that 16yo lasts 5 years, he "inferred" Jacobs became Italian in 2010. As far as we know, instead, he still has a dual citizenship, despite currently holding only the Italian passport.

I did not imply that he was born in Italy. My point was exactly the opposite: where he was born does not play any role in the Italian citizenship law which is based on the ius saguinis and not the ius soli (see the link). Why would anybody living in Italy who is eligible for Italian citizenship (as a son of an Italian mother) do not apply for Italian citizenship for 16 years? Although the claim seemed absurd to me, out of curiosity I spend some time to research it but did not find any reference (in Italian or English) about Jacobs acquiring the Italian citizenship later in life outside the random online Journal cited here.

The claim that he did not acquire Italian citizenship until 2010 is clearly wrong. The Italian law is clear: anyone born to an Italian parent (mother or father) is automatically Italian. Italian law also allows double citizenship. So, by Italian law, Jacobs was Italian at birth. 158.143.74.184 (talk) 10:12, 3 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@158.143.74.184: Agreed, and your point has been verified. The article was amended to accurately reflect the facts surrounding his citizenship.Justbean (talk) 20:40, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Records[edit]

Should we write every record he had? In such case we should write about his 9.95 Italian record, 9.84 European record and multiple 4x100 records. Right now only the latest one are considered. I reckon this conflicts with the specification "current holder". 5.170.224.165 (talk) 16:29, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@5.170.224.165: Jacobs' records (those that he set and that he currently holds) are recorded/denoted in the "Statistics" section. Adding another section would merely be redundant to what is already on the page.Justbean (talk) 20:44, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Records section needed[edit]

The broken records section is a fundamental piece of information which right now is hidden under the statistics table. The reading of this info is therefore not immediate and unintuitive. Is ask for the immediate reinstatement of the records section. 5.170.225.252 (talk) 18:05, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Jacobs' quote[edit]

As per WP:RCD I am opening a section on Jacobs' quote, keeps being reverted by @Justbean:. Afaics, the quote was added in this edit here (1st of August). In Italian it reads: «Di americano ho solo le fibre muscolari, mi sento italiano al 100%». My (I am native Italian speaker) translation to English would be "Only my muscle fibers are american, I feel 100% Italian" (let me stress that this is 'not' a correct translation).

Now, consulting WP:QUOTE ("General guidelines" especially) I feel it is a fair and informative quote: it comes from a reliable source ('La Stampa' interview), it is correctly translated and most importantly 'is representative of the whole source document' (in this case, the question was on how Jacobs self identifies).

For these reasons I would add it back again. My opinion is that is would be appropriate as an inline quote (as opposed to blockquote as now). Ffaffff (talk) 19:46, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Ffaffff:I am the editor who contributed the quote in the first place. I agree with you...it is an informative quote. However, other users disagree and it has resulted in an edit war. In addition, omitting the quote does not take away from the context of the paragraph. So, while the quote adds additional context to the point of the previous sentence, it is not crucial to the sentence's understanding, nor is it worth any edit war. My last point...I was not reverting it. I was the one maintaining it. However, I got tired of being in an edit war with other editors who kept changing it or omitting it. Therefore, in the best interest of the page, and of all editors, I opted to omit the quote which I actually contributed.

To be clear, the "italiano al 100%" quote was not the full quote. I contributed the full quote on Aug. 5 here. Fourteen minutes later, it was given a more accurate translation here by @Arorae:. This lead to ongoing edit wars over the subsequent three days, to me maintaining it across several warring edits, and ultimately to me striking it after determining that its cost seemed to be outweighing its benefit.Justbean (talk) 20:33, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent, I will wait the other editors to voice their opinion here for a bit then. Ffaffff (talk) 22:32, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The athlete's sudden popularity led to too much confusion in the article[edit]

I created the article year ago and kept it until before the Olympics following the rules of Wikipedia:WikiProject Athletics and the Wikipedia:WikiProject Athletics/Manual of Style/Biographies. Now I will arrange the voice step by step according to the MOS of the project and detailing every single change in the "edit summary" of the article after each modification. But I'll go into more detail on my edits, explaining its, in this section. --Kasper2006 (talk) 21:40, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In the MOS first goes the biography section (which eventually includes the career section) and then the statistics section. --Kasper2006 (talk) 21:48, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
World, European and National records need a specific section in the Statistics section. --Kasper2006 (talk) 21:55, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Also national titles need a specific section in the Statistics section. --Kasper2006 (talk) 21:57, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Add Others international meetings section (why national meetings and not Diamond League?) --Kasper2006 (talk) 22:05, 8 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Some updating of basic information needed[edit]

I don't follow "athletics", and have no expertise in the field, so I'm reluctant to engage half-informed in the sort of amateur editing that Wikipedia is infamous for. But even I notice that a few things are very much out of date. Jacobs now lives in Florida, he trains with Tumbleweed Track Club, and his coach is Rana Reider. There may be some other things that need updating, too. Barefoot through the chollas (talk) 20:18, 7 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]