Talk:Miss May I

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Metal

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Sources??[edit]

If someone could provide sources to this article, as well as any additional information, it would be greatly apprecitated. GaudiumInVeritate (talk) 18:36, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've already added the single citation tag. I don't think this post was necessary, Gaudium.--Krazycev 13 19:57, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, but it certainly doesn't hurt. Some people don't read all those pretty banners lol. GaudiumInVeritate (talk) 20:16, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think I added something, do let me know if this is okay. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by Atagat (talk • contribs) 11:00, 8 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Genre[edit]

Really well written. Only one thing, "melodic hardcore" isn't really the type of genre they play. I'm not one of those genre sticklers who want's to split hairs, but melodic hardcore is a old school style of hardcore with punk influences with hardly or no metal elements to it at all. Examples of what I mean is like Set Your Goals, Wilhelm Scream, Comeback Kid, Sinking Ships etc, and fans of that music usually get pretty peeved when people label anything metal-ish and outside of that spectrum as melodic hardcore. Miss May I play a blend of deathcore and post-hardcore. The deathcore elements are the breakdowns, rapid tempos, lower tuning, low growls and the signature harmonized guitar riffs that have that "spooky" sort of sound to them. What's odd but also fresh about MMI is that usually with that type of song style going on you'd have the cliche BREE BREE ERRR REE, pig squeal deathcore vocals but they opted to go a different route and use the higher up screams and wails found in screamo/post-hardcore bands. They're myspace videos and page state this somewhere, but they change the layout like every 4 days so it's hard to pin down, they also have alot of interviews online and in magazines like Revolver and whatnot where they get asked about their unique sound and they describe it pretty close to such. Also, they just toured all summer long with assorted popular screamo/post-hardcore bands and are sort of marketed to that crowd. Lately they've been touring with aloooott of deathcore bands. The bassist used to be in the deathcore band Rose Funeral and you can find alot of elements from that in the music. If you want to double check you can just search "melodic hardcore" on sites like last.fm or pandora and you'll see what I mean by saying its pretty different from MMI's sound, and the wikipedia page for melodic hardcore even has a list of bands that aren't really in the same ballpark as this bands sound. Anyways, just giving a heads up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.170.129.95 (talk) 06:03, 4 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This is the best genre for the band! Metalcore combining a little bit of Post-Hardcore and Deathcore (Clean voice and Death Growls) And trash is consider a Deathcore with the past tempo of this type! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.54.29.86 (talk) 12:19, 7 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, the genre is more like Deathcore, Metalcore and post-hardcore, they have more incommon with those genres than Trash metal and Death metal, and they do not possess any qualities that Melodic hardcore bands do. —Preceding unsigned comment added by GreeleyE (talk • contribs) 23:05, 14 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Genre is Metalcore, It incorporates elements of extreme metal, such as Death Metal, Black Metal, Heavy Metal, Etc. with Hardcore Punk elements. Metalcore has breakdowns and clean vocals, and usually screaming, high and low. The genre is Metalcore, not Deathcore, or Post-Hardcore. - AtheistFish. —Preceding unsigned comment added by AtheistFish (talk • contribs) 02:09, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry guys, but our genres on Wikipedia are based on reliable sources, not personal speculation. Saying that they are not deathcore because they don't "bree" doesn't mean that a notable website (i.e. guardian.co.uk, Buddyhead, etc.) agrees, and if they label the band as deathcore, they will be considered deathcore. --ҚЯĀŽΨÇÉV13 20:21, 21 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think you people get it, Metalcore is a genre that incorporates mixes of Extreme Metal music and Hardcore Punk music, where-as Deathcore is a mixture of Metalcore and Death Metal music. They play under the genre Metalcore as they use these blends, such as screamed and clean vocals, added in with a sound that is a fusion of Hardcore Punk and Metal. I don't know where the genre Melodic Hardcore came in on this page, but it's wrong, I don't care if a website says it's that, IT ISN'T TRUE!--AtheistFish (talk) 05:16, 15 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Writing about music is like dancing about architecture - Martin Mull

The point being, look. It's not really possible to categorize a band. We categorize a thing to try to get a handle on what it is, to fit the entity in a framework that makes sense to us. But such categorizations are inherently falsifications of reality. The only reality is the music.

And even if you accept the necessity of genre categorization, how do you do that?. A band may change category, not only between albums, but between songs, and at any moment within a song.

However. We have to try. That is what we do at the Wikipedia, try to help our readers make sense of an amorphous reality. We may fail, but we do try.

OK, so how to categorize this band by genre? Our best bet is to see what other wise people have said. See WP:TRUTH for a discussion of why we don't substitute our own experience for this, even if our conclusion is in fact more accurate. Frustrating sometimes, but that is the way the Wikipedia works and has to work.

Looking at the all of the references given in the article, I find:

Allmusic says they are in the "Contemporary Pop/Rock" and "Heavy Metal" and "Speed Metal" genres.
IndieStar says it's a "hardcore/metal band".
last.fm says it's a "metalcore band".
Spirit of Metal has them in the "metalcore" category.
Metal Underground lists them here in a list of "metal acts"..
Sputnik describes them as a "metalcore band".
(The picture posted at Topix says thay are a "metalcore band", but this is just the opinion of the individual poster and so not a reliable source.)
Billboard does not categorize them.
SouthSonic does not categorize them.

So, what do we have? Allmusic is the most respected source here, and they are an outlier, giving three categories that are listed nowhere else. Well, "Contemporary Pop/Rock" (sounds like a category that could include Bread) is probably a master category to differentiate them from say Jazz or Classical artists. So then you have "speed metal" and "heavy metal". You have to respect Allmusic, but they might have their own idiosyncratic methods and may not be on top of every current detail of genres. So since they're an outlier, let's let them go for now.

So then you have three other sources describing them as "metalcore" except for one giving "hardcore/metal" (which I guess is just another way of saying "metalcore") and one giving just "metal". So all in all I would say: we have a winner, and it is... metalcore.

If an editor can find other reliable sources (reliable per WP:RS) giving a different genre, then we can talk. Otherwise I think we should leave them as metalcore. Herostratus (talk) 18:07, 7 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Uh, OK, another editor (or editors) is insisting on including this in the body of the article:

<[[thrash metal]]<ref>{{cite web|last=Shumate|first=Neil|title=Interview: Miss May I lead vocalist, Levi|url=http://www.ootb646.com/national_inter/missmayi.html|publisher=OOTB Publications|accessdate=13 June 2012|quote=The perseverance of Northeastern Ohio’s young thrash metal band Miss May I continues to land them success.}}</ref>

Well here are the problems that I see with this:

Well, first of all, we do not under any conditions write "[I]t stays. Your opinion against it is invalid" in the body of an article, period. It wouldn't really be appropriate for a talk page, but the body of an article? No way.
The source is a website called "Out Of The Blue" which describes itself as "By the fans, for the fans". It's an interview (with a band member) by a Niel Shumate. Shumate is not a professional music critic. Besides running the fan site, he manages a restaurant. Normally this would not be a reliable source (It's Shumate (not the band member) who describes them as a thrash metal band -- and not in detail, just making the statement).

However, you know, it's hard to get good refs for D-list bands, so enh. Shumate is probably up on this stuff. Although "thrash metal" is just his personal opinion, and apparently other editors above have disputed this. That Shumate has a website doesn't necessarily make him more knowledgeable than any other fan. But the band member describes As I Lay Dying as their favorite band, and As I Lay Dying is described as thrash metal (among other genres) in their article. So enh I suppose it's possibly not completely inaccurate, so I left it in. I don't actually much care and if another editor disputes this we can discuss this further. But please, no more with the "your opinion is invalid" stuff. Herostratus (talk) 04:37, 19 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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