Talk:No Time to Die (song)

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"First Bond theme to be recorded in a bedroom studio"[edit]

Worth noting?

---Another Believer (Talk) 19:37, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It's trivia. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 19:55, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Mclarenfan17, The recording location? Gosh, we're on different wavelengths today. ---Another Believer (Talk) 19:56, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
How does recording the song in a bedroom affect the song in any way? As far as I can tell, this is just a mildly-interesting fact that has more place being on a Trivial Pursuit card than an encyclopaedia, at least until there is some actual content here. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 20:01, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Mclarenfan17, Again, agree to disagree. The infobox has a field for recording location, which to me suggest this is generally detail worth adding. Also, care to respond to my last question in the top section above? ---Another Believer (Talk) 20:02, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
You cited People magazine as a source. That's barely any better than The Daily Mail. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 20:05, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Mclarenfan17, What are you talking about? I provided an ABC Online URL above. ---Another Believer (Talk) 20:06, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You said "last question in the top section above".

As for the Triple J article (the ABC one), it does not do enough to estsblish the name of the song. All those quoted refer to "the title theme/song". Mclarenfan17 (talk) 20:12, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The green-colored text suggest otherwise. I'm going to let other editors take over from here, thanks. ---Another Believer (Talk) 20:15, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, it doesn't do that at all. This is what Eilish says:
"It feels crazy to be a part of this in every way. To be able to score the theme song to a film that is part of such a legendary series is a huge honour. James Bond is the coolest film franchise ever to exist. I’m still in shock."
This is what Finneas says:
"Writing the theme song for a Bond film is something we’ve been dreaming about doing our entire lives. There is no more iconic pairing of music and cinema than the likes of Goldfinger and Live And Let Die. We feel so so lucky to play a small role in such a legendary franchise, long live 007."
And this is what Fukunaga says:
"There are a chosen few who record a Bond theme. I am a huge fan of Billie and Finneas. Their creative integrity and talent are second to none and I cannot wait for audiences to hear what they’ve brought – a fresh new perspective whose vocals will echo for generations to come."
So, where is the evidence that the song is called "No Time to Die"? The author of the article asserts it, but provides absolutely no evidence to support it. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 20:42, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Here. ---Another Believer (Talk) 16:46, 13 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Publicojunk[edit]

I've cut parts of the article because they're little more than what I call "publicojunk"—the usual guff that gets churned out to promote something, but is pretty thin on content. Consider the following extract:

Following the song's announcement, Eilish said writing the song was "a huge honor". Her brother added that they "feel so so lucky to play a small role in such a legendary franchise".

What does this actually tell us about the song? Not much. Sure, they appreciate the opportunity and recognise its significance, but consider the following extract from the "Writing's on the Wall" article:

[Smith] described performing the theme as "one of the highlights of my career".

Remove the names and they're pretty interchangeable. This isn't encyclopaedic content—maybe it has its place when the article is fleshed out, but we know nothing about the song. When he appeared on Jimmy Fallon's show, O'Connell even said that he cannot talk about it or they'd lose the job (if memory serves, Meatloaf was going to perform the theme for The World Is Not Enough until he started talking about it).

On the other hand, consider this extract from the "Skyfall" article:

Adele, who had just released her second album, 21, admitted that initially she was a "little hesitant" about agreeing to write a Bond theme song. On meeting with the Skyfall film crew, the singer had told Skyfall director Sam Mendes that she felt as though she was not the person they were looking for because "my songs are personal, I write from the heart". Mendes simply replied "just write a personal song", telling her to use Carly Simon's "Nobody Does It Better" from The Spy Who Loved Me as an inspiration.

This gives the reader a clear insight into the process of composition. It shows us the relationship betweem composer and director and how Mendes advised Adele going forward. This is the kind of content that this article should have, and the article should not have been created until it became available. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 05:44, 11 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ballad[edit]

Enough to justify adding Category:2020s ballads, or shall we wait for critical reception after the song has been released? ---Another Believer (Talk) 18:25, 11 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'd wait for critical reception. A ballad is a very particular type of song or poem. They have specific structural and stylistic features, and a lot of modern ballads don't always incorporate them. This song definitely does, but that's just an opinion and I'm coming from a poetic perspective rather than a musical one. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 01:29, 14 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Mclarenfan17, Here. ---Another Believer (Talk) 01:31, 14 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source[edit]

---Another Believer (Talk) 02:29, 14 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

British or American English and formatting[edit]

I just want to raise an issue that was touched on in the deletion discussion by Aoba47:

On a different topic, I would be consistent with the formatting for dates (either Month/Day/Year or Day/Month/Year). I am not sure which would be the best since Eilish is an American artist but Bond is a distinctly British property.

This raises the question of how the article should be formatted—should it be British or American? Eilish is American, but the film is a British production. Most importantly, the song was written for the film—it might be early days, but there has been no word as to whether it will be released as a single or included on future albums. I would go so far as to say that this article should be written and formatted with British conventions in mind. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 06:31, 16 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • That would make sense to me given the song was written and produced with a British film in mind. I do not think there is a standard throughout the Bond song articles. "Die Another Day" and "Another Way to Die" for instance use the American formatting presumably because they were both released by American singers. I am not a major contributor to this article so it would be helpful to hear from them (like @Another Believer:). Aoba47 (talk) 18:40, 16 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    Aoba47, I've seen editors go back and forth a couple times, but I don't have a strong preference (and support consistency throughout). I'm inclined to go with American because Eilish is American. ---Another Believer (Talk) 00:59, 17 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    I agree consistency is the most important part. As long as the dates are consistent one way or the other, then it should be fine. Aoba47 (talk) 01:21, 17 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Aoba47 and Another Believer:
I'm inclined to go with American because Eilish is American.
But the problem here is that the song was not only produced for a Bond film, but it was produced because of a Bond film. There is no evidence that it would have been written and recorded even without the film being made. Eon don't always approach an artist directly—sometimes they put out an open call for artists, and those songs often get released quite separately. Ace of Bass wrote a song for GoldenEye that was tweaked to become "The Juvenile", Shirley Bassey wrote "No Good About Goodbye" for Quantum of Solace, Radiohead wrote "Spectre" for Spectre, and Muse wrote "Supremacy" for Skyfall (but the band has never confirmed it). On the other hand, Madonna wrote "Die Another Day" so that it could fit on her American Life album. Finneas O'Connell made it clear that Eon came to them specifically.
The point I'm trying to make is that without No Time to Die, Eilish would not be performing this song. There are no plans (yet) for it to be included on a future album, and if it is to be released as a single, then it will be a promotional tie-in (like "Another Way to Die"). I think this is a song for a British film that happens to be performed by an American artist, not a song by an American artists that happens to be included in a British film. Mclarenfan17 (talk) 02:11, 17 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Also, compare the personnel for this song to Eilish's other songs (and album)—very few people who worked on this song worked on her other projects. I'm thinking Zimmer (the film's composer), Marr (who is working on the score with Zimmer) and Dunkley (who is himself a composer, but I don't know what role he will have in the film). Mclarenfan17 (talk) 02:15, 17 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Mclarenfan17, Sure, I understand your reasoning as well. I guess we just need to decide if the song is more a Billie Eilish song or a James Bond theme. Again, I don't feel strongly either way re: American vs. British. ---Another Believer (Talk) 02:16, 17 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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