Talk:Royal eponyms in Canada

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Untitled[edit]

There is a road in a densely populated area on the island of Montreal (QC) that is still called today Queen Mary Road (chemin de la Reine Marie) that should be included on this site.

Queen Charlotte Islands[edit]

It's a misconception that the QCI and associated placenames were named for Queen Charlotte; the islands were named for a ship named for her. See Queen Charlotte Islands and Queen Charlotte (merchant ship); the mountain range and Queen Charlotte City were named for the islands.Skookum1 (talk) 14:19, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Rockies[edit]

There's a Royal Group in the Rockies which could use an article (search BCGINS) and various other royal-associated peaks there; but NB summits named Mount King Albert and Mount Queen Elizabeth were named c. for the then-Belgian royals, not for British royals; see their BCGNIS links on List of peaks on the British Columbia-Alberta border.Skookum1 (talk) 14:19, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Queen Elizabeth I[edit]

In the same general area as Mount Queen Bess there is also Oriana Peak; also many placenames in that area have Elizabethan associations, though are not of royalty per se, e.g. Galleon Peak, Armada Peak, Mounts Raleigh, Monmouth, Grenville and so on see Homathko Icefield.Skookum1 (talk) 14:19, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How is "Oriana" related to Elizabeth I? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 06:09, 14 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You've never heard that? It's another poetic name for her, like Gloriana; occurs in tributes, madrigals, poetry - see Oriana although the mention there is brief and uncited; see also Oriana (disambiguation). Another epithet was "the silver swan", I think, and there's a Silver Swan Mountain around there too (I think). Unlike the Royal Group in the Rockies there's no official name for the cluster of Elizabethan tributes around Queen Bess, but they're there....btw the Brittannia Range in the North Shore Mountains - Brunswick, Windsor and others, are royal tributes.Skookum1 (talk) 14:24, 14 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fort/Prince George[edit]

Fort George was named for George III, and renamed for a later Prince George (1910 or so?). And what about the Strait of Georgia, it's named for George III.....Skookum1 (talk) 14:19, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

further to my inline comment and edit comment about this, the following is from the BCGNIS entry for the City of Prince George:

The construction of the railway led to a prolonged and complicated struggle among three competing townsites. However, the GRP's own townsite, Prince George, soon drew people away from rival Central Fort George and South Fort George. When the first civic elections were held in 1915, the name Prince George was chosen over Fort George by a vote of 153 to 15.

Source: Akrigg, Helen B. and Akrigg, G.P.V; British Columbia Place Names; Sono Nis Press, Victoria 1986 /or University of British Columbia Press 1997

Agricultural settlement around Fort George began about 1906 when it was realized that the Grand Trunk Pacific Railway (later CN Rail) would pass near the fur post. The railway arrived in 1914 and construction of the railway townsite commenced. In 1915, the City of Prince George was incorporated. The City?s name honours a former Duke of Kent, born in 1902 and killed in an air crash during the Second World War. (City of Prince George website, September 1999. Link through www.civicnet.gov.bc.ca/members/ )

Source: BC place name cards, or correspondence to/from BC's Chief Geographer or BC Geographical Names Office

....from "Prince George (city)". BC Geographical Names..Skookum1 (talk) 15:55, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Also note Connaught Hill, which is right in the city: "Connaught Hill". BC Geographical Names..Skookum1 (talk) 15:58, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Alexandra Bridge[edit]

The original bridge was named for Princess Alexandra, the name was carried over to the modern highway bridge..Skookum1 (talk) 14:23, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Russian nobles & Spanish[edit]

by using "royalty" in the title I suppose it means only-noble names aren't counted in; lots of peaks and such around named for hte British peerage, but it's also worth noting that along the Alaska border are peaks named for Russian noblemen - Nesselrode, Poletica etc. There might be a couple of royal/imperial Russian names in Alaska, I'm not sure there are any in BC, might be but I haven't noticed any. However Fort San Miguel at Nootka Sound was named/derived from Miguel III, then King of Spain.....Skookum1 (talk) 14:23, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think, given the size of thie article already, any eponymous features named for non-royal nobility/peers should probably be covered elsewhere. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 16:13, 26 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mount Frederick William[edit]

Named for Frederick III, German Emperor, but no section for him currently (?).Skookum1 (talk) 16:14, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This raises the question of whether or not this article should move beyond the scope of British/French/Canadian royalty. I wonder if it would be confusing to do so. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 16:15, 26 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
No, 'cause there aren't many such entries; there's ones for the Belgian King and Queen as note4d elsewhere....I've wracked my brains trying to think of Russian or Spanish royal eponyms, but other than Fort San Miguel echoing the name of the then-Spanish king I can't think of any.....Skookum1 (talk) 02:49, 27 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
My bad, doesn't apply re "Miguel III"....I mis-remembered the name, it's Carlos III I was thinking of, so much for that idea.....Skookum1 (talk) 02:53, 27 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm, I just stumbled upon this and thought there must be someplace in BC named for Spanish royalty. But after searching and checking various possibilities, it appears there are none. The Spanish explorers named many many things after the Viceroys of New Spain and various high ranking naval officials, but apparently not for Spanish monarchs or royalty--not in BC or elsewhere along the PNW coast. Given the British propensity for naming places after British royalty it seems strange that the Spanish did not, at least in the PNW. The many places named for Viceroys of New Spain makes the absence of Spanish royalty place names seem intentional. I wonder if it was deemed inappropriate for some reason. Pfly (talk) 18:06, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Oh and, PS, shouldn't this page be included in Category:Lists of eponyms, despite not being named "List of..."? Pfly (talk) 18:13, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There's another page, Monarchy in British Columbia and maybe a federal equivalent, which includes British/Canadian viceroys i.e. Governors and Lieutenant Governors, in its content; it may be appropriate to add them there....it's not just Spanish royal names that are missing, but also Russian ones...though the Alexander Archipelago - the islands of the Alaska Panhandle - seems named for Alexander I. Just curious - what is there in the way of Spanish royal eponyms in Latin America? (and/or parts of Mexico now in the US).Skookum1 (talk) 18:41, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, the Alexander Archipelago was named in 1867 in the wake of the Alaska Purchase, in honour of then-Tsar Alexander, who I think was Alexander II (maybe III?). Prior to that, however, when the eastenr/southeastern Panhandle was still under lease to the HBC, maps showed it as the King George II archipelago....whether that would include Wales/Pearse Islands (which remain in BC) I'm not sure. Fair number of places up there named for boyars/Russian nobility, though most of them were involved with the Russian American Company (some of the Chief Managers, i.e. Governors though not by that name) were nobility, e.g. Furuhjelm.Skookum1 (talk) 18:56, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
BTW the USGS entry for the Alexander Archipelago says "see King George the Third Archipelago", though there is no such listing; must be an older, now deleted entry. Still, a search for "King George" in USGS turns up a few interesting things....the California items I wonder if they were named by fur traders, i.e. from the Chinook Jargon, in which "King George" meant British, rather than a reference to any particular monarch; its USGS entry doesn't say what year the name was first documented, though. Still, it strikes me that List of royal eponyms in the United States, if it's not already in existence, might be an interesting undertaking....Skookum1 (talk) 19:00, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some quick replies.

  • the California items I wonder if they were named by fur traders, i.e. from the Chinook Jargon, in which "King George" meant British. There's only two "King George" place names in California, King George Ridge and King George Peak. The peak is part of the ridge. I checked the book Durham's Place Names of Central California, but it doesn't say how they were named. They are in the southern Sierra Nevadas though, so highly unlikely to be Chinook Jargon.
Well, yes, but if named since California joined the Union you have to wonder which King George they mean....George V, George VI perhaps?21:34, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
  • it strikes me that List of royal eponyms in the United States, if it's not already in existence, might be an interesting undertaking. Hehehe, there's no royalty in the United States! No royal place names! Er, hmm, except Virginia. And, um, Georgia. Er, Carolina, Maryland, New York, Charleston, Louisiana, Louisville, etc etc etc.
Exactly what I was thinking.....Skookum1 (talk) 21:34, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • what is there in the way of Spanish royal eponyms in Latin America? (and/or parts of Mexico now in the US)? I'm not sure, but nothing obvious springs to mind. The list of monarch names from 1479-1808 is not long due to repeating names. Template:Monarchs of Spain gives them as: Ferdinand/Fernando, Isabella/Isabel/Ysabel/Sabela, Joanna/Juana, Philip/Felipe, Charles/Carlos, and Louis/Luis.

It seems to me that when a newly discovered place called for a grand name the Spanish tended to go for saints while the English went for royalty. The most obvious example that comes to mind is "Gran Canal de Nuestra Señora del Rosario la Marinera" vs "Gulf of Georgia". The Spanish name referring to the patroness saint of Eliza's ship, San Carlos. I think Pantoja y Arriaga gave the name; his account says: "This I named El Gran Canal […] Marinera, in honor of our patroness, as it was the most important place we had discovered up to the present." Pfly (talk) 21:19, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wouldn't that be the patroness of all sailors rather than just the San Carlos??Skookum1 (talk) 21:34, 3 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I was just quoting a passage from the book The early exploration of inland Washington waters: journals and logs from six expeditions, 1786-1792 (Google Book link to the quote). The words come from the journal of Pantoja y Arriaga, the pilot under Eliza who lead the first boat survey into the Strait of Georgia. There's a footnote too, after the Spanish name for the strait, which says "Strait of Georgia, named for the patroness of the San Carlos". Apparently the name of Marin County, California might come from the same ol' Nuestra Señora del Rosario la Marinera. This book says that in 1775 Juan de Ayala named San Rafael Bay La Bahia de Nuestra Señora Rosario de la Marinera, which the book translates as "Bay of Our Lady of the Mariner's Rosary". And this other book says much the same, but also that this Juan de Ayala was at the time in command of the San Carlos—the same San Carlos that was later in Nootka, and in 1791, was the flagship of Francisco Eliza's exploration of the Strait of Juan de Fuca, during which Pantoja's boat party, dispatched from the San Carlos, discovered and named the Strait of Georgia Gran Canal de Nuestra Señora--, well you know. Same Mariner's Rosary Lady name, same ship. After Pantoja's discovery the San Carlos and Santa Saturnina entered the Strait of Georgia for further exploration. So anyway, I admit I don't know what kind of patroness this Señora Rosario de la Marinera was.
I did manage to find a few Spanish-given place names that honor Spanish monarchs. The most obvious one is the Philippines, named in 1543 in honor of "future king of Spain", Philip II of Spain. Isabela (province), Philippines, was named in 1856 for Queen Isabella II of Spain. The Mariana Islands were named in 1667 for Spanish Queen Mariana of Austria, widow of Philip IV of Spain. And Carolina, Puerto Rico, was named in 1857 for Charles II of Spain (whose reign was two centuries earlier). This thread sure has wandered far from "Royal eponyms in Canada". My apologies to other editors who don't care about non-royal place names not in Canada. Pfly (talk) 08:30, 4 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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Prince George section re Mount Prince George[edit]

I have corrected/emended the entry concerning the City of Prince George, which was NOT named for George III but for a Duke of Kent d.1902. BC Names also has an entry for a Mount Prince George which is named for the fourth son of George V. I"m not sure if this is the Prince George referenced by the section here. Mount Prince George is part of the Royal Group in the Rockies, adjacent to others of that group of royalty, so I am assuming, without direct proof, it's the d.1942 Prince George that's meant. Also note Georgian Bay is named for George IV, not George III (see edit history in Oct 2013). I hate to break my boycott/retirement, but this page has long suffered from over-reach and indirect names in particular do not belong, so I am removing Georgia Depression, which was not named for George III but in reference to the Strait of Georgia (originally named Gulf of Georgia by Vancouver); similarly the QCI were named for a ship named for Queen Charlotte, not for the lady herself, likewise Queen Charlotte, British Columbia aka Queen Charlotte City, was named for the islands, not the queen.Skookum1 (talk) 01:53, 28 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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