Talk:Rugby union match officials

Confusing - touch judge vs assistant referee[edit]

Is assistant referee just a new or official name for a touch judge? The article seems to use both names interchangeably. Hack (talk) 03:15, 21 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Assistant referees have more powers (and training) than touch judges. Touch judges can be anyone, provided they know how to raise a flag when the ball goes out of play; assistant referees, on the other hand, have been trained in the laws of the game and know how to check for offside, foul play, antics at the breakdown or at set pieces, etc. The article could possibly be clearer about its usage of each term, but that's the gist. At least, I hope it is and I haven't got the wrong end of the stick. – Pee Jay 02:03, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It should concentrate on the assistants. Touch judges are usually reserves, injured players or the father of some kid who is playing. They have no official capacity. Mentioning of touch judging should only be a footnote or a historical reference to the old terminology. AIRcorn (talk) 09:27, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Discrepancies between text and references[edit]

I have a couple of comments about the article and its relation to the referenced laws.

Text - Before the match an assistant referee may be asked to check the studs and clothing of the players. A touch judge is not permitted to do this. Reference - Law 4.5 (a) The referee or the touch judges appointed by or under the authority of the match organiser must inspect the players’ clothing and studs for conformity to this Law. Comment - is a voluntary/co-opted TJ not under the authority of the match organiser?

If a touch judge is selected from the people to hand at the game, then no, they wouldn't be under the authority of the match organiser. All decisions would be the responsibility of the referee, the co-opted touch judge would simply act as an aid to the referee in determining where the ball goes out of play for a line-out or if it has gone over the posts from a penalty/conversion. – Pee Jay 02:03, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

PJ has it right. A touch judge is not under the authority of the match organiser, whereas a assistant would be. I have checked sprigs a few times (as an assistant) while the referee has given the pre-match talk. AIRcorn (talk) 09:48, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Text - The referee organises a coin toss with the team captains to decide who kicks off and what end each team takes initially. This must be done with a coin, other methods such as paper, scissors, rock are not acceptable Reference - Law 6.A.3 (a) Toss. The referee organises the toss. One of the captains tosses a coin and the other captain calls to see who wins the toss. The winner of the toss decides whether to kick off or to choose an end. If the winner of the toss decides to choose an end, the opponents must kick off and vice versa. Comment - this seems fine except the paper, scissors, rock part which seems to be editorial licence.

Yes, I would say deleting the bit about paper, scissors, rock would make sense. The rest seems fine though, although the law does not specifically preclude the use of other decision-making methods. Heck, they could probably have a quick game of chess if they really wanted. – Pee Jay 02:03, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Can be fun if you forget the coin, plus they seem to be making them smaller and smaller. Which hand has the whistle is a common alternative. AIRcorn (talk) 09:48, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Text - Red card A red card is used to signal that a player is being sent from the field, or "sent off", for the rest of a match. The referee signals this by holding it aloft in the direction of the player. In International matches, a red card must be used to send a player off unlike rugby league where a player can simply be pointed to the touchline by the referee.[7] (Red cards are not required at lower level matches but most referees carry them.)

Yellow card Referee giving a player a yellow card A yellow card is used to signal that a player is being temporarily suspended from the game. The player is sent to the "sin bin" for 10 minutes, after which time they are allowed to return to carry on playing. Similarly to the red card, in International matches a yellow card must be used to temporarily suspend a player unlike Rugby league where the referee, while facing the player being disciplined, will hold out both hands with fingers and thumbs spread to represent 10 minutes

Reference - Law 10.6 YELLOW AND RED CARDS (a) When a player has been cautioned and temporarily suspended in an International match the referee will show that player a yellow card. (b) When a player has been sent off in an International match, the referee will show that player a red card. (c) For other matches the Match Organiser or Union having jurisdiction over the match may decide upon the use of yellow and red cards. Comment - it needs to be made clear that while red and yellow cards are mandatory for international matches, lower competitions are not bound to use them. It should also be noted that the cards are only an indication that a player has been "cautioned and temporarily suspended" or "sent-off".

Yes, that would make sense. The card is merely symbolic/representative of the act of cautioning/ejecting a player. I imagine that the cards are mandatory for international matches because it helps the spectators/TV audience to see exactly what is going on. – Pee Jay 02:03, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

As a practical point I don't even think the are mandatory at international level. Imagine if an international referee forgot his cards and some foul play occured. The ref should still be able to send the player off, although they would probably get a roasting from the referee panel afterwards though. The cards are like whistles to referees, even at lower grades they are a vital part of the kit. AIRcorn (talk) 09:48, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

A further comment - the difference between a touch judge and an assistant referee is not made entirely clear. Is it the case that there might be official TJs who do not have the rights of an assistant referee? Hack (talk) 04:39, 11 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Re: assistant referee vs touch judge, see my reply above. – Pee Jay 02:03, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Concentrate on the assistant. I think this should be written at an international level to start with and work down. It could probably do with some sections describing the tiers from professional to accredited amateurs to dads giving the under sevens a run. AIRcorn (talk) 09:48, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

This article is a rehash of some outdated rules. It could do with a rewrite. AIRcorn (talk) 09:23, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Gender-neutral pronouns[edit]

Given that many referees are now women, they should be referred to in this article by gender-neutral pronouns. Any comments before I make changes? -- Jmc (talk) 03:55, 29 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]