User talk:Ebyabe/Archive 8

Hideki Matsui

The edit war over that tabloid garbage about Matsui and his alleged "traveling porn collection" continues. If I get slapped for violating the 3-revert-rule, so be it. I could use the vacation time. :) Wahkeenah 12:48, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your help yet again. It will be interesting to see what happens now on two fronts: the IP address obsessed with posting the tabloid stuff, and SABR's take on that other guy who keeps re-adding his personal research. Strangely, Matsui is a lightning rod for both. No wonder he's stressed out. Wahkeenah 23:57, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Vic Power

My complaint to those editor(s) remains the same with that article as with the others: Prove it. Don't expect us to take your word for it. The author of that article says that he has the information correct. Liebman says he doesn't. It's an obvious content dispute, requiring submission of evidence or, perhaps, notes in the text saying there is conflicting info. The blanket assertion that one is right and one is wrong, "Take my word for it", doesn't cut it. I haven't heard back further from the SABR guy, but we'll see. Wahkeenah 16:51, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

MWU

Hi, thanks for your question. MWU is a tool I wrote that is somewhat like AWB, but written in Java so it runs on Mac OS X as well as Windows and Linux. It presently isn't in a form that is suitable for release however. Like AWB, in the wrong hands it could be used for malicious intent and unfortunately I don't have time to work on the necessary security features to make is available to others. Best, Gwernol 18:21, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Category India

Hey I noticed that every tom dick harry bio profile who seems to be from india is being categorised under India. It should be "Indian people" or more specific. I dont recommend to put anybody/anything in category India. Suntech 03:08, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

John Henry Lloyd

The findagrave article repeats the 1965 death date, yet his headstone says 1964. [1] I've sent a note to the findagrave editor to find out if he knows anything about that. I'm curious as to the possible veracity of some of User:Ron liebman's claims. If there are mistakes, they should be corrected. But not his way. Wahkeenah 00:42, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm finding references across the internet that have it as either 1964 or 1965. The breakthrough book, Only the Ball Was White, published in 1970, gives the date as 1965, and if it's wrong, maybe that's where the trouble started. The Sporting News Baseball Guides for 1965 and 1966 don't list him in the necrologies. But as we've said, there's a right and a wrong way to do this. Wahkeenah 00:46, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I have seen and have copied two PDF files (from the Connelsville, PA Courier and Baltimore Afro-American), both dated March 1964, that report Lloyd's death on 19 March 1964. Considering the edit war going on, I'm not sure what Mr. Liebman has or has not done, nor what constitutes proper documentation in this matter. Wahkeenah is correct in the assumption that the original error goes back to Bob Peterson's book.

SABR's online encyclopedia (which IIRC is a members-only feature) still shows it as 1965, though the Negro League Committee knows it to be 1964. If a PDF file of a copyrighted newspaper can be used (as it may be the only online proof available), then I can provide it as proof. Otherwise, you may wish to go to SABR's site (http://www.sabr.org), go to "Research", and look up the co-chairs of the Negro League Committee, they might be able to answer your query as a recognized authority. -- Couillaud 04:44, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

In my opinion, that would qualify as a cited source. The point of all this is that "Ron Liebman" keeps making claims but not presenting evidence. If you can upload a PDF that proves the 1964 date, then the article could give all the information... namely, that Peterson's book says 1965 and the headstone and your article say 1964. That's all we ask "Ron Liebman" to do, and he just refuses to. And his peculiar insistence on imposing his own opinion on matters of streaks and such further undercut his credibility. Anyway, if there's a way to do a PDF, or even just a printscreen of it, then go ahead and upload it. Then maybe "Ron Liebman" will get the idea (although I wouldn't count on it). Baseball Bugs 04:59, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I uploaded the following file: 19640320_ConnelsvilleCourier_p06.pdf (Connelsville Courier, March 20, 1964), which has an obituary for JHL in the middle of the page. Its date is clearly marked at the top of the page. It is marked for "speedy deletion", so please look at it before that happens. -- Couillaud 11:50, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

That's a little hard to do since you didn't provide a link to it. Baseball Bugs 12:31, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Too late. Looks like it's already been deleted. :( -Ebyabe 12:35, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Maybe he didn't make an appropriate fair-use statement. Maybe he should upload it again with a comment saying it needs to be retained as supporting documentation for an article. And how would I find it in any case, without a link? Baseball Bugs 12:42, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't see it in his contrib list, so maybe he only thought he uploaded it. I know what I want to write in the article, but I won't do so until I see the evidence. Baseball Bugs 12:58, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

No, no, he did contribute it. What you do is go to someone's user page or talk page. Under the "Toolbox" section on the left is a link called "User contributions" (it should be the third one down). I only learned this, 'cause I've been doing generic anti-vandal patrol lately for fun. :) Anyway, I checked earlier, and the file was there, but I didn't have a chance to look at it. I saw the speedy deletion warning on the info page though (something about non fair use, of course). And now it's gone. :( -Ebyabe 13:14, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I'll try again, and tell the uploader that it belongs to me, so it won't be deleted. Someone else can decide what to do with it later. I'm working from a different computer at the moment, and do not have access to the Connelsville paper, so I'm uploading a story from the Baltimore Afro-American. Note that its date is March 24, 1964, as it is a weekly paper. The file name is Baltimore_Afro-American_03241964_p15.pdf. -- Couillaud 13:31, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

The link to it is Image:Baltimore Afro-American 03241964 p15.pdf. -Ebyabe 13:50, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Got it. I downloaded it, so I can refer to it in case it gets deleted again. I'll be fixing the article probably this evening. No time right now. Thank you both for your efforts. Baseball Bugs 14:04, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. I'm just happy to see accurate information put in place, and an end to the revert war. If there are any other spots where you think Mr. Liebman might have correct information but has refused to provide proper documentation, put a list on my user talk page, and I'll see if I can find some.

BTW, I doubt whether complaining to SABR would do much harm to Ron. Unless his actions are doing some specific recognizable harm to the organization, SABR doesn't much concern itself with members' activities outside the organization.

- Couillaud 14:17, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I told SABR that it looked like someone was impersonating SABR members. That they might get concerned about. I've heard nothing fromthem beyond the initial acknowledgment of my note. Baseball Bugs 16:36, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I added some cited info to the article. Maybe this will give "Ron Liebman" a hint as to what's required. Any bets on whether he'll take that hint, so we don't have to do his work for him? Baseball Bugs 17:28, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Editorial assistance

I apologize for not recognizing you earlier. I am just getting familiar with this type of userbox. You may want to place the following on your user page:

This user helped promote Marquette Building (Chicago) to good article status.

TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 20:48, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Goodness, that's OK. I've gotten so used to doing things in my WikiGnome way, that it's a pleasant surprise when someone notices. I don't think I did that much to help the article; you believing my contributions had merit are thanks enough. But I'll accept the recognition, if you insist. ;) --Ebyabe 22:26, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Ty Cobb

"Ron Liebman" has been quiet, but other rearchers keep pushing the issue of Cobb have 4,189 career hits instead of 4,191. As much as I disliked Bowie Kuhn as a Commissioner, I'm inclined to agree that unless every player's stats are revisited, singling out Cobb is unfair. Be that as it may, I added the official MLB stats to the unofficial "researched" stats from other sites. I'm guessing that will cause trouble, but we'll see. Baseball Bugs 01:11, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

User:Ron liebman

There seems to be an entire Starting Nine working on this issue. It's not very efficient use of time, but it's interesting to observer. I have a hunch this kind of thing has happened over and over again on wikipedia, and in my opinion, does nothing to help its credibility. :\ Wahkeenah 20:19, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I left a note on george's page with an idea. The whole thing is really sad, that's true. That's why I'm for registration for all editors. Which wouldn't stop sockpuppets, but at least would slow down the stupid anonymous stuff. I like to think the best of people, but am realistic enough to know that's not always the case. Sometimes I think Wikipedia bends over backwards a bit too far to be fair. Oh well... -Ebyabe 20:31, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I am absolutely opposed to IP addresses being allowed to add stuff without it first being scrutinized by someone. My initial edits were as an IP address, for maybe a few days, then I registered. Anyone who won't register is up to no good, as I see it. But I don't see the policy changing anytime soon. :( Wahkeenah 20:51, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I have been reincarnated with a possibly more suitable user ID. I've heard nothing back from SABR, and the guy from findagrave was no help. John Henry Lloyd's gravestone says 1964, and my guess is that the 1965 date is an error stemming from Only the Ball Was White. But we need more than that. On another point, I'm pretty sure he's right about Harry Chappas being taller than his supposed 5'3" (typical Bill Veeck hype). But since "Ron Liebman" and a gazillion sockpuppets refuse to discuss and document things, and because of his insistence on trying to "correct" Matsui's consecutive-games record, despite the fact that even SABR doesn't recognize it his way, it seems we have no choice but continual reversion. Baseball Bugs 01:14, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Welcome back, and hope the reincarnation process wasn't too painful. :) There was a lull for a couple of days, so I was hoping against hope. But yes, Ronny's resumed. We'll keep up the good fight, so to speak. --Ebyabe 01:25, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

And he's cutting into my picture uploading time, which is starting to bug me. I went out yesterday and today and took pics of historic stuff in Florida (one of my main projects). It takes me a while to sort thru and label and upload the pics (usually 200 per weekend), and his bizarro efforts are slowing me down. Grrrr... :) --Ebyabe 01:29, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

More activity today, by one of his older sockpuppets. What's it going to take to get them all blocked permanently? If wikipedia's managers would focus more on this kind of thing, and less on obsessing over photos, they could ensure better quality of the "product". Baseball Bugs 16:00, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Check it, there's only two of the old named ones left, so that's good news. He's slowed down lately, have you noticed? Maybe we're wearing him down. One can only hope... :) -Ebyabe 16:05, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

In the latest reversion, I said that he should provide documentation to avoid this continual reversion. I'm guessing he's got an inherently anarchistic attitude, but it's worth a try. Baseball Bugs 16:20, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

For example, what he says about Harry Chappas is true, as I recall... but I'm not going to put that in the article without some documentation. My old Baseball Encyclopedia still says 5'3". Sports Illustrated at the time debunked that as another Bill Veeck hype. But without chapter and verse, neither I nor "Ron Liebman" has any business putting such an entry in. Baseball Bugs 16:23, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

He's now using his last active account, "Cynthia Roberts". Baseball Bugs 17:42, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

And I've just reported it to WP:ANI. :) -Ebyabe 17:44, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

It's been blocked indefinitely, too. Now he'll have to create entirely new sockpuppets. Oh rapture, oh joy unending. :) -Ebyabe 17:50, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Excellent. If he changes socks often enough, he gets the boot. Baseball Bugs 19:32, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

FYI: confirmation via Checkuser is in, they're all socks. See [2]. Not that I had any doubt, but now we have the confirmation in case anyone tries to challenge the enforcement. The CU runner also spotted two more socks, which I have indef'ed. Georgewilliamherbert 19:51, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

As an aside, going forwards; I am willing to semi-protect the articles they're hitting, which will make it harder for them to do anything. Would you think that semi-protecting for ... a week? a month? ... would make our lives easier and convince the Ron sockpuppeteer to just go away? We have to stick with WP:PROTECT guidelines, but they're fine with a temporary semi-protection. Georgewilliamherbert 19:55, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks ever so muchly! Let me think about the aside for a bit. I'm adding those two blocked socks to the case, b/c I loves me the documentation! :) -Ebyabe 19:57, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Here's a possibility: As soon as he hits the next one (today, tomorrow, or whenever), semi-protect every page on his "hit list" for one week. That will foil his creation of new accounts and absolutely stop his multiple IP's. Then we can see if he hits any more or gives up. His activity has already tailed off quite a bit, but that doesn't prove anything, as it's possible he has other activities in life besides this one. Baseball Bugs 22:31, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

And on that basis, I think it's time to semi-protect, at least the articles he hit today. Baseball Bugs 18:11, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

That's a big 10-4. I'd say we should start with week-long blocks, and then see what happens from there. --Ebyabe 18:15, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

That seems reasonable and normal, as a start. The only question is, how many to do? I see he just went after Chief Bender, which he hadn't touched for awhile. How much effort is involved in semi-protecting an article? Baseball Bugs 19:00, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

An admin has to reach out and touch the article. The centralized easy place to list it would be the suspected sockpuppets case central page - If you can just put a section in under "Comments" or somesuch, put in a list of pages he hits and you suggest we sprotect, and I'll follow up and do so if I agree. Georgewilliamherbert 19:50, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, only admin can do it, we're just talking strategy. So, should this go straight onto that already-existing sockpuppet page, with a formal request to semi-protect? The articles are already listed there. I think we have all of them covered. There must be at least 30 of them. Baseball Bugs 20:44, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

I could just semiprotect all of those for a week for starters. Would that be a good place to start? Georgewilliamherbert 20:57, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like a plan, folks. So let it be written, so let it be done! :) --Ebyabe 21:01, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, thus spake Ramses. Or as his distant cousin Jean-Luc would so, "Make it so." :) Baseball Bugs 21:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

You know, I almost put that instead! Great minds, I guess. *lol* --Ebyabe 21:47, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the barnstar! :) And I have now started some Frank Lloyd Wright stuff. I made my way over to the Frank Lloyd Wright Home and Studio in Oak Park, Illinois on Wednesday, toured the home, utterly amazing, beyond words really. Then walked much of the historic district, saw some great houses (I have started: Arthur Heurtley House (believe me I got pics of me in front of this one), Mrs. Thomas H. Gale House, and Frank Thomas House) as well as caught some other Oak Park Registered Places, Oak Park Conservatory, Scoville Park etc. My gallery will slowly be being updated at Commons, I have already added some stuff into the Oak Park section. Thought you might be interested, it was a crappy day for photos and I still have my small, not so great camera so I did what I could, some stuff I haven't uploaded is a bit better but at least they are something, and I will be headed back to Oak Park asap anyway. The Heurtley House particularly mesmerized me, thusly nominated for DYK. : ) Thanks again. IvoShandor 07:50, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Ron liebman sockpuppet case - closed?

Some overzealous admin stuck his nose in and marked Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/Ron liebman as "closed" when it's clearly still an ongoing problem. And I told him so (minus the editorial comment). Baseball Bugs 16:39, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

• My apologies to the overzealous admin. :) He and I had some discussion, and he is semi-protecting some more articles, at least the ones that the latest sockpuppet hit today. In a new twist, the guy posted some typical unsourced editorial comment in the Chester Arthur page. Anyone who claims to know anything about Chester Arthur, beyond the fact of his being a President, obviously spends way too much time in libraries and/or watching The History Channel. :) Baseball Bugs 18:15, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Category:Uncategorized from April 2007

Hi there. I think you are working on Category:Uncategorized from April 2007. I'm picking stuff from that list as well. Are you working down the list, up the list, or at random? Just trying to avoid picking the same articles. Carcharoth 15:33, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey! I'm working at random, but if you want to pick a direction, I can go opposite and we can meet in the middle. Although I'm skipping some, but they can be dealt with when we finish the others, eh? :) -Ebyabe 15:35, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

It's only the dregs left, isn't it? Let's keep going at random. I'm skipping the weird or hard ones like Mimobot and Twilight language. Interesting stuff though! Carcharoth 15:38, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Oops. I got distracted by creating Category:Burns and crying about elephants at the reference desk. Only 35 left! I'll have to get a move on. Carcharoth 16:41, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

I noticed. Nice to know that I'm not the only one susceptible to going off on tangents. *lol* Now it's the dregs of the dregs. But only need to do a few a day to be cleaned up by the end of the month. :) There's some (like Spar platform) I was tempted to put in for speedy delete. But I think I'm done with April for now. I'm going to finish my last passthrough of the May ones (looking for ones with india in them). Then probably ones with band or song. We'll see after that. -Ebyabe 16:46, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Take part of that back. I did put in Spar platform in for speedy delete, and voila! :) -Ebyabe 16:47, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Joanna Jepson

Could you point out what additional references I need to provide and/or add to the article in order to satisfy the tag you've put on it? I have plenty of info on it, just wanted to keep the article fairly concise and easy to read. Cheers, Joistmonkey 02:12, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

You done good! I removed the tag and the uncategorized category, as you've fixed both quite well. :) -Ebyabe 12:08, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

A favor to ask

I know you live somewhere in the general vicinity of Ocala, and I have a favor to ask of you. I am starting stubs for all of the radio stations in the Gainesville/Ocala market, and I am having a bit of trouble figuring out the programming information for a Low Power station in Ocala, WJND(100.7). One set of sources indicates that it is a Spanish language religious station, and another set indicates that it is a dance music station. Since I live in Gainesville, the signal is far too weak for me to pick it up. Could you tune your radio to the station for a minute and tell me which it is? It will be readily apparent after only a few seconds, since the two formats have nothing in common. :) Thanks! Horologium talk - contrib 23:59, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Would you believe, country and western? I tuned my car radio to 100.7 and listened from the Paddock Mall (near I-75) to Silver Springs. The strongest thing I heard was country songs. I did barely hear a few dance songs that I recognized, however, so I think the actual answer is dance. When you said low power, you weren't kidding. Probably have to be within twenty feet of their antenna to hear anything. You know, though, that this counts as original research, doncha, so technically you can't use it? But hope it helps anyhoo. :) -Ebyabe 12:15, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, it may be Original Research, but now I know which set of data to use...Google gave me a bunch of links, some of which indicated it was a religious programming station, and some of which indicated that it was a dance music station. Obviously, it won't be both, so I am simply eliminating the spurious data. I don't think that really qualifies as "original research". (grin)

We have three or four LPFM stations in the Gainesville/Ocala area, and I can't pull any of them in. Right now, these stations are the only ones for which I have not created at least a stub, but now I can whip up something for WJND. And yeah, with a 93W (!) transmitter, they are really low power. Thanks for the assist! Horologium t-c 23:46, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

What, again?

I closed out my previous account because I wanted to start over with a much smaller watch list and stick with the subject matter I started with on wikipedia over 2 years ago, namely baseball articles. Now I'm probably going to have to quit for good, because of this one user who I consider to be a bully, and who probably hasn't gone far enough to draw sanctions. [3] I've read ominous stuff before, about wikipedia editors who run into such a brick wall, and it's very discouraging. When I quit last time, over the petty issue of media "spoilers", I was mad as hell. Now I'm less mad and more (and mostly) discouraged. The good news is that the Ron Liebman character seems to have backed off (unless he's just waiting for the time limits to expire). But this Tecmobowl guy, I don't know what to do about. I think I'm about done being an editor. I should have just walked away, as User:Wknight94 apparently did. d:( Baseball Bugs 13:03, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

It'll be sad to see you go. You could just make it an extended WikiBreak, maybe that'd help? :) -Ebyabe 13:05, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I can't just quit cold-turkey, as I found out last time. For the time being, I think I'll just have to stay away from any articles he's touched, in order to try to stay at an even keel. That's an ever-expanding list, so it may be difficult. I especially hate what he's done to the Ruth article, in which the great Babe is portrayed as just another ballplayer. I've read a lot about Ruth, and I know different. But I can't watch that page now, either. There's one particular area that interests me... no, I'd better not say it, or he'll come after those articles too. Thank you for your support in these trying times. d:) Baseball Bugs 13:36, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Keeping a distance from that guy is good. I see he has moved on from indiscriminately chopping "trivia" sections to marking individual baseball bios for "speedy delete" on the grounds they are too small. Near as I can tell, this guy is trying to set himself up as the owner of every baseball article he can find. Just what we need. Baseball Bugs 12:43, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Wonder what'd happen if he and Ron became at odds? Might keep 'em both busy and out of everyone else's hair. Well, one can hope, can't one??? ;) -Ebyabe 12:50, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

My thought exactly. It could be like matter and anti-matter. We could sell tickets. Meanwhile, I wanted to point out that I don't necessarily disagree with everything Tecmo-bully is doing. Removing excessive spam links and such should be a good thing. It's his uncompromising attitude that's the problem. My attitude, meanwhile, remains pure. 0:) Baseball Bugs 13:00, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm chiming in here so that you are both aware of this: stop with the personal attacks. This is about the content available on wikipedia, nothing more and nothing less. This is not about article ownership or anything else. I have been available to discuss any points. The simple fact of the matter is that I read the guidline pages and follow them. I will continue to do so. In the event thta a community consensus is established or someone shows me a real reason to adjust my approach, then I will adjust my editing accordingly. Until that time, I suggest that both of you focus on content and not on your personal opinions of the people making the edits. As always, remember: WP:AGF and MOST IMPORTANTLY: WP:NPA // Tecmobowl 14:47, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

A guy who presumes to tell us how and when to use his talk page, in defiance of the rules for talk pages, is now presuming to manage our talk pages. Baseball Bugs 14:58, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Despite his claims to the contrary, he has not been willing to discuss or compromise on anything. It's his way or the highway. It's kind of like a user we had to deal with on the Apollo Hoax page. He was easier to get banned because, although his claims sounded like this guy, he was focused on one small set of articles and was much more blatantly POV-pushing. This Tecno-bully is imposing his spin of the wiki guidelines on dozens of articles, and is ready to hit the "revert" button on any of them if someone changes them. He will have to be watched awhile longer before action can be submitted against him. Meanwhile, his own childish complaints on the "wikiquette" page have gone unanswered, as expected. Baseball Bugs 15:15, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

It appears I'm not alone in having trouble dealing with this guy. A user pointed this out to me in connection with the baseball project. I'm guessing that a case will be building against this guy, slowly. Meanwhile, if I happen to run into him on the streets of Normal this afternoon, I'll be as cordial as I can be. 0:) Baseball Bugs 15:21, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Specifically, on this page: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Baseball#Removal by Tecmobowl of urls with unique information; failure to discuss rather than delete; edit warring Baseball Bugs 15:35, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm told that a similar pattern is emerging, in articles such as Jim Morrison, so it looks like an RFC case is indeed building. I think the user has something to contribute and just needs to learn more about wiki rules and etiquette, although I am not optimistic at the moment, as I have seen this kind of behavior before, and it usually does not end well for the user in question. Baseball Bugs 15:56, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, I hope things work out appropriately in regards to Tecmobowl. Which is not a personal attack. That would be something like "Tecmobowl is a weenie". Nor was that a personal attack. Merely an example of what one would be.

Mind you, the fact that he's obviously following your contributions to be aware of our discussion, and then commenting about it on my talk page and not yours comes close to wikistalking, imho. So it's kinda like the pot calling the kettle black. And if he comments on this, well, dude's got too much time on his hands. Unlike, say, me. *heehee*

That's why I tend to be a WikiGnome, so as to avoid such crap. Ronny's a rare exception. I'd rather just do housekeeping and historical things. Stuff that avoids conflict. I try not to let myself get upset about much, it's my Vulcan upbringing. After all, what's the point? I mean, why be upset, it's only the sum-total of notable human knowledge we're talking about. Not like it's anything important. Take my advice, Don't Worry, Be Happy. ;) -Ebyabe 16:57, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Good advice. :) Baseball Bugs 21:48, 31 May 2007 (UTC)