Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was archived by PresN via FACBot (talk) 00:27, 21 May 2021 (UTC) [1].[reply]

List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest[edit]

Featured list candidates/List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest/archive1

Nominator(s): Sims2aholic8 (talk) 21:03, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Eurovision Song Contest is an international television song competition that regularly attracts over 200 million global viewers each year. In its 66 year history over 1,500 songs from 52 countries have been performed and it has amassed a truly global following. I believe this list complies with all the criteria to be promoted to featured list; it includes a full record of all songs performed in the contest, as well as those which were withdrawn or disqualified, it features several prose elements which provide context and clarit, it is appropriately sourced with reliable and independent websites and books, and it has been made visually appealing through its structure and the inclusion of relevant photographs of some of the contest's participating artists. Sims2aholic8 (talk) 21:03, 14 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Commentys

The lead could do with a fourth paragraph summarising more of the content eg which country has entered most/fewest times, which country has won most, that sort of thing
Nothing in the current lead is referenced
"Australia, a EBU associate member broadcaster" - Australia is not a broadcaster
None of the explanations in the table key are complete sentences, so they shouldn't have full stops
"Dana International earned Israel's third Eurovision victory in 1998, and became the contest's first transgender winner." - last part needs a source
"Valentina Monetta has made four contest appearance" => "Valentina Monetta has made four contest appearances"
In the Entries which failed to qualify table, the refs are not in correct numerical order (in two places)
All the notes with the exception of note (a) are not complete sentences, so they shouldn't have full stops
That's what I got on a first pass -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:50, 15 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: Thanks for the feedback, I believe I have now implemented all the above. Sims2aholic8 (talk) 18:57, 15 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment

This is a really long list, and it's only going to keep growing from here. Wikipedia:Article size suggests 10,000 words as an upper limit on article length, and if we count each row as approximately 10 words, this is well beyond that length. Also, table markup adds lots of HTML code that isn't shown as text, further increasing load times beyond what the word count would imply. Would it make sense to split this list up? I would suggest grouping the results into lists for 1956–2000 and 2001–present or 1956–79, 1980–99, 2000–19, and 2020–present, but I want to get other thoughts first. RunningTiger123 (talk) 18:06, 15 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@RunningTiger123: I wouldn't be opposed to splitting the list in principle. Personally I felt it made more sense to keep it as a single list particularly for the "failed to qualify" and "withdrawn/disqualified" sections which contain proposed entries from a range of years. What would a potential split mean for the FL process? If the split were made into 1956-1999 and 2000-present, would the FL be given to the 1956-1999 page as the more "complete" of the two? Sims2aholic8 (talk) 18:57, 15 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Those are good questions. For the "failed to qualify" and "withdrawn/disqualified" tables, I think we could split those as well so the relevant parts of each table go on each new page. In regard to the FL process, if a split were to happen, it would probably be best to withdraw the nomination, split the page, and renominate each new list that meets the criteria one at a time. However, that's a lot of work that may be unnecessary if others find the length acceptable, which is why I would like to hear other reviewers' opinions and ideas before any additional steps are taken. RunningTiger123 (talk) 20:18, 15 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If the list is split, that would also mean we'd have to rewrite almost all the prose, since most of it talks about the contest in general and not a specific year range. Maybe we could move it over to the main Eurovision Song Contest article? ―JochemvanHees (talk) 13:28, 16 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry for my slow reply – in my opinion, much of the prose could be kept as is in every new list after a potential split. In particular, the parts discussing the overall history and eligibility for the contest are mostly fine; some specific references might have to be tweaked if they fall outside the date range, but other than that, I see no issues there. The details like the number of total appearances would probably vary from article to article based on the years they cover, though the present-day article could keep the discussion of overall records. (In this case, I would suggest naming using a naming scheme like List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest (1956–99) and List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest, omitting the year range from the most recent list. This is similar to how List of The Simpsons episodes, another long FL, is organized.)

@Sims2aholic8: Maybe a discussion for this could be opened per WP:PROSPLIT? That way, we could see if other users think a split is needed and, if so, how to split it. I would suggest opening the discussion at Talk:List of entries in the Eurovision Song Contest but linking to it at Talk:Eurovision Song Contest for more visibility. I'd also be willing to open the discussion if you'd like. RunningTiger123 (talk) 22:39, 27 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@RunningTiger123: Thanks for your insights again! I think a discussion on whether to split this list would be beneficial, and I'm happy for you to kick this off on the list's talk page. Linking in with Talk:Eurovision Song Contest would be helpful, as would getting input from our wider WikiProject through Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Eurovision. I have had some thoughts on what a split could look like myself, but eager to hear other views as well. Knowing that other FLs have also gone through the splitting process is also very helpful. Sims2aholic8 (talk) 22:54, 27 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Sims2aholic8: I've started a discussion for a potential split and added notices where relevant. If you're willing, I think it would be great if you added your thoughts to the discussion as well. RunningTiger123 (talk) 23:18, 27 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks! I've added my two cents to the discussion as well now. Sims2aholic8 (talk) 23:27, 27 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Table accessibility review (MOS:DTAB): while the tables have column scopes and captions, they are missing rowscopes, and have column headers in the middle of the table.

For each row, the 'primary' cell should be marked with `scope="row"`, e.g. instead of `| 1` it should be `!scope="row"| 1`, with the rest of the row on its own line. If the way this changes the formatting of that column bothers you, you can add the `plainrowheaders` class to the top of the table at `{| class="wikitable"`
Column headers in the middle of tables like "Eurovision Song Contest 1956" are contraindicated as screen reading software trips on them, see Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Accessibility/Data tables tutorial#Avoiding column headers in the middle of the table. Please remove.

--Pres N 14:29, 2 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This list is now currently undergoing a split following discussion and consensus, therefore I am now revoking this nomination. Once the split has been completed and further updates from the comments above have been fulfilled I will most likely submit the newly split list once again. Many thanks to everyone who participated in this nomination procedure. Sims2aholic8 (talk) 15:23, 18 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Just a heads up, when you wish to withdraw a nomination, you should ping the FLC directors using {{@FLC}} so they'll see it. I agree with the decision to withdraw for now, but I look forward to reviewing the new lists once they have been cleaned up from the split!

@WP:FLC director and delegates: Since it's been a few days, I figured I'd add the ping myself to ensure the withdrawal happens. RunningTiger123 (talk) 18:38, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Closing. --Pres N 22:44, 23 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Closing note: This candidate has been archived, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.