Talk:2023 Venice bus crash

Inquiry
That guardrail / crash barrier didn't look very strong. I hope the inquiry looks at this. There's no Italian wiki page yet, so I hope that will have some info that can come here. Lawrence18uk (talk) 09:23, 4 October 2023 (UTC)

Requested move 4 October 2023

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. WP:SNOW. Should've been speedy not moved per WP:SK. (closed by non-admin page mover) C LYDE TALK TO ME/STUFF DONE 18:22, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

2023 Venice bus crash → Mestre bus crash – This happened in Mestre, which is in the Metropolitan City of Venice, but not Venice proper. Venice is world-famous, but most people outside Italy haven't heard of Mestre, so many media sources outside Italy are instead using (near) Venice in their titles. It's a major incident which is the only notable bus crash in Mestre, so the year isn't needed. Jim 2 Michael (talk) 14:55, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: WikiProject Buses has been notified of this discussion. UtherSRG (talk) 15:13, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: WikiProject Italy has been notified of this discussion. UtherSRG (talk) 15:13, 4 October 2023 (UTC)

Attention, it happened in Marghera (south of the railway line), not in Mestre (which is more to the north, on the other side of the track)! The bus was traveling on a viaduct running along the railway line on the Marghera side (then crashed below, at the end of Via Elettricità, which is also a street in Marghera). Beware of newspaper articles, even Italian ones, which have little knowledge of the place and make errors. Anyway, Marghera and Mestre are both frazoni of the town of Venice and are part of its territory, it is entirely correct to write that the accident occurred in Venice, whose territory is more extensive, notably to the north of the lagoon (terraferma), that its historical and tourist center located in the middle of the lagoon.

The place where the bus was falling and burning: https://www.google.com/maps/@45.4803353,12.2363201,3a,75y,301.18h,77.6t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDf8a9ddUVnrfpKaAtRGGRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

--YANN92340 (talk) 18:35, 4 October 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose. Being within the "Metropolitan City of Venice" is good enough for the article to be named as Venice, since after all it is still part of. A search on Google News from my location of Singapore turns up 19K for Mestre, 2.5K for Marghera and 149K for Venice, so Venice is the prevailing WP:COMMONNAME. I should also note that it is directly called "Venice bus crash" in this BBC article, this AP article, this Sky News article, Yahoo News UK, I don't need to continue listing on, do I? We don't need to be overspecific and complicate matters, especially when the majority of the sources branded it as "Venice" instead of otherwise, and when the town of Mestra is technically still part of the greater Venice area. S5A-0043 Talk 00:55, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose per above. English sources are almost universally describing it as Venice. And we also want to retain the year per usual standards and WP:NCE. &mdash; Amakuru (talk) 14:19, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose per above. Seeing as Mestre is within the municipal boundaries of Venice the current name is the most logical to describe it. I think that adding the proposed name as a redirect would be a good idea. Qwerty1871 (talk) 15:48, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Some mainstream RS say near Venice. The proposed title is already a redirect. Jim 2 Michael (talk) 16:31, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The address is still Venetian territory. I am guessing that these sources mean their proximity to the historic floating center. Borgenland (talk) 16:35, 5 October 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose. The passengers were tourists that just had visited the famous parts of Venice, and were transported back to their place in a less fancy but dry part of Venice. --2003:C6:3707:B031:F9C6:B9D3:FBB9:47D0 (talk) 00:44, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose. It appears through various reputable news sources that the crash happened while inside the city of Venice. As this does not seem to be in dispute, I oppose the request to change the name of the article. Jurisdicta (talk) 12:16, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Crash?
I don't think that this is exactly a crash, and more of a fall, Should we change the title to the 2023 Venice buss fall? Imoutofchoices (talk) 19:40, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose, it's been called "crash" in every article about it. Note above discussion. Tableguy28 (talk) 20:14, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose It crashed into the ground when it fell 15m (49ft), hitting power lines on the way down. Jim 2 Michael (talk) 20:45, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I retract my previous statement. Imoutofchoices (talk) 14:49, 6 October 2023 (UTC)