Talk:Abel Clarin de la Rive

AC de la Rive's name
I corrected his name in a few places, as using using his last name, de la Rive, means 'of the Rive', and can be confusing. In the text, I made sure he is listed as Abel Clarin de la Rive, AC de la Rive, or Abel de la Rive.--Craxd1 (talk) 22:28, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

Reverted article for accuracy
Reverted back to original written by Craxd1 and FoCuSandLeArN, Wikipedia editor.--Craxd1 (talk) 09:05, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

Living people
Though this article has references pertaining to 'living people' on the page, the people written about within the article are all deceased.--Craxd1 (talk) 09:14, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

Tagged
Since the creating editor seems unwilling to edit cooperatively, I have tagged the article based on its major problems. Bombastic language such as "staunch", "scathing article", "large tome" and so forth, as well as words to watch such as "alleged" all violate Wikipedia's policy on neutrality. The sources are unreliable, such as frremasonry.bcy.ca. That means they lack editorial oversight and a reputation for fact-checking, and may in fact be WP:PRIMARY rather than the preferred reliable secondary sources. And last but not least, the creator and major contributor has declared a conflict of interest as a member of Freemasonry, and while he has been advised of the difficulties presented by this, continues to boldly edit the article against policy. Elizium23 (talk) 16:09, 8 August 2015 (UTC)


 * You will need to immediately retract your threat of legal action or you will be indefinitely blocked from editing Wikipedia. Elizium23 (talk) 21:25, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
 * I am asking you to remove this threat, as you can see, I am not threating to do anything. I started to take this to arbitration, but thought about it mid stream, and canceled it. I will though, if you keep making threats, since it was suggested in the e-mail I received from Wikipedia.--Craxd1 (talk) 22:37, 9 August 2015 (UTC)


 * (1) Now, I will address your concern that I am "unwilling to edit cooperatively", even though you have a clear prejudice against Freemasonry and the occult, evidenced by the very sections of your Wikipedia page that you follow and edit. I am unwilling to let anyone, with a very clear religion based prejudice, edit an article on Freemasonry or the occult that they know nothing of, and after your multi-article editing stunt, you shouldn't be allowed on Wikipedia. As a matter of fact, I do not care who edits it, as long as they are neutral, as was the one who posted the article, and copy edited it, a Wikipedia reviewer and Editor who then posted the page. However, I can not consider you neutral after you followed my contributions and tried to delete them, over me being a Freemason.


 * (2) Words. AC de la Rive was a "staunch", (which means loyal and committed in attitude), anti-Mason, which is evidenced by him running the Antimasonic Council of France, of which The Antimasonic France was a publication of. AC de la Rive did write a "scathing", (which means scornful; severely critical), article about Leo Taxil, which is proven by the article itself, which you also tried to delete, that was a direct quote from an old popular French magazine, named Freemasonry Unmasked. It is cited, and I figure it is why you tried to delete it, as it proves the word "scathing", and deleting the quote would hide many truth's that some religious zealots would love to hide. Last, Morals and Dogma was a large tome. My 1950 version is 8 x 6 and is 861 pages long. It's large print version is big enough to use as a boat anchor. By the way, Tome means 'large book'. Oh yes, and the word, 'alleged', is not used anywhere in this article, try again.


 * (3) Now, lets talk about reliable sources, as your problem seems to ONLY hinge on the Grand Lodge of British Columbia, Yukon. AC de la Rive's article, there, is both translated and sourced to the book: author, Cf. Fry, L. Léo Taxil et la Franc-maçonnerie, Chatou, British-American Press, 1934. Now are you calling the Grand Lodge a liar, for translating a book? The other link used, as a source, leads to Leo Taxil's translated confessions, which is used elsewhere on a few articles, and is also in the book, Is It True What They Say About Freemasonry?, by S. Brent Morris Ph.D. and Arturo De Hoyos, who was formerly a professor at Brigham Young University, and received his Ph.D. from Michigan State University. There are several sources, but the one used, which was the full translation of the Parisian newspaper, Le Frondeur, is: authors, Alain Bernheim, A. William Samii, and Eric Serejski, trans., The Confession of Léo Taxil, Heredom, Transactions of the Scottish Research Society, vol. 5, pp. 137-68. © 1997 Scottish Rite Research Society. Are you afraid of what readers may find, if they follow these sources? Last, you most happily skipped over the link that leads to the Amazingdoscoveries.org article: Lucifer is the god of Freemasonry. I wonder why? To be fair, you missed one, which goes to the online version of of the paper, An Examination of Contemporary Anti-Masonry, by Martin I. McGrego, at freemasons-freemasonry.com. Since its it own source, the original is located at the Research Lodge of Southland No.415 on October 10, 2006. By the way, the research Lodges are part of the Authentic School of Freemasonry, who do Masonic historical research, and is handled by lettered members, holding a PhD.


 * (4) Your editing of word and name links. For the word, anti-Mason, you tried to edit the link from going to the anti-Masonry page, to the one of Freemasonry. I wonder why? You also tried to kill the links off of AC de la Rives name, on the other Masonic articles, by deleting them. I am biased, am I?


 * (5) Last, let's deal with your prejudice against me. Yes, I am a Freemason, and am qualified to write on the subject, since I have studied it in depth. You keep forgetting, that I also have a non-biased co-author in this writing. Also, I would not read any article, that was not written by someone not versed on the subject at hand, and that generally requires someone in the actual field of study. This being the case, maybe we should tag every religious article that you have ever laid a finger to? You are a religious editor, are you not? A religious editor, who has never stepped foot inside a lodge of Freemasonry, but feels they are competent enough to freely edit an article on Freemasonry. Let me ask, when did you stand in the North East Corner? Also, about using Masonic sources. That is the same as quoting the Bible on your religious articles. Maybe, we should edit every article on Christianity and Catholicism, and remove all mentions of chapters and verse, then tag all of those too? Oh yes, you claiming the article is not neutral, when it CLEARLY show both sides of the subject on his notoriety, and CLEARLY shows AC de la Rive in a good light, since he recanted the mis-truths he wrote in his book, Woman and Child in Universal Freemasonry and the magazine articles he published. No, it's not neutral at all, is it? That is sarcasm by the way. Lastly, for comparison, saying that I shouldn't be allowed to write this article, (with an unbiased co-author who is a Wikipedia reviewer and editor), is like saying a stamp collector should not write nor edit an article on stamp collecting.


 * For the editors and readers, please take the above into account, and look at his other edits. He was mad at me, over the Chick tract article, so he looked under my name, for everything I had contributed to, and took it upon himself to revert or delete sections on the following articles: Chick tract, AC de la Rive, Taxil Hoax, and Luciferian Doctrine, which is 'false and damaging', stating that Freemasons worshiped Lucifer, which he/she gladly reverted it back to that form.--Craxd1 (talk) 14:28, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

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