Talk:Alick Downer

Untitled
When was this guy Premier of South Australia? Timeshift 03:07, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa (talk) 08:56, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Alexander Downer, Sr. → Alec Downer – Most sources seem to refer to him by this name, including, , , , and most references in Hansard. Frickeg (talk) 11:10, 11 June 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Alec/Alexander
We now have him as "Sir Alexander" in the lede and further down the page, but "Sir Alec" in the infobox, reflecting the article name. We need to sort this out.

For my money, he was in the same camp as Killen, who was always "Jim" before his knighthood and always "Sir James" afterwards (never "Sir Jim"). Downer was "Alec" before knighthood and "Sir Alexander" afterwards (never "Sir Alec").

So, if that's true, what's the best name for the article? Killen is James Killen. Shouldn't this really be back at Alexander Downer, Sr.? --  Jack of Oz   [Talk]  07:40, 14 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Well, this was something we went through before somewhere or other. It's the root of the problem we had earlier with Ken (Sir Kenneth) Anderson and Bob (Sir Robert) Cotton. The problem is that no one ever called Killen, say, "James Killen". It was either "Jim Killen" or "Sir James Killen". I personally would love to have the "Sir" included in the article title, but that would be well outside the scope of this discussion.


 * I'd actually rather have Killen at "Jim" given the way we work at the moment, but the infobox saying "Sir James". But I'm not too fussed there. I am fussed here, however, because I think that "Sr." should be avoided at all costs. Certainly he was never known as "Alexander Downer, Sr." - in fact, even when differentiating him from his son, it's usually as either "Alec" or "Sir Alexander". I'm fine with "Sir Alexander" in the infobox. The lede should be "Sir Alexander Russell "Alec" Downer" in line with the general way these things are done. It seems to me that having him at "Alec Downer" is a far easier and more logical way to disambiguate him than inventing the title "Alexander Downer, Sr." which neither he nor anyone else really used. Frickeg (talk) 09:07, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Name changed from Alec to Alick
On 12th June 2014, this article was moved from Alec Downer to Alick Downer.

The reason for this is because the spelling Alick is more widely used in documentation. Examples include his entry into the Australian Dictionary of Biography. In addition, Downer wrote an autobiographical book called The Downers of South Australia and the author on the book is Alick Downer. There is no mention of the spelling Alec.

I have had access to his archival collection at the Bob Hawke Prime Ministerial Library, and although I have not viewed every piece of the collection, I did not find anything with the spelling of Alec on it. This might be the typical spelling of the name, but I do not think it applies to Downer. All of the family documents I have viewed use the spelling Alick, and staff at the archive encourage use of this spelling.

Natasha from UniSA (talk) 08:14, 12 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Nice catch here. As the person who moved it to "Alec" I have no idea how I missed all the signs. Thanks! Frickeg (talk) 08:21, 12 June 2014 (UTC)


 * There is quite a bit of newspaper coverage referring to him as Alex and Alec though it is not overwhelmingly more than Alick. Hack (talk) 01:29, 26 August 2014 (UTC)