Talk:American Academy of Dramatic Arts/Archive 1

Garner Ted Aukerman
I have removed Garner Ted Aukerman from this article per guideline for alumni lists. Addition of notable alumni need a citation to a) verify that they did indeed attend the school, and b) verify the statement of their notability in their short one- or two-line description. The citation must be a reliable source. Specifically, see here for sources that are self-published content, such as IMBD. Semper Fi! FieldMarine (talk) 19:58, 2 January 2020 (UTC)

imdb is not self published content. three revert rule applies to FieldMariene who is removing this specific individual at numerous pages and keeps moving the goalposts. does it really matter to you this much FieldMarine appears to have a close personal bias or connection to Aukerman — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.41.58.57 (talk) 19:42, 3 January 2020 (UTC)

Suggest removal of all Wikipedia articles under the AMAZON parent company including the Amazon Wikipedia article itself and the Wikipedia articles for the companies IMDb and Box Office Mojo, which Amazon owns, as it’s been pointed out by editors these companies are not reliable citation reference sources, for any Wikipedia content. All Wikipedia articles pertaining to the aforementioned companies, and all Wikipedia articles using citations to Amazon, The Washington Post, Box office mojo and IMDb need to be deleted from the entirety of Wikipedia due to being not reliable sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.134.184.230 (talk) 19:38, 5 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I have re-removed this individual from the list. Firstly, there is no evidence that he is in fact notable, and secondly the source provided (http://www.jonisstunts.com/) is not even close to being a reliable source. above is quite correct that IMDB is also not a reliable source, and I support the removal of this individual unless sources can establish both their notability and the fact of their being an alumnus. Any other assertions about bias etc are largely irrelevant, and the absurd comment above about wholesale deletion of articles is a willful misunderstanding of the very simple and well-established principle that IMBD is user-generated, and user-generated sources are not reliable. Hugsyrup 13:19, 7 January 2020 (UTC)


 * I support the inclusion of this individual. Otherwise begin deleting all Wikipedia Imdb citation references, and references citing the parent company AMAZON, and sub-companies also owned by AMAZON like the Washington Post, a notorious fake news U.S. Newspaper.  A stuntman who is also a cousin of actor Robert Downey, Jr., and who has doubled the likes of Matt Damon, Brad Pitt and many others IS NOTABLE.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.189.211.99 (talk) 23:33, 9 January 2020 (UTC)
 * If he is notable then surely you can provide some reliable sources. ElKevbo (talk) 01:14, 10 January 2020 (UTC)

Teahouse discussion advised to consider Aukerman "notable without article". He is a stuntman. The reference added is a good source within Wikipedia guidelines. **Of further note, Aukerman is employed as a producer/production associate, by Team Downey Productions which is owned by his cousin, Robert Downey Jr. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.214.242.121 (talk) 11:19, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * This is a completely misleading representation of what the user said on the Teahouse. They said 'remove first, and consider "notable without article"' later because 'it's too unlikely for most practical purposes'. The point they were clearly making is that 'notability without article' is highly unusual, and needs substantial sourcing to demonstrate that notability. So far, no one has provided any such sourcing. Simply stating that he is a stuntman, or is related to an actor is entirely insufficient, and IMDB is not a reliable source for reasons that have been explained several times. To be notable enough to appear on this list, he needs to meet the WP:GNG at a minimum, which essentially means he would qualify for his own page. Rather than having this debate here, if you believe he is notable then it would make much more sense to actually draft an article for Aukerman and have it approved via WP:AFC. If you could do that, then it is unlikely anyone would object to him being included here. Hugsyrup 11:30, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Allay your objection and go ahead and you draft that article. Be sure to include such notable facts he is a producer on Doolittle, Sherlock Holmes and The Judge and exec produces the tv show Timorrows World, aside from the pro stunt notable nod.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.214.242.121 (talk) 12:30, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Clearly I will not be doing that as I don't believe the individual is notable. It is for you to demonstrate his notability if you wish to do so. If you do not or cannot, then this conversation is essentially pointless. Hugsyrup 13:20, 10 January 2020 (UTC)

Clearly he is a hollywood stuntman who attended this school. That fact can't be disputed. What is wrong with the source, it links to his stunt agent or agency and shows this school training.StutzTCB (talk) 18:23, 10 January 2020 (UTC)StutzTCB


 * I believe this has been painstakingly explained above, but, one more time: the source is a stunt agency website on which he is listed, so it is not in any way an independent, reliable, secondary source. Even if it were there is still the problem that he is not notable as he does not meet the WP:GNG, and therefore does not belong in this list. This is not one editor’s opinion, this is well-established policy and if you wish to override it the onus is on you to get consensus first, not to keep pushing your edit. Hugsyrup 18:28, 10 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Beg to disagree. A former astronaut candidate, who became a hollywood stunt double for the biggest actor's in show business, and who now produces films with one of the world's most famous stars, which just so happens to be his cousin, Downey, Jr., and who is also a member of the board at 2 of the universities where FieldMarine fitfully pushed and reverted (note over a dozen reverts at the numerous university notable alumni sites, but also note no warning or blocking of FieldMarine for edit warring, well, and for Drmies to describe this fella as not notable or noteworthy and as merely a "stuntman" is laughable at best.  This guy also is also romantically linked to having dated Charlize Theron, Lacey Chabert, Brooke Lewis, and Donna D'Errico! And, so laughable that if you can't find it in Google search, or if an event happened prior to the advent of the internet, then the majority of Wikipedia editors will not accept or publish it to Wikipedia.  References must be verifiable within a cursory Google or MSN search to be acceptable as a good sourced reference.  The Wikipedia motto should be, "If it cannot be found online, it never happened".

NewsRegister (US)   July 3 1988, by: Lori Aprea; News-Register Staff Writer, "Man Hopes to Go From Tiltonsville to Mars; Area Native Works to Become Astronaut" Times Leader (US)   September 27 1987, by: staff writer; Times Leader newspaper, Martins Ferry, Ohio, "Buckeye South grad training for space" CBS News (US)   February 1 2003, by: WTRF TV Wheeling/Steubenville, "Space Shuttle Columbia disaster" Actor Double Chuck Norris; Denis Leary; Matt Damon; Brad Pitt; Dennis Quaid; Aaron Ekhart; Jeff Daniels; Robert Redford; George Strait; Johnny Depp; Jack Wagner; Rick Schroder; Jason Bateman: Trained at American Academy of Dramatic Arts: ERAU: Florida Tech & The OSU https://networthpost.org/net-worth/garner-ted-aukerman-net-worth-2/ https://soundcloud.com/garner-ted-aukerman His stage name is GT DOWNEY, and he has been credited under just the initials of his given name "GTA", maybe to avoid confusion with the famous tv preacher named Garner Ted. https://www.famousfix.com/topic/garner-ted-aukerman/wiki Trade Mark (1) Stunt Double Trivia (7) Aukerman was an on location personal eyewitness to both the Challenger and Columbia space shuttle disasters. His 15 minute interview with the Wheeling, West Virginia CBS television affiliate in the aftermath of the Columbia accident, was aired twice. Aukerman was an eyewitness to the Challenger accident while a college student near Cape Canaveral at Florida Tech. He witnessed the Columbia disaster while in Austin, Texas to work on the Ron Howard film, "The Alamo". Garner is a cousin of actor Robert Downey Jr.. Other cousins working in entertainment include Scott Aukerman of Comedy Bang Bang fame, Jesse Wine and Melvin Wine. His cousin, Craig Aukerman from Youngstown Ohio, is the Special Teams Coordinator of the N.F.L. Tennessee Titans professional football team. Aukerman majored in Aerospace Engineering at the Florida Institute of Technology, in Melbourne, Florida. Aukerman studied Theater at THE Ohio State University, in Columbus, Ohio. Graduate of the American Academy of Dramatic Arts, in Pasadena, California and where he was also elected class president. Majored in Flight and Astronautical Engineering, as an Air Force R.O.T.C. cadet, at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University, in Daytona, Florida. To label this guy as just a stuntman, who never did anything notable or noteworthy, well, go figure Drmies. Wikipedia editors have dedicated volumes to every member of the Kardashian family and their favorite porn starlets, but I'd bet most cannot name even half the fellas who walked on the moon. In today's world, since it happened prior to the internet, they would all be declared not notable or noteworthy too.85Rebels (talk) 20:15, 12 January 2020 (UTC)85Rebels
 * Soundcloud, ‘networthpost’ and, uh, ‘famousfix’ are not reliable sources. Nothing else you’ve said in that wall of text honestly matters, because notability on Wikipedia is based on reliable sources and not what editors assert about you. I might also ask what’s brought you to this specific discussion after six years away from Wikipedia, but I think we both know the answer to that. Hugsyrup 20:37, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * is currently blocked for referring to other editors as "assclown". If they EVER want this stuntman to show up in Wikipedia anywhere, they should write the article first. Instructions are at WP:FIRST. Hint: the exploits of the Kardashians may well be trivial and stupid, but they are verified in reliable sources, and that's what matters. If the editor starts cussing again they'll be blocked indefinitely, because I think everyone is tired of this whining over this one person who is probably them. Drmies (talk) 23:46, 12 January 2020 (UTC)

I accept your criticism about my reverts, and I can see how they may appear as edit warring. I can assure you that these edits were in response to the criteria Wikipedia has set for both notability and reliable sources, and in no way was I suggesting by my edits that your uncle is not accomplished, successful or even notable. I apologize for this misunderstanding if that's the way it came across. However, keep in mind, the onus for showing notability is on you as an editor by using published reliable sources that in fact establish notability. I encourage you to write an article on GAT. Here are some examples to look at Category:Stunt performers. Semper Fi! FieldMarine (talk) 00:03, 13 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Let it ride boys, if you are not afraid of the truth. User:FieldMarine complained in the Teahouse and with admin till he got his own way like most Wikipedia editors do who claim article ownership and hate when someone reverts or changes their article they have claimed as their own they are working on.  He called in his crew, and begged for an assist and block of all IP's who opposed his changes, and he edit warred to the extreme, and stalked the editor's from page to page.  As for  Drmies taunting other editor's with the surname "WINE" saying he personally thinks everyone is tired of this "whining", while he is so quick to block other's, he needs to apply a block to himself for taunting, but of course we know the rules do not apply equally here inside Wikipedia.  And  User:Hugsyrup, the shoes are a perfect fit, for you all, and you wear them very nicely.  You bend the rules when it comes to applying them to yourself, they are simply ignored, and you keep moving the finish line to push your versions of any articles.  First it was a ref was needed, then that ref was not acceptable.  Another ref was added, and that was deemed not acceptable.  Then it was noted an article was not a requirement for notability, and that was then not acceptable, and now you insist an article must now be created and approved.

How can IMDB be not acceptable, while Box Office Mojo/Rotten Tomatoes IS?? Both are fan based and user generated and both are owned by Amazon.


 * There are a small number of editors who believe that they personally own all the articles, and will revert any changes made by anybody else. If reverts fail, they will inform their posse and find a way to block any editor who opposes their edits. (This is exactly what happened in this case)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.5.32.32 (talk) 14:51, 22 January 2020 (UTC)