Talk:Anastrophe

From VfD:

dicdef&#8212;Rory &#9786; 14:52, Aug 21, 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete & send to wiktionary. Geogre 15:14, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep - An important figure of speech. This stub has potential to expand with literary examples.  Smerdis of Tlön 14:28, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC)

end moved discussion

Is not Yoda-speak a form of anastrophe? (That wasn't intentional, actually.) Or am I misunderstanding the definition? Goldy496 05:05, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

"You want a BMW or a Ferrari for your 18th birthday?" "A Ferrari, Grandma" "So a Ferrari it is." Is this "and ...it is" also an anastrophe? Or what else is that phrase called? Is this standard English or some East Coast "Gilmore Girls" specialty? --89.244.66.63 22:33, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Dubious claim
Calling this "common in Latin", a language that does not actually have a well-defined word order, is highly dubious. There is, after all, a reason why there is no synonym in Latin for the Greek word "anastrophe" ('to turn it back'). The reason is that the concept did not exist in Latin grammar. --70.131.90.151 (talk) 08:21, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * W. Hübner discusses Latin anastrophe in Manilius' Astronomica (the Dodecatropos) in "Anastrophe in Manil. 2.953" The Classical Quarterly New Series, 51.1, (2001:313-314) where I see (p. 31) the useful suggestion, "On anastrophe, see M. Leumann, J.B. Hoffmann, and A. Szantyr, Lateinische Syntax und Stilistik (Munich) 1965, 2, 215-216." "In poetry," Hübner says, "it occurs as early as Ennius." Not that I would know myself one way or the other. --Wetman (talk) 19:50, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Classical Greek is in this respect just like Latin. And yet there is a Greek term.  I don't know why there is no Latin term (or rather, I don't know if that claim is true, or if it is, whether it matters).   But I consider the example dubious for other reasons: in Latin and Greek poetry, word order is routinely different than in prose, metri causa ("on account of the meter").  The opening line of the Aeneid quoted in the article could hardly use the normal word order, given that it is constrained by the rules of the hexameter.  So if the article wants to give examples from Latin or Greek prose, that would be fine, but I can't see using poetry examples as applicable. Paul Koning (talk) 18:42, 7 March 2016 (UTC)

The comment on the example from the Aeneid seems to say that is is merely by custom that "Troiae" is taken with "oris". The reason is, of coure, that it has to be specified what shores Aeneas came from. It would be absurd just to say "who came from shores". This enforces the interpretation that everybody uses. Seadowns (talk) 21:56, 10 December 2016 (UTC)←←

Yoda
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Anastrophe&action=edit# Yoda does not use anastrophe. Anastrophe is purposefully used sparingly--that is where its power stems. The contrast of a normal order (which is different in different languages) in Greek, Classical Latin and English (or other languages) is anastrophe. However, the character called Yoda uses so-called inversion in *every* statement he makes. This is not the same as true anastrophe.

He speaks using

OSV

= object - subject - verb

"When nine hundred years you reach, look as good you will not."

"Your father he is."

which is in contrast to modern English's usual typology of SVO.

By the way, this article also claims there is a 'normal Western order.'

There is no normal 'Western' order. European, West Asian and North African languages use SVO, SOV and VSO...

not all languages are like English. Welsh and Arabic and many clauses and phrasal structures in German, Dutch, French, etc. are examples.

Saying this is very Anglocentric and totally incorrect. Most importantly, Yoda is not using anastrophe. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.175.180.145 (talk) 06:09, 11 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I was about to make the same complaint: Yoda is, in all likelihood, a non-native speaker or a speaker of a deviating dialect---not someone who deliberately tries to reach a certain effect. (However, it could conceivably be argued that whoever wrote his dialogue is using anastrophe.)188.100.197.146 (talk) 14:08, 9 September 2010 (UTC)


 * I would be very surprised to find reliable sources calling Yoda's speaking style anastrophe. My instinct was actually to remove that and the Banjo-Kazooie examples as marginal, but it appears that other editors have removed the Yoda-speak in the past only to have it re-inserted. I've marked the assertion that this is anastrophe as dubious. Cnilep (talk) 06:05, 30 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I've gone ahead and removed both sections. If reliable sources call this anastrophe, by all means add them. Cnilep (talk) 12:53, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

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