Talk:Bergen Line

Name
Norwegian Railways call it the Bergen Railway on their own website! It's famous as the Bergen Railway. Books have been published on the subject calling it the Bergen Railway! So where's the precedent for calling it the Bergen Line? -- Necrothesp (talk) 20:12, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I hope we can agree that the best solution is to name all lines in Norway consequently, either as Foobanen, Foo Line, Foo Railroad or Foo Railway. According to WP:UE the English term should be preferred to an native name, if it is widely used—the former solution of Foobanen has been very confusing and created grammatical and editorial confusion as to the use (in particular related to the definitive article, but also related to the translations of the type Gardermobanen Line). The owner of the track, the Norwegian National Rail Administration, does not publish any railway names in English, with the exception of the Oslo Port Line (Havnebanen), indicating that they prefer Line as a naming convention for banen. Other than this I have done extensive searching, in published and online sources, failing to establish a single preferred naming convention—just like you I have found sources calling it both the Bergen Railway, the Bergen Railroad and the Bergen Line. Based on this and other considerations, I found it most accurate to use the Line. First, the best translation of bane is line, and not railway, since bane indicated a trajectory or way, rather than a railway (which is jernbane). This is most notable in Sweden, where they called independent railways for Foo Järnväg, while lines of the main system were often referred to as Foobanan, indicating a differentiation between a railway (an independent system) and a line (part of a system). Second, several railway lines in Norway are called Foolinje, where linje is a direct translation of line. It is of utmost importance to remain consistent in naming of all lines, especially since the Rail Administration has started renaming from Foolinjen to Foobanen. As for the NSB web site, note that this only an operator—official naming would have to be issued by the Rail Administration. And as the caution reader will note, on the same page the term Østfold Railway, Dovrebanen line and Rauma Line are used—it is staggering how inconsistent NSB is in their naming of the various lines on their web site, and can hardly be considered as an official naming policy. If you read the official NSB entry on the Bergen Line, they actually in the same article refer to the line as both the Bergen Railway and the Bergen Line. Based on this I find it best to use the term Line consequently in the naming of railway lines in Norway. Arsenikk  (talk)  21:14, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I understand all this. The problem is that the Bergen Railway is quite famous, and all references I have previously seen in English call it the Bergen Railway. -- Necrothesp (talk) 22:17, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, what about the "Bergen-Oslo Line" or the "Oslo-Bergen Line"? As the article is up for GAR we don't really need an edit war.Pyrotec (talk) 08:22, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That's even worse. I'm not going to edit war on the subject. I just think the point needs to be made that Wikipedia guidelines state "use common name" and as far as I've always been aware the common English name for this line is the Bergen Railway. This trumps consistency on Wikipedia. -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:37, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * My prefrence would also be "Bergen Railway" as the local name is "Bergenbanen", but if you look at Category:Railway lines in Norway they are consistently known as "Lines". 09:04, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So consistency (presumably imposed by editors) is more important than WP:COMMONNAME? News to me. -- Necrothesp (talk) 09:30, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Its common name is Bergensbanen.Pyrotec (talk) 10:12, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The guideline refers to common name in English! Although personally I would be far happier if the article was entitled Bergensbanen, as it used to be. I think you can take the translating everything into English thing too far. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:55, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Bergen Line seems fine to me. We are supposed to use English names for things here, after all. Manxruler (talk) 09:40, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Is "Bergen Railway" not English then? As to the "use English" rule, that's fine if the thing in question has a common English name. It's not clear that this one does, as it can be translated in two different ways, both of which are used on their website by the organisation which operates it. There do seem to be many editors around (bizarrely, usually ones whose native language isn't English!) who insist on translating everything into English, even if it usually appears in its native language even in English-language publications. That's taking things too far, which was my point. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:44, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

English-language book
There is an book in Norwenglish on the Bergen Line by Bjørn Holøs which is available at nb.no. I don't know if it's anything really worth citing though (very short, and reads more or less like a tourist brochure). -- Eisfbnore  talk 13:06, 10 April 2011 (UTC)
 * P.S: I see it refers to this line as the “Bergen Railway”, but I don't know if that's anything to worry about, since the english translations by NJK (and LTF) tend to be a bit clumsy &hellip; Eisfbnore  talk 13:38, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

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Length of line?
The current version of the "Bergen Line" page states a length of 371 km in the first paragraph and in the infobox. The complete rail distance between Oslo and Bergen is longer, with the exact length depending on the routing east of Hønefoss. On https://orv.banenor.no/sjn/doku.php?id=strekningsbeskrivelse:strekningsoversikt:bergensbanen Bane NOR lists a distance of 471,25 km between Bergen and Oslo via Roa, with 381,68 km for the part between Hønefoss and Bergen. If going via Drammen (as passenger trains currently do), the distance between Oslo and Bergen is 34,64 km longer; 505,89 km in total.

Hence I wonder what the 371 km are actually refering to. They do not match the Hønefoss to Bergen part (which, could be argued, is the Bergen line proper) nor any other relevant part, nor - obviously - the complete distance from Bergen to Oslo. , you seem to have added the length (as 372 km, later changed to 371) with. Do you, or anyone, object to a change to one of the values outlined above? GeorgR (de) (talk) 20:52, 1 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry I've only just noticed this. As per your question, the relevant length is Bergen to Hønefoss. I may look at that figure while I'm working on the article. Interestingly, the route diagramme gives 471 km and the article 371 km. Pyrotec (talk) 13:55, 30 May 2022 (UTC)