Talk:Caviar

what about France ?
Why no mention of the second largest producer of caviar ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:E34:EFD2:6450:918D:6483:4AA5:B5BD (talk) 20:38, 1 December 2019 (UTC)


 * In Français, phrase "caviar au aumbergine" is used for unrelated puree made of cooked eggplants. 81.89.66.133 (talk) 16:32, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

Miscellaneous
It would have been nice if the article placed at least as much an importance to the scientific data regarding caviar as food as it did discussing its cultural/religious aspects! I came to Wikipedia to find this information but what a disappointment! What a shame on this so called encyclopedia - should be called a religiopedia!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.171.195.216 (talk) 01:36, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

How about some mention of the milder caviar varieties eaten regularly on bread in Sweden, such as Kalles? --193.11.222.179 13:41, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

How about a mention of the current embargo on all trade of wild sturgeon caviar? 23:22, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

I once heard of one kind of caviar known as "Almas/Almaz" (not sure on the spelling) which comes from an albino sturgeon in the Caspian. Guinness world records 2007 said it is the most expensive in the world. Any more info?74.96.212.21 23:50, 4 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I did add a short paragraph on this, from my reading of the article I found, the ban is temporary right now, with the understanding that it will be permanent unless the countries involved come up with a good reply. If you can find a clearer source, or more news comes out, feel free to update it. Cheers, MartinRe 22:59, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

I have heard that the Sterlet is not actually extinct, but the species exists only as two isolated populations in the Volga river and another river system. Can anyone gather more information as to the status of the Sterlet? 10:35, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Hmmmm. 4 oz. of Beluga is $30 here in Azerbijan. It's not universally extremely expensive. Dobbs 17:29, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you, caviar gurus, for this page! This is a visually appealing page! Excellent photos and very well done! CousinJohn (talk) 01:35, 2 November 2011 (UTC)

Caviar and vegetarianism
The article claims that caviar is not vegetarian but since non-vegan vegetarian's eat eggs, and caviar is fish eggs then I would think caviar in and of itself would be non-vegan vegetarian objections by vegetarian based on cruelty to the fish objections related to the most popular means of harvesting the eggs. I think the reason why it's not considered vegetarian should be mentioned. --Cab88

A new Vegan friendly caviar has arrived. It's called Vegan Caviar. It is made of seaweed and doesn't contain any animal or fish products.

17:53, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Chickens aren't killed when their eggs are harvested, while sturgeons are.--66.32.233.224 12:06, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Interesting. Many who consider themselves vegetarians drink milk produced on a commerical scale.  Such milk is only possible through continual breeding for beef (or even veal) production. Dainamo 15:00, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Making the best of a bad situation, I suppose. A lot of people who don't approve of unmarried sex still enjoy nonsimulated porn. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.122.208.51 (talk) 14:36, 8 January 2007 (UTC).

I am a native Persian speaker and I should say that we don't call the " egg " caviar. it is totally false. the Persian word for egg is Tokhm. now, that is not even close to the word Caviar. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.125.54.90 (talk) 19:10, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
 * ‌Being a Persian native speaker does not qualify you to comment on the word caviar. Khaay, from which comes Khaayeh, which I assume you know it as a native speaker, is a Persian word for egg and the root for the word caviar. aliparsa (talk) 23:05, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Caviar production in California
I changed "southern California" to "California". I live in CA state and most of our sturgeon farms is in Northern CA and not Southern CA. Stolt Sea Farm's sturgeon operation is by Sacramento. White Sturgeon is also native here in CA, known as the Pacific sturgeon, Sacramento sturgeon, & California white sturgeon. -- Adeptitus 17:32, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Etymology of the word "caviar"
The article states:

"The word 'caviar' derives from the Persian word خاگ‌آور (Khāg-āvar), meaning 'the roe-generator'."

However, I've seen other sources, including Merriam-Webster Online, trace the origin to the Turkish word havyar. It may be that havyar has a Farsi antecedent, or perhaps not.

The article refers to khag-avar, which it translates as "roe-generator"; but this source also mentions the word chav-jar, which it translates to "cake of power" (ancient Persians used to eat it in stick form as a kind of elixir).

I am going to update the article to reflect these possible etymologies. Maybe someone more knowledgable about Farsi, Turkish and eastern languages can weigh in.

guanubian 19:48, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Caviar vs. Roe
I still lack to catch the exact diference between caviar and roe. Is the point in its color (black vs. other), cooking/salting or something else? --Koryakov Yuri 22:51, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the processing makes it Caviar. AFAIK, Roe is a generic term for the eggs of any fish. chavo 14:19, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Odd Statement RE: Prohibition
The article states: "During the Prohibition, caviar were smuggled in special cases shaped to fit in boots to aid the smuggling." I cannot find any mention of Caviar being banned during prohibition. I think that statement needs a citation. chavo 14:16, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

reply: you make it sound like your talking about the alchohol prohibition days in the US. that is not the only time things have been prohibited. bans on specific types of caviar have existed for years and are even now still in place for some of the species that are near extinction. perhaps the statement is poorly worded and should have said "during caviar prohibition" which comes and goes and evolves over the years. there isn't just "one" prohibition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.128.110.225 (talk) 21:49, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Cost
Why is caviar so expensive?

reply: numerous reasons

1. difficulty and quantity of harvesting, you only get a very small amount of it per fish. you get far more poundage of meat. the ratio is something like a few ounces of roe for potential caviar out of a 100 pounds of fish

2. only half the fish harvested have the potential for roe (it can only come from the female)

3. they have to be quite old to produce enough quality roe to be useful (10-20 year old females)

4. they cannot be fertalized or about ready to spawn (eggs deteriorate into unusable texture during mating)

5. not all species of fish have roe that tastes good enough to eat, many of the more common fish harvested for eating, are not used for caviar. or even more widespread is that they are simply harvested too young to produce edible roe.

6. there is actually a very wide range of prices. when people talk about the expensive ones ($100 and up per ounce) they often don't bother to mention that there are some which sell for $5 an ounce

7. they kill the fish to harvest the roe, which means they eventually deplete the number of 10-20 year old females available even if the fish being harvested isnt on the endangered species list

8. caviar is often considered an elitist delicacy, even though in past centurys it wasnt that big a deal. but what you find is that if you tell a rich person something is going extinct, they often want to eat it. some of the most expensive caviars are simply because some rich guy wants to eat the last of a species when there is almost none of that specific type of fish left on the planet

9. there isn't even that much demand for low price caviar; give an average person caviar and you'll find many people don't even like it. which is why you don't see large scale farming operations trying to maximize cultivation, they would rather harvest the rarist almost extinct fish and sell it to the stupid rich people who think paying $100 an ounce for something that tastes like salty snot makes them special —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.128.110.225 (talk) 21:32, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

This article almost entirely consists of imperialist bullshit defending the costs of caviar and insisting that other varieties of caviar of similar or even superior quality, such as salmon caviar, are inferior. What a whore "encyclopedia" this is. Muldrake (talk) 09:09, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Relax... What this article consists of is a depiction of the fact that caviar IS considered, and this is sourced, the "ultimate roe" (and prices demonstrate that social construction), as well as, for many public authorities in the world, caviar is a name that can only be apllied fo sturgeon roe, and not to others as salmon or trout. The Ogre (talk) 14:00, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
 * And yes, the artcile does need some work and some trimmings, I don't have the time right now, but I'll get back to it. The Ogre (talk) 14:05, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Caviar in 1800's America
On the radio (NPR?) it said that caviar from 1800's American fishing grounds was so cheap and plentiful that it was served for free in coastal bars like peanuts are today. Can anyone verify this statement? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Septagram (talk • contribs) 03:13, 30 March 2007 (UTC).

reply: it wouldnt suprise me, considering how much our oceans have been depleted in the past 200 years by commercial fishing operations there simply arent that many "old" fish anymore producing caviar in the quantitys that would have been available in the past. its much like reading about lobster back in the days of the settlers: it was once called beach rats, because all you had to do was walk down the beach and scoop them up, it was considered cheap peasent food and fed to slaves and servents

people with money dont want things until they think its rare and by than, its more expensive

Image
Hello people! This article urgently needs a good image of proper Caviar (that is Caspian Sturgeon Roe)! The Ogre 10:24, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Done! The Ogre 16:13, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

I dunno. I have often wondered about the difference between salmon roe (on sushi) and caviar. I think having all of these different types is either enlightening or misleading, but not unnecessary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.61.59.77 (talk) 05:44, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Images
Do we really need 5 pictures of caviar on one page? The page isn't even that large, it looks very overpowering. I'm sure one or 2 images is all that is needed.Ray harris1989 13:46, 30 June 2007 (UTC) Important thing is that it is not caviar - it is row of some other fish, colored artificially! Check the writings on the cans. Or is it a promo of some brand?


 * Well, no, it's caviar -- as the article says, caviar isn't exclusively sturgeon roe. In this case, the picture is of six different products from the "Tsar Nicoulai" caviar company in California. Good stuff, incidentally; they concentrate on sustainable sturgeon, but also do tasty roe from other fish. --jpgordon&#8711;&#8710;&#8711;&#8710; 00:28, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Russia and other Eastern cultures
Is the Russian culture really considered Eastern? I mean the most of Russia geographically belongs to Asia, but the coutry started its history as a European state, and took a lot of influence from the West. So now it is somewhere in the middle - the amalgam of two cultures. So I guess the sentence should be corrected somehow.

Caviar in Islam
I thought it was interesting that the author of this article chose to group all Islamic Hallal (Halal) regulations in a single line "In Islam all sea or river animals such as fish are lawful and halal." This is obviously not the case and it should be noted that Muslims of the Shi'ite sect (not all) have guidelines that prevent them from eating fish that do not have scales. It should be noted that in iran, the roe is considered a type of egg product and that the fish itself is seldomely eaten due to Islamic restrictions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shadowpoet (talk • contribs) 21:46, 12 February 2008 (UTC)


 * I could not agree more. I'm seeing this type of thing throughout WP with respect to Halal "regulations", Kosher "laws", etc.  Their application is FAR too broad, and obviously not true without exception.  Religious and or cultural dietary restrictions are far too complex to reduce to a single broad statement.  If the subject is going to be introduced, at least qualify it for accuracy. It would be better to leave it out all-together, IMHO. 73.6.96.168 (talk) 18:09, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

production details
I recently heard that caviar is produced in an inhumane way. The article seems to support this idea, saying the fish are clubbed (stunned) and then the ovaries are "extracted". The article doesn't mention how the extraction takes place or how eviscerated fish is treated. I was told that they are simply tossed back to die, and, I guess, economically that might make sense. Anyone have details?&#8201;—&#8201;gogobera (talk) 22:50, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Important info missing
This article tells me everything I want to know about caviar -- except what it tastes like. --Captain Infinity (talk) 20:35, 14 December 2008 (UTC) It tastes slightly salty with a fishy taste and it is delisious, if someone else paid for it. If you pay yourself, its nice too, but a bit bitter afterwards. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.249.180.63 (talk) 23:35, 14 February 2015 (UTC)

Metal
There is no mention of not using metal spoons (other than gold) with caviar as it "imparts an off flavor" and if metal damages the flavor why is caviar sold in tins? --Weetoddid (talk) 02:42, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
 * the tins receive a special treatement in order not no affect the roe. The Ogre (talk) 14:01, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

May be of interest
Watchers of this page may be interested of a requested move on Talk:Black Caviar (horse), requesting that Black Caviar (horse) be moved to Black Caviar, which is currently a redirect to this article. Feel free to express your opinion at the requested move if you wish. Cheers, Jenks24 (talk) 02:56, 2 April 2011 (UTC)

Snail caviar?
There are many google results of snail caviar. I think this is worth mentioning. Komitsuki (talk) 12:06, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

1906 Ban
This assertion is made with no details or backup "So many of the fish were harvested for the caviar that by 1906, a ban was placed on commercial sturgeon fishing." It begs basic questions such as a ban where? Placed by whom?" Randal Oulton (talk) 13:08, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

Pre or post inseminated
Are these eggs that have already been sprayed by the male. I.e., would caviar grow into fish or are these eggs just containing the female contribution?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 08:28, 15 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I think you're asking about insemination with male sperm. Correct?  They're not "sprayed" with paint.  lol   I just think it's strange to avoid direct terms in order to make a statement more "palatable" - if you'll pardon the pun.  73.6.96.168 (talk) 18:13, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed
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 * Note This involved the removal of the entire "History" section. Please feel free to write a new one in your own words and using reliable sources with inline citations. Voceditenore (talk) 11:45, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

UruguayCaviar
The Suppliers section contains a bit on Uruguayan-produced caviar that seems very much like an advertisement or, at least, the unreferenced words of a proud citizen.

''Uruguay produces Black River caviar, some of the finest Acipenser Gueldenstaedtii (Russian/Iranian Ossetra) currently on the market.[citation needed] The production process is organic and 100% sustainable. The sturgeon is raised in 8,000 hectares of river delta, allowing the fish to live as conditions in the wild. This particular river delta is the best choice outside the Caspian Sea to raise Caspian Sturgeon.[citation needed]'' Bth-root (talk) 11:02, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

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Varieties
Says there are "four" varieties but then lists seven? SquashEngineer (talk) 04:47, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

section: varieties
"The American caviar industry got started when Henry Schacht, a German immigrant, opened a business catching sturgeon on the Delaware River. He treated his caviar with German salt and exported a great deal of it to Europe. At around the same time, sturgeon was fished from the Columbia River on the west coast, also supplying caviar. American caviar was so plentiful that it was given away at bars for the same reason modern bars give away peanuts - to make patrons thirsty.[12] "

the above paragraph is really missing the DATE/YEAR when the described events took place and the conditions descrbed existed. it is a widespread problem in wiki articles that you get a piece of story with no time references whatsoever. i know just whinning about it does not help, but i dont know what else to do. perhaps it would be useful to have a specific tag like the citation needed that could be used to mark the missing time reference needed points. 176.63.176.112 (talk) 13:21, 31 December 2016 (UTC).


 * I take issue with the first 6 words. I've been out of school for a while, but I'm fairly certain that the term "got started" is not proper English.  And "The American caviar industry ..." seems far too broad and unreliable.  The entire paragraph seems suspicious.  Just my .02 73.6.96.168 (talk) 18:18, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

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Ingredients
Shouldn't we have an ingredients information section? I for example came to this page today trying to find out if caviar have eggs, in which case I doubt I'd like it as I hate eggs. Antonio egg hater Martin (User talk:AntonioMartin) 04:35, March 8, 2018 (UTC)

Why is there is no History section?
Why is there literally zero information on the history of caviar? This is a terrible article for lacking it. I actually did a search and for some bizarre reason the Wiki articles on caviar all obsess about where it's made and who is responsible for making most but absolutely no historical information. 108.170.143.83 (talk) 18:31, 13 March 2018 (UTC)
 * It is indeed a lapse! Lapses like this get fixed when someone like you or me decides to write a history section into the Caviar article. Got any interesting sources? --jpgordon&#x1d122;&#x1d106; &#x1D110;&#x1d107; 20:41, 13 March 2018 (UTC)

Industry
Sentences in this section seem incomplete grammatically and are hard to read. "In recent years Transnistria took a place in caviar producers list since there was built and put into operation modern sturgeon complex." "Design capacity of a fish-breeding zone is equal to 50-80 tons of commodity fish and 5 tons of caviar a year." SquashEngineer (talk) 12:36, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

42 kcal
Caviar apparently has 42 thousand calories in every tablespoon? That doesn't sound right. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.132.173.37 (talk) 01:03, 1 April 2019 (UTC)


 * This is a matter of understandable confusion, thanks for the question. Unfortunately, Calories (capital C, what you're used to in nutrition, sometimes called large calories) are identical to kcal, which does equal one thousand calories (small calories, an energy amount in physics). Moreover, people aren't generally careful about capitalizing Calorie, and so in practical scenarios, kcal and either calorie or Calorie are usually synonymous. 2603:7000:AE3E:24A2:A822:EB4A:F7AF:FB9A (talk) 15:33, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Iranian Caviar
Why is there no section on Iranian Caviar? Russia and Iran have historically been responsible for most of caviar production.

Their Almas caviar is the most expensive in the world

I have found very good references.

Anybody want to help? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert.smith.syd (talk • contribs) 21:36, 5 July 2021 (UTC)