Talk:Clan Kerr

The description of the crest is not right, maybe the picture is actually showing the clan badge rather than the armorial arms. --Alf melmac 14:47, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I agree, the Crest is the coat of arms rather than the clan badge which is depicted here. However, see further on articles on Heraldry PG Kerr --Pgk53 (talk) 03:35, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

What is the historical origin and significance of the "sero sed serio" motto -Petroleum

According to http://www.meacock.org/FamilyHistory/Kerrs.htm the motto "SERO SED SERIO" (Late, but in Earnest) is in reference to the Scottish victory over the English at Ancrum Moor (1545). The Kerrs played a decisive part after arriving late in the day." A Kerr

In earlier revisions of this article, "Clan Kerr", there is a Profile section which lists a Dexter Motto: Sero sed serio (Late but in earnest) and a Sinister Motto: Forward in the Name of God. There is also a link to the Clan Plant: Bog Myrtle (Myrica gale). Why has this information been removed? - PG Kerr. --Pgk53 (talk) 03:36, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

Left Handed Staircase
This doesn't make any sense to me. Castles spiralled their staircases clockwise ascending so attackers were forced to jab left handed and defenders could jab right handed. Reversing this, while allowing a left hander to defend left handed, allows a normal righthander to jab with his natural hand. So there is no advantaged gained by such design. I wonder if this is simply myth trying to explain a strange stair design. Alci12 14:50, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Re: Handedness

Actually, the height advantage, combined with the defensive aspect of having the interior staircase wall up against one's shield side, would provide a great benefit for a lefty defending a left-handed staircase.

Additionally, I have seen a study of the Kerrs of Scotland, specifically in regard to handedness. Kerrs in the traditional family homelands are three times as likely to be left-handed as members of other families in the region.

Lefties have always enjoyed an advantage over righties in hand-to-hand combat, as lefties are used to fighting against a right-handed opponent, while the reverse is rarely true.

O. Kerr


 * The interior protects the shield side of the right hander coming up just as much as the left hander at the top. Height is the advantage for the defender of either hand. It is as I gave above self evidently more advantageous for a right hander -v- right hander or a left-v-left than it could ever be for left -v- right whomsoever is the defender as they both gain normal use of the natural hand. If you can cite a credible accademic study that would indeed be interesting. However even assuming a higher than average number of lefties the majority would still be right handers and they would be disadvantaged by the design.


 * Wrt to L-handedness generally it is an advantage of sorts - as a fencer I have some experience - though I've certainly heard it much repeated that the number of left handers in medieval times were higher so perhaps the advantage would have been less certain. Proof apart from suits of armor are hard to come by to prove that meaningfully. Alci12 00:10, 15 July 2006 (UTC)


 * (First, some disclosure: I'm a right-handed Kerr, but the incidence of left-handedness in my immediate family is 20%.) I grew up hearing stories about the left-handed staircases, but I too fail to see how they would work.  I looked for the journal article mentioned in handedness without success (it says that nowadays Kerrs are no more or less likely to be left-handed), and indeed I could find no reputable sources at all on the handedness of Kerrs.  The text that had been there was copied directly from a webpage, so obviously it had to go.  But the source I cited is not exactly peer-reviewed! Ckerr 13:01, 31 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Strangely enough, the instance of left-handedness in my extended family (of Kerrs) runs at around 60%. Several were actively encourage to use their right hands when they were young, to no avail. Ka-ru 06:06, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

My father (born 1904) was naturally left handed but was forced to use his right hand during his school days. Consequently he went through life writing right handed but performing many other other tasks with his left. My brother and I are right handed, but both of my children are left handed. (D Kerr)

50% of the children in our family for 2 generations as far as I am aware are lefty's. My older brother was forced to use his right hand as a child in school, they actually tied his left hand down. (M Kerr)

Lamarck and the Kerrs
The sole reference provided in the section on left-handed Kerrs mentions that Andrew Kerr "taught" his followers to use their left hands, with the following sentence saying that Kerrs are more likely to be left handed. Taken at face value, this is preposterous Lamarckism. In the absence of a research paper or reliable book which says that Kerrs are more likely to be left-handed, I think all claims of genetic left-handedness need to be avoided. Ckerr 11:00, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciation of name
In the article, it mentions 2 pronunciations of the name "Kerr". One that rhymes with "care", and one that rhymes with "car". Shouldn't the article also mention the pronunciation that rhymes with "sir"? Here in Australia, pretty much all people with the surname Kerr have the pronunciation that rhymes with "sir", including a former head of state (Governor General, Sir John Kerr). This is not a major issue, but as it is a very common pronunciation, it seems strange to leave it out. Ka-ru (talk) 18:32, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I'd just like to point out that in Scotland the name does not rhyme with the word "care" or "car" at all. In Scottish English the "e" in kerr is an open "eh" sound like the "e" in egg - without any diphthong, and the "r" is distinctly pronounced/rolled.--62.249.233.80 (talk) 17:29, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Well if you can find a source to back your information then maybe you can add it to the article. Any unsourced changes to the article will be reverted.QuintusPetillius (talk) 18:07, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I may be wrong (I'm not a native speaker), but the sound file gives the care pronunciation, not the cur pronunciation that is transcribed. 195.187.108.4 (talk) 20:24, 8 March 2021 (UTC)

Scoto-Norman
This entry carries the 'Scoto-Norman' category. Can anyone explain why that is? I see no evidence to indicate Norman ancestry of the Kerrs. MarmadukePercy (talk) 03:40, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

stubborn relatives
if you thought that a relative was left handed and smarter than you, would you then sit them in a homeless mission for over a year?would you never write or call let alone do a few lunch meetings with them when you only could pay and they didn't affect your hunger?However this may be, are they in the long run very stubborn and very imposing?People with blood relations wouln't hardly steer you wrong but can too be quite stubborn and obnoxious and down right pestering so watch for this when you feel wronged and read some close examples and you'll probably handle it with to the best of your abilities. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.20.68.40 (talk) 14:51, 23 December 2011 (UTC)