Talk:D. M. Turner

Biography assessment rating comment
The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- KenWalker | Talk 07:16, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Whomever prettied this up, nice work.

Where is there confirmation of this birth date however, I have only found a birth year in all my searching.

It is not accurate to say he "he fell asleep" in the bathtub, as people on ketamine are not sleeping. I could not edit this myself for some reason. Try, he "dissasociated" or "while on", or "paralyzed".

Pseudonym?
Was "D.M.Turner" a pseudonym, and is his real name known? DMT seems rather too convenient an abbreviation. Jpatokal 07:15, 10 October 2006 (UTC)


 * yes, "d.m. turner" was a DEFINITE pseudonym. i don't think his real name is public knowledge, but i have a variety of articles about him / by his friends which confirm this. apparently he was some kind of businessman + was also an expert furniture carver, laser lightshow specialist + cactus enthusiast... hope this helps in some way... will phuq, 30th jan 2k7


 * according to the Erowid D. M. Turner Vault, his real name was Joe Vivian.

Jansen's book
Sources for wikipedia articles must be reliable third party publishers with a reputation for fact checking and accuracy. Do you have any proof that MAPS meets those qualifications and is not just a junk science, advocacy publisher? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.69.137.41 (talk) 03:59, 11 January 2010 (UTC)


 * I will not get into debates on subtleties within the wikipedia rules, or such slippery matters as "reputation". I can only say that: (1) it will be very difficult to find materials on psychedelic research printed by mainstream publishers, (2) the documentary sections of Jansen's book seem extremely legit to me, (3) the author seems well-published in respectable peer-reviewed journals (including BMJ), (4) the wikipedia article on reliable sources you have linked provides only a few criteria for source exclusion (self-published, etc), and I do not see how they can be immediately used to disqualify Jansen's book.


 * PS: I am moving this discussion to the Turner article talk page. InMemoriamLuangPu (talk) 16:47, 11 January 2010 (UTC)


 * In addition, here is a supportive 3rd party review of Jansen's book by Rick Strassman, an established and well-published researcher affiliated with the University of New Mexico: link. I am removing the "unreliable source" markers from the main page. InMemoriamLuangPu (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:06, 11 January 2010 (UTC).

The suitability of Jansen's book as a source for the purposes of this article is discussed and confirmed here. InMemoriamLuangPu (talk) 03:14, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

erowid link
why were the links to the relevant erowid pages removed? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.22.173.201 (talk) 13:37, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
 * erowid does not appear to meet the criteia for external links. MM 207.69.137.39 (talk) 05:31, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
 * please elaborate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.22.170.228 (talk) 20:16, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Did you read the policy WP:EL? erowid does not meet any of the criteria for a link that should be added: it is not Turners official site, it is not a legal copy of a score or script, it is not content that "cannot be integrated into the Wikipedia article due to copyright issues, amount of detail". The only other possible contention would need to be proved by you that it met WP:ELMAYBE #4 "Sites which fail to meet criteria for reliable sources yet still contain information about the subject of the article from knowledgeable sources." while not meeting any of the criteria in WP:ELNO. I dont think that you can make such a defense, but you may go ahead and try. MM 4.158.222.240 (talk) 04:40, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
 * at least D. M. Turners books stored at erowid should be linked. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.23.99.79 (talk) 17:11, 31 January 2010 (UTC)
 * If erowid is selling the book WP:EL #5 - we dont make a link to a site for commercial purposes. If it is because erowid has the full free text of the book, then you need to show that erowid has the legal right to display the content WP:ELNEVER #1. MM 207.69.139.142 (talk) 02:29, 1 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Update: WP:ELNEVER applies. The site clearly states that it does not hold the copyright nor have permission from the copyright holder to display the work. MM 207.69.137.11 (talk) 14:08, 8 May 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion
I've removed the prod as this is clearly not an uncontroversial deletion. The Little Book of Ketamine covers him in a section over five pages and he is discussed on a total of 14 pages. SpinningSpark 20:22, 19 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Hi! If you have access would you mind adding? Not a requirement of dePROD, of course, but helpful for others like me who also don't have access to this particular book. Thanks! Star   Mississippi  20:43, 19 January 2022 (UTC)