Talk:Dieppe maps

Is it really necessary to keep pointing out "before Cook" since most of Australia's western coasts were charted long before Cook. Here's a map of Australia 100 years before Cooks voyage.. Astrokey44 12:05, 27 October 2005 (UTC)

Hmmm, yes; most people are ignorant and truly believe Cook discovered the great southern continent. √αʑʑρεɾ 11:27, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

An interesting article that proposes that when an error in the transcription of the maps is corrected they show a large chunk of Australia's coastline. John Dalton 01:53, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

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This article definitely needs a lot of work, primarily because it is not about the famous Dieppe School of Luso-French map-making of the sixteenth century. Instead, this article is about one map from the Vallard Atlas (which has many maps), and the Vallard Atlas is one of many maps and atlases made by the Dieppe School. Whoever wrote this article should retitled it. Or write an article about the Dieppe Maps.

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I really feel this page needs some revision. It should contain reference to the work of W.A.R (Bill) Richardson, Associate Professor of Spanish, Portuguese and Brazilian Studies at Flinders University, and author of a 2006 book on the inscriptions on the Dieppe maps. He has been writing about them for the last 25 years. Nick Murphy

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I'm about to revise this page. It really needs to address the Dieppe Maps as a significant C16th school of map-making in the first instance. There also need to be corrections and additions regarding the Australian interest in Jave La Grande. I will try to include as much of the last entry as I can.--Nickm57 10:37, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

This April 2007 revision. What has been done here is to make sure the Dieppe school of maps themselves have been presented. Their significance is not just in terms of speculation that they may in part show the coast of Australia pre-contact with the Dutch. Have also listed the known Dieppe maps - although accounts differ slightly as to dates and maps included. The section on theory of Portuguese discovery of Australia was important to keep, as the "Java La Grande" feature of the Dieppe Maps is central to this debate, but previous entry needed expanding.--Nickm57 22:41, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Updates July 2007
Addition of Helen Wallis on voyage of Jean Partmentier and correction to dates of Harleian Map, according to Wallis, Herve and Pearson. --Nickm57 10:51, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

James McClymont
This summary addition is very interesting and useful - I notice McClymont's writings are only to be obtained through rare book dealers. Thanks Kattigara!--Nickm57 (talk) 06:43, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Edward Heawood... and subheadings
The new section added by Kattigara on Edward Heawood is again very interesting. However, I have moved it to "Alternative Interpretations" as it doesn't seem to fit in terms of chronology or opinion - originally being placed straight after Peter Trickett. Perhaps we should re-think the subheadings in the article - sort of "for" and "against" rather than what's there at the moment. Other views? cheers --Nickm57 (talk) 06:06, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Edit required
The latest additions to this page by Kattigara are, as always, very interesting, but some editing is now needed. In structure too, reorganisation is needed - the contents summary now appears after a long piece of text. I feel, Kattigara, that although your writing is always refreshingly interesting, some of what you've added here is not written in a style accessable to most readers. For example - "cultural conflict between the old cosmographic beliefs and the demands of an empirical concept of geographical and ethnographical knowledge". --Nickm57 (talk) 23:30, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
 * As per above, I have re-ordered the text on this page, and also provided new sub headings on the Jave le Grande debaters, as per my suggestion above (Feb 2009). I think Kattigara has done us a favour by raising this matter of the Dieppe maps as maps produced in France - we so often get preoccupied with what they tell us about the Portuguese. However, I still think Kattigara's very valuable material on Gayle K. Brunelle's writing needs some work and I haven't done this. I have however given this interesting new material a heading of its own "The Dieppe maps and French territorial aspirations" - but Kattigara might also like to perfect this? --Nickm57 (talk) 03:43, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I have rewritten the short introduction to the "Debates over the theory..." section, following Kattigara's major contribution, which seemed to make it repetitive. I also thought it important to allude to the fact it is a recurring contemporary debate in Australia.--Nickm57 (talk) 01:16, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Having waited awhile for a response from Kattigara, I have now slightly edited some of his/her contributions and added subheadings to break up the large amount of text.--Nickm57 (talk) 23:51, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Guillaume Brouscon Map addition
I don't have a problem with using Guillaume Brouscon's map at the heading - but it is such a poor resolution image, I wonder why! Any chance of a better copy? If not, why not keep the Vallard at the head and use Brouscon further on? I am not in favour of the sailing ship image - I cannot see what purpose this serves. PHG perhaps you could respond. --Nickm57 (talk) 09:29, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Absurd strawman about disproving Cook "discovered" Australia
''Discussion of the Dieppe maps in contemporary Australia is exclusively confined to the Jave la Grande feature. In the media, the maps are sometimes mistakenly described as Portuguese and they are often cited as evidence James Cook did not "discover Australia".''

What absurdity is this? The Dutch were in Queensland in 1606, and there were many more people after that, before Cook ever arrived. It is very easily disproved that Cook "discovered" Australia. So, why would any evidence be required to disprove something that is patently, and widely accepted as, untrue? Talk about a strawman statement. --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  07:32, 4 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Agreed - and Ive removed that.Nickm57 (talk) 08:03, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Legends
Why do you say Kathay is legendary? Polo really visited it. Kathay only is an old name for China: Kathay comes from the Kitai dinasty, China from the Qin one. Neither is the translation of the name Chineses use for their motherland, Zhong Guo. "China" entered the European languages about 1550, so in the age of Dieppe Maps (see Harper Douglas) Lele giannoni (talk) 12:31, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

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