Talk:Donovan/Archive 1

Greek language in high school?
Donovan has traveled to Greece several times, and probably owns a house there. Did he study Classical Greek when he was in high school? Does he speak Modern Greek? The main article would be improved if there was a little bit of information about his academic studies before he embarked on a life of music. 198.177.27.28 07:56, 1 June 2007 (UTC)


 * We don't have "high schools" in the UK. He attended St Audrey's Secondary Modern School in Hatfield (with me) where he would have picked up a smattering of French (only) from "Nancy" Stocker. He then went on to study engineering at a technical college in Welwyn Garden City. I question whether he ever went to art school as stated in the article.--Shantavira|feed me 12:22, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

First US big hit
I think that Donovan's first big hit in the US was Universal Soldier in 1965

No donovan's us first big hit was 1965's "catch the wind" which rose to no.23 in hot 100. LSM1204 (talk) 17:23, 30 June 2017 (UTC)

Dylan-Donovan controversy
Who wrote that Dont Look Back showed Dylan was intrigued with Donovan? I have read numerous sources claiming Dylan had a contempt for Donovan, highlighted by Dylan singing It's All Over Now, Baby Blue after Donovan had just finished playing a tune. Also, I've read that Donovan opened this meeting and jam session, by playing "Hey Mr. Tambourine Man," and claiming he thought it was a folk tune and "up for grabs" to the amusement of Dylan and his entourage. 204.227.243.16 16:06, 30 April 2007 (UTC)pkmilitia

If you listen carefully to the dvd of Dont Look Back Donovan asks Dylan to play It's All Over Now, Baby Blue .Dylan was interviewed after the meeting Dylan Digs Donovan and he stated he liked the guy.

Article name
Shouldn't the article be at Donovan? He is more commonly known by that name. See Naming conventions (common names). SimonMayer 05:53, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Ireland
Obviously, he's British. Just checked his site to make sure. However, note that his site is a .ie. He's also more popular here than anywhere else, and spent a lot of time doing the usual fading-celebrity stuff like narrating childrens books onto tape and appearing in stage productions in Ireland in the 80's

Is there any reason for this and is it worth mentioning in the article?

Kiand 23:58, 6 Nov 2004 (UTC)


 * hrm, seems he's a tax exile here. Admitted on his own site.... Kiand 00:00, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Rick Rubin
The author of the article is surprised by Rick Rubin's interest in Donovan. He is probably unaware that Rick Rubin was one of the original Beastie Boys, and that Donovan's daughter Ione was the long-time partner of Beastie Boy Adam Horovitz. This might explain the connection.

Photo
We really should put a better photo here.Like a photo of him in the 60s.

MrGater 12:58, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Adding an old photo or two might be nice, but I kind of like the contemporary photo. That's who he was, but this is who he is. The photo on the Universal Soldier page is pretty cool too. —221.12.170.77 11:40, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Beatles
Returning to London, he collaborated with The Beatles, contributing lyrics (and uncredited backing vocals) to the song "Yellow Submarine", which was recorded at Abbey Road Studios on 26 May 1966.

Put up a reference or strike this please? There is no record in standard Beatles literature of Donovan's songwriting participation in the Revolver era (or at any other time...).


 * I don't have a source for it, but I remember reading about 30 years ago that Donovan contributed to the writing of the song Rocky Raccoon (which appeared on the White Album) while he was reportedly with The Beatles in India with the Maharishi. I seem to remember that McCartney wrote most of the song. Sorry, I don't know where the support for this is. Yours, Famspear 16:14, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Donovan has stated he supplied Paul McCartney with the lines 'Sky of Blue, Sea Of Green' for Yellow Submarine  in A Hard Days Write  by Steve Turner A Little Brown/Carlton Book —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.122.61.207 (talk) 15:06, 14 September 2007 (UTC) It's a hundred percent sure that he did so and says so in his autobiography''The Hurdy Gurdy Man —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.75.56.202 (talk) 22:55, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

LSD Use
"Look on 'yonder misty mountain; see the old monk meditating rodhedendron forest; over dusty hills I ask you; What has been like being you? Through all level's you've been changing; getting a little bit better, no doubt; that doctor bit was so far out; looking through crystal spectacles."

This excerpt was from his song "Epistle to Dippy". I here many many references to LSD use in this song (as well as many other songs by Donovan, but they to numerous to mention) such as crystal spectacles (which is pretty much a loose description of how things sorta look on LSD) the "Doctor bit being so far out" (before it was ruled out for medical use, hippies and other intellectual adventurers would go to doctors to get LSD, often without any real reason for needing it) and shifting visions (Monks, Mountains, etc) Why am I the only person who thinks that this entire song (as well as "First there is a Mountain" and "Wear Your Love Like Heaven) was about an LSD trip or related experiences, and why doesn't this article mention the inffluence of LSD on his works? And If Donovan hasn't admitted to taking it (which chances 11 out of 10 he has) can we at least mention the similarities? Stevo D 03:36, 16 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I think you've got some of those lyrics a little bit wrong. It was a young monk. And I think it's "the doctor bit was so far out".  IMHO, we should not speculate here in an "original research" fashion, although it is basically OK to report the contents of particular sources that do. 221.12.170.77 11:22, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Let's not forget "Elevator in the brain hotel", which I recall Donovan saying (maybe in concert, maybe in his recent book) was the all-time favorite line of somebody (John Lennon?) 221.12.170.77 11:27, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * There are certainly references to durg use in his music. Not only LSD. To many to list but it really isn't denyable.

Not true "Epistle for Dippy" was written for a old high school friend who played in Donovan's first band (where he was a drummer!) after enlisting in the Army. Not all of Donovan's songs are about drugs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.75.56.202 (talk) 22:56, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Spouse
According to IMDB he's been married to Linda for 36 years; maybe the article should state that more clearly. Cranston Lamont 19:54, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

Meeting Gypsy Dave
Donovan didn't meet Gypsy Dave in St. Ives. When he was still living at home in Hatfield, he met Gypsy Dave first briefly in neighboring St. Albans, then later at a jazz club in Welvyn Garden City, after which they became friends. That summer they hitchhiked together to St. Ives.

The picture on his page
Instead of having a pic of what he looks like now.

There should be a pic of him at his peak of career instead —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 209.121.56.7 (talk) 02:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC).


 * I heartily agree. Does anybody know if there's a good pic available? Cgingold 11:00, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * K i changed it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 21:43, 2 January 2007 (UTC).

Photo changed to a proper photo. Brodog2525 21:15, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Still seems to be a problem. Did someone change it back? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.53.105.50 (talk) 19:53, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

NPOV
Who wrote this article - Donovan's press agent? It consistently violates NPOV. My feeling is it should be completely rewritten omitting all the hype and superlatives. 72.89.0.244 14:47, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

I don't know if it needs to be rewritten, but it definitely could use a lot less editorializing. Paroche 08:36, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

As a relative outsider, this article in its entirety seemed to be written by Micky Most ... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.53.105.50 (talk) 19:55, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

cleanup
The detailed descriptions of what's on the albums should go on pages for those albums. Also, maybe the drug bust should have its own article, since it affected a lot of other popsingers and could be considered a scandal in its own right. --Bluejay Young 06:19, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

call me, ice man..need to clear a few things up

Donovan's reaction to Brian Jones' death
Wasn't Donovan's song "Local Boy Chops Wood" about Jones? I notice the "Satisfaction" riff at the end of the song.Jayspears 22:34, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Mononymous persons
This article has been added to the category mononymous persons, and it seems overkill to also note that in a See Also link, especially since the link doesn't really have anything to do with giving the reader information about Donovan or a topic directly related to him. TimidGuy (talk) 10:25, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

Love letter
Someone above mentioned that the article reads like it was written by Donovan's press agent: I agree. The "wannabe Dylan" thing is casually brushed aside, and never mentioned again. I understand that Donovan is one of those people who sometimes thinks that he had a hand in every musical development since the mid-60s, and in his autobiography he talks at length on the 'I'm the "Godfather" of this / that' theme. What made me release the safety catch from my pistol is the chapter heading: "A Star is Born"

Come on people. That's just not right. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.151.100.43 (talk) 17:51, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Donovan's book
Reference is made in the article to his autobiography ... surely a proper reference could/should be given? Cosmo Lives (talk) 20:44, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Happy Mondays
I thought that the tour he did with the Happy Mondays was his big revival and what got him into the rave scene. Why no mention of the Mondays? They even do a song about him Donovan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.160.197.95 (talk) 05:43, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Citations please?
I wish this article was more well-researched. So much of it is just awful prose wise. I hope someone decides to do a rewrite of this at some point because it could be improved in so many ways:
 * The lead mentions trivialities such as his change of management and his musical "friends"
 * It also features quality phrasings such as "million-selling" and "he let music industry for a time" (how riveting and insightful that one is!)
 * He gradually "fell from favour"? That's not a phrase.
 * He underwent a revival due to the rave scene? Why? This isn't covered in the main and sounds implausible/irrelevant at the moment.
 * In October 2008 Donovan said something of little importance. In Dec 08 he was on the wireless. In Jan 09 he played a song... That 2000s section isn't telling us anything useful or interesting
 * SpliT WitH mOSt and OveRCAps-ed the titles...
 * "On 26th June 1969" Something was released. This tells us so much. And I really care about Micky Waller and Nicky Hopkins contributions because I simply wouldn't understand Donovan without this paragraph.
 * Cover versons: A million and one people covered a bunch of his songs&mdash;why are they important? Do they tell us anything about Donovan? Why should I care if Sarah McLachlan covered a song?
 * "Get Thy Bearings - Donovan Fanzine; available from getthybearings@btinternet.com" Quality link this one...

Original research called to say: "hey, I fancy writing some more stuff about Donovan and I think I won't put any citations for anything. Except for really minor stuff. That really needs citing.

Just awful. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.56.83.150 (talk) 05:10, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Hurdy Gurdy Man
Did Jimmy Page play on the track ?

Not on the title track, but he did play acoustic during the early album sessions.

The Hurdy Gurdy Man album sessions were done mainly in two parts, the first part in late 1967, the second sessions where done in April 1968. It was during the April 1968 sessions that the actual track 'Hurdy Gurdy Man' was recorded. Jimmy Page was not in the country at the time of the April 1968 session. Page had only been playing acoustic in his session work at the time.

Steve Rosen interview with Jimmy Page

SR You were playing acoustic guitar during your session period?

JP Yes, I had to do it on studio work. And you come to grips with it very quickly too, very quickly, because it's what is expected. There was a lot of busking (singing on street corners) in the earlier days, but as they say, I had to come to grips with it, and it was a good schooling.

Donovan stated that he wanted Jimi Hendrix to play but he was unavailable, so he asked for Jimmy Page instead but he was in the US with Jerry Wrexler. Mickie Most got Jeff Beck to do the electric guitar work which was wiped by Most. Finally Alan Parker was drafted in to do the electric guitar work.

http://www.zepagain.com/page_rosen.html

Regarding the title track those involved are listed below.

TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN

I have been contacted by Clem Cattini with regard to Donovan's Hurdy Gurdy Man I would like to confirm that the musicians on the record were as follows

Donovan Accoustic Guitar John Paul Jones Arrangement/Musical Director and Bass Guitar Alan Parker Lead (electric) Guitar Clem Cattini Drums

No other musicians were involved in this session The session was produced by Mickie Most and engineered by Eddie Kramer.

John Paul Jones

London 05/2005 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.151.144.159 (talk) 15:36, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

Irish domain
Why is Donovan's official website www.donovan.ie? The article does not mention any connection to Ireland. Mike R (talk) 17:43, 16 September 2009 (UTC) He currently resides in Ireland —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.131.20 (talk) 03:49, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Cleanup
I've been through the article and taken out as much of the POV crap and silly hyperbole as I could. I've also taken out the "arguablys", the uncited "first to do this and that"s and a fair bit of irrelevant crap and unsupported claims. What the article really needs now are some references as it's almost entirely devoid of anything that's actually verifiable. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia not a music review magazine or a Donovan fanzine. Richerman (talk) 23:48, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Rave scene
The introduction mentions "but he underwent a revival in the 1990s with the emergence of the rave scene in Britain", and furtheron there's one mentioning of a song that somehow was popular in the rave scnene, but there's no explanation whatsoever. I figure the song was samples and reworked into a rave song, but there are no further details. Someone should add, or we should remove the rave link altogether. Jalwikip (talk) 14:25, 11 November 2009 (UTC)

Mary Hopkin "covered" three Donovan songs?
"Happiness Runs" sounds like a cover, but "Lord of the Reedy River" and "Voyage of the Moon" were not officially recorded until 1971. These were done in 1969 (although there is a demo of "Lord of the Reedy River" on the Try for the Sun boxset. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.164.57.137 (talk) 00:34, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Donovan a children's musician
Donovan has done three albums for children, but he is not general thought of as a chldren's musician. He is just one of many pop stars to do so —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.166.144.19 (talk) 23:08, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

The author states that Donovan played at the famous Hyde Park concert in 1969 which was a memorial to Brian Jones. Not true. I was there, and as a huge Donovan fan I would have known if he played! I have pictures of the concert to prove it. If he had been there I would have the pictures. George W. Bang —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gwbassoc (talk • contribs) 18:13, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Incorrect birthdate
According to the liner notes on Donovan's first album, which he himself wrote, his birthdate is February 10, 1946. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.102.134.5 (talk) 06:20, 10 May 2011 (UTC)

Pop Chronicles interview
The Pop Chronicles, show 48, (track 7), credits the Donovan interview to a John Carpenter at KRLA 1110 radio. Is this the same John Carpenter as the director? DougHill (talk) 21:29, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Clearly it wasn't. The Rolling Stone describes the interviewer as "the late John Carpenter,  ... [their] first L.A. correspondent."  Fortunately, the director is alive and well.  He also does not appear to be among those listed at: John Carpenter (disambiguation). DougHill (talk) 21:45, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Category:Psychedelic drug advocates
Is this category justified? Is it justified by the current article content? There seems to have been some controversy surrounding the reporting by the News of the World. While his song lyrics may well suggest the benefits of recreational drug use, did Donovan publically advocate the taking of psychedlic drugs? Martinevans123 (talk) 09:53, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I was wondering about this myself. I'd be more comfortable with the categorization if the article had a dedication section discussing the subject. DonIago (talk) 14:07, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

Family section -- missing info?
Uh... I see nothing here about his two OTHER children?! You know... Donovan Leitch Jr., the actor/model/musician, and actress Ione Sky? That's, uh, kind of a big omission, isn't it?! I mean, one is his namesake, and the other starred in the critically-acclaimed and well-known movie "Say Anything..." opposite John Cusack, directed by Cameron Crowe. Seems like they merit some mention, wouldn't you think? Just sayin'. 12.31.187.178 (talk) 00:03, 9 June 2015 (UTC)
 * WP:SOFIXIT? DonIago (talk) 14:00, 10 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Currently buried in the "Rise to fame" section. Should be reformatted as the relationship and family info jumps far forward in time and should be moved to his personal life/family sections. Morganfitzp (talk) 14:49, 22 February 2016 (UTC)

The Wikipedia play-by-play
This always happens: Editors add info to an article as events happen. The result is a subjects history is given a certain depth until 2006 or so, and then suddenly switches into a comprehensive play-by-play. Is there a Wikipedia policy article that addresses this phenomenon? Morganfitzp (talk) 14:53, 22 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes, see Recentism particularly the section headed Article imbalance. Richerman    (talk) 17:41, 22 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much Richerman  . I suspect I'll get a lot of milage out of that recentism tag. Morganfitzp (talk) 03:54, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

Good Morning Starshine
Shouldn't the article mention "Good Morning Starshine" as one of Donovan's biggest hits (even as a cover)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.52.192.26 (talk) 18:22, 26 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Er, no - because he never recorded it. Good Morning Starshine was a hit for someone called Oliver. Whoever posted | that video on youtube got it wrong. Richerman    (talk) 19:52, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Good morning starshine was oliver's 1969 hit single. It rose to no.3 in billboard hot 100. LSM1204 (talk) 17:19, 30 June 2017 (UTC)