Talk:Dublin GAA

Dividing Dublin in 4?
This section looks like one person's hobby-horse. Joestynes 14:06, 14 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Who exactly is speculating about this division? Can we have some references to newspaper articles?
 * I would have thought incorporating 4 council logos in the GAA logo was a sign of unity rather than a prelude to division.
 * The population argument is clearly bogus, given Dublin's recent lack of success (in football, let alone hurling). Population is meaningless when so many are playing soccer or rugby.

Reply to Joestynes
No one is talking about it as far as i can see. Removed reference to it. (Gnevin 21:16, 19 January 2006 (UTC))


 * I remember the speculation about a split into North Dublin and South Dublin sides a few years ago, but not a split into four. Some blog discussion about the defeated proposals:, . The picture illustrating the inspiration for the new crest was quite interesting though. --Kwekubo 23:53, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Yeah i left the north/south discussion in. I never heard that dcb used does crest for inspirtation for the new crest.What i heard at the time was it look back on the county's history

Until theirs proof either way i though it best to leave the picture out (Gnevin 00:45, 20 January 2006 (UTC))
 * Longboat = vikings
 * Book = learning
 * Burning castle historicaly linked to dublin
 * Cant remeber the reason for the raven

Link to hoganstand for honors?
I've notice that a number of other county sites use the hoganstand for county honor should i do the same here ? see here I think i would clean up the site greatly (Gnevin 01:44, 20 January 2006 (UTC))

The original Dublin Crest featured a Raven on top of a gate in a yellow and black crest. circa 1886 ( around the time the GAA were officially formed)

Current Hurling Manager
Anyone know the current manager ? (Gnevin 21:57, 23 January 2006 (UTC)) Hurling manager confirmed on Hogan Stand (Gnevin 13:18, 26 January 2006 (UTC))

Format Change
The format of the articial is very poor in my opinion, i feel it would be better to move 5 Restructuring and 6 New County Crest to the top but i cant figure out a way to do it while maintaining the format County GAA accross wiki use.  Any Comments or Ideas?

(Gnevin 20:52, 23 February 2006 (UTC))
 * I dont see it being as big as a problem as you think it is. Basically i would move the sections under the information section, making them sub sections. I would also think about renameing that information section, cal it like history or background or something, information gust sound a bit to blah or something. Also going along with this i would split the Famous Players up into their respective game classes, as it looks like that all of them are multi-sport, i know one on the list is. As for across wiki use, might want to think about setting up a Wikiproject, pool the reources, give a place to cordinate the discussion in one spot. --Boothy443 | trácht ar 04:51, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

Hurling
Does anyone know anything about Dublin hurling? At the moment the 'History' section concentrates solely on Football, so I've devided the history into Football and Hurling. The football section is quite big but the hurling one is completley empty.--Play Brian Moore 13:26, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Unfortantly Dublin haven't achived much of note in hurling over the last 50 years, i added what i know will try to find more but as i said no much to add (Gnevin 23:18, 15 March 2006 (UTC))

Format change
Famous players was starting too looking alot like the current squad so i added current players table (Gnevin 21:57, 26 March 2006 (UTC))

Crest
The Crest Signifies three castles in flame (From Dublin City Coat of Arms), A Raven (from Fingal), A Viking Longboat (signifying The City's founding) and The Book of Kells.

I remember reading this or similar in the paper around the time of the lauch of the crest, the  current version isnt as good as this in my opinion , prehaps thier is a way to merge the 2 ? (Gnevin 20:51, 27 March 2006 (UTC))

Johnny Mcgee
When was his last game he wasnt on the panel for the either league. Should he be removed from current players and replaced with Dareen Mcgee? (Gnevin 13:58, 11 April 2006 (UTC))

Yep, sounds like a plan, Darren seems to be a regular now.

Frainc

Dublin Senior Football Club Championship
Does anyone think it'd be worth setting up a page for the current Dublin Championship, i would be happy to add in the scores if there is someone out there thats capable of creating a some sort of table to disply the draw with space for the scores? {Frainc 17:19 18th of May}
 * If you want to, i dont see a problem with it, the more information the better. BTW noticed that your not a member of the GAA project, you can find out more by following the links in the box at the top of this page. --Boothy443 | trácht ar 04:49, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I think it would be better to set up a page for the county championship in general, rather than just for this year's one; even if, to begin with, the article concentrates on the current year. If and when the article becomes big enough, any individual years with substantial content can be refactored out. jnestorius(talk) 09:57, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Humm you might have a point. --Boothy443 | trácht ar 04:59, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Well, i set up the Dublin Championship page, let me know what you think, its Dublin Senior Club Football Championship. {Frainc 14:30 May 20}

Famous Player
Should these player at least have postion and club if they are famous. This list looks terrible dublins famous player with no information. I'd also suggest removing the bulleted players.

Kevin Heffernan 			Left corner forward 	St Vincent’s Brian Mullins 	1974 	1985 	Midfield Lar Foley Robbie Kelleher Jimmy Keaveney 				St Vincent's Kevin Moran Barney Rock (Gnevin 22:40, 26 May 2006 (UTC))
 * Jim Stynes
 * Brian Stynes
 * Paddy Gogarty 			Corner Forward 	Raheny
 * Dessie Farrell 		2005 	Full Forward 	Na Fianna (More famous for his gpa work ?)
 * Paul Cullen
 * Seán Doherty

Jackeen
From Oxford English dictionary second edition:

jackeen (________). Anglo-Irish. [Irish dim. of Jack n.1] A contemptuous designation for a self-assertive worthless fellow. 1840 Fraser's Mag. XXII. 320 A buckeen, a jackeen, a squireen, or any of the intermediate classes. 1892 Q. Rev. July 138 _Jackeens' loitering about the Dublin Theatres. 1897 Sir C. G. Duffy ibid. Sept. 451 In manner and bearing he is a superb Jackeen.

If so it comes from

2. _ a. (As a common noun.) A man of the common people; a lad, fellow, chap; esp. a low-bred or ill-mannered fellow, a _knave'. Obs. _ b. Phr. to play the jack: to play the knave, to do a mean trick. Obs. see for more (Gnevin 21:16, 14 June 2006 (UTC))
 * 1548 Udall Erasm. Par. Luke vi. 65 A common poyncte of pleasure doyng, that euery iacke vseth.
 * 1596 Shakes. Tam. Shr. ii. i. 290 A mad-cap ruffian and a swearing Iacke.
 * 1600 Surflet Countrie Farme i. xvi. 108 They send them [geese] to the medowes_vnder the custodie of some little small Iacke, who may keepe them from going_into any forbidden places.
 * _1640 Day Parl. Bees v. (1881) 33 A halter stretch thee: such ill-tutord jacks Poyson the fame of Patrons.
 * 1682 Bunyan Holy War (Cassell) 354 But Mr. Unbelief was a nimble Jack; him they never could lay hold of.
 * 1746 Brit. Mag. 75 Familiar both with peers and Jacks.
 * 1610 Shakes. Temp. iv. i. 198 Your Fairy_Has done little better then plaid the Iacke with vs.
 * 1611 Beaum. & Fl. Knt. Burn. Pestle Induct., If you were not resolved to play the Jacks, what need you study for new subjects, purposely to abuse your betters?
 * 1668 Pepys Diary 23 Feb., Sir R. Brookes overtook us coming to town; who played the jacke with us all, and is a fellow that I m

From what I heard, the term Jackeen when referring to a person from Dubin, refers to the arrival of English soldiers in 1916, on arrival in Dún Laoghaire, Union Jacks were waved, although there was a an army base based in Dún Laoghaire at the time, so it wasnt seen as too unusual at the time. That's what I heard!! Frainc 2:12 24th June 2006.
 * I heard it was aimed at the people of Dublin ho waved Jack during the Royal vist of 1901 but apparently this isn't true.--Play Brian Moore 00:26, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

I've never heard of the Dubs being refered to internally as the 'Jacks'. Is there any reasonable source for this? If not, I think we should remove it. Lochdale 08:07, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
 * What source do you want it's common knowledge . I've seen it in newspapers, on the net , on hats and others things around croke park and on rte tv and radio


 * How about a link or two to such papers? I've never seen it and I've been going to Dublin matches since 1981.  Happy to be proved wrong.  Lochdale 21:55, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

As the old chant of the 70's goes The jacks are back The jacks are back the railway end is going barmy hill 16 has never seen the likes of heffo's army (Gnevin 12:32, 13 August 2006 (UTC))


 * I'm looking at a DVD on Heffo's Heroes and it makes no mention of it. It sounds right though.  I don't think the nickname has been used for a long time though or if it has I'm just very blind!Lochdale 21:57, 13 August 2006 (UTC)


 * As say above it's been used since before the 70's . It is generally used by fans of other counties rather than dublin fans/players  prehaps explaining the lack of it on the dvd (Gnevin 22:33, 13 August 2006 (UTC))


 * Perhaps then we could change the current description in the article? I've never heard it used and I think it's still a slur on Dubliners (though generally said in jest/fun).  Lochdale 23:05, 13 August 2006 (UTC)


 * As wiki says be bold (Gnevin 23:27, 13 August 2006 (UTC))


 * Feeling 'emboldened' by your comment, I removed the sentence from the Fans section. Lochdale 23:42, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
 * From todays indo [ It's not a business of them-and-us, culchie and jack. It never was.  Time to readd? ([[User:Gnevin|Gnevin]] 15:01, 14 August 2006 (UTC))


 * I would say no and here's my reasoning: Caffrey was using the term 'jack' to refer to Dublin as a whole and to Dubliners.  Same way he was using 'cultie' to refer to non-dubliners.  I still don't think it's a common nick-name for the Dubs.  Lochdale 15:56, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Is that Fellow Lochdale(Lowland Scot?), for real he hasn't heard the term Jacks being used by Dubs about themselves or the team, has he ever been on Hill 16??? Simply Ludicrous! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.198.148.183 (talk • contribs)


 * Perhaps you could use the four tildes to sign your posts? Heffo's heroes pre-dated me but I've been on the Hill since '83 and it's not something I've heard.  Lochdale 15:37, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Honours
This is a good addition to the articial but anyone else feel its makes it too long i'd suggest moving them to a sub page called Dublin GAA Honours with a see also that links to the correct on honours for each champo (Gnevin 20:02, 23 June 2006 (UTC))


 * Yep, i agree, as the additions are coming together, the page is ecoming too long. Dublin GAA Honours sounds like a great plan. Frainc 02:04 24th June 2006


 * Awe 100% better, good work frainc (Gnevin 18:01, 26 June 2006 (UTC))

Clubs
I noticed that they are adding Laois clubs on the Laois GAA page, should we do something similar with Dublin or have a lists page? Frainc 20:24 06 July 2006


 * That would be a fantastic addition to the page. Even a lists page would be great.  Lochdale 03:06, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Dont like this idea at all, dublin has over a 100 clubs how long do you want it to be . A link to Category:Gaelic Athletic Association clubs in Dublin. Is the best way forward in my oppinion (Gnevin 17:29, 22 August 2006 (UTC))


 * Even a link would be fine then. Just something to highlight the Dublin club scene.  Lochdale 18:48, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Why did you remove the link i thought you wanted it (Gnevin 20:40, 28 August 2006 (UTC))

You'll Never Walk Alone etc.
I don't think it's appropriate to post a link to the Dublin crowd singing "You'll never walk alone" in the mid-70's as being dispositive of anything. Firstly, it's been a long time since that was last sung in Croker (last match I was at against Laois on the Hill I never heard it) and I have not heard it in years. Secondly, it's more complicated than that. Dublin is a city on the eastern seaboard and has more direct contact with England via radio, tv, phone etc. This is particularly relevant back in the 70's and before as the rural counties had much less exposure to such things. That obviously has changed but I think it's very POV to use a song from the 70's to damn Dublin fans today. Lochdale 19:41, 25 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Ok firstly a few facts I am a dub so i've no intention of damning the dubs
 * Removing the comment makes the articial pov in the other extreme, I add the link and the comment as a way of balance.
 * Also the whole dublin being soccer supporters mainly started in the 70's and so is an apt comment/link to make.

The whole point is to balance the articial and the link/comments gives a good understanding of how dubs= soccer fan began or at least it in it very early on. Am tempted to RV but will wait for your reply

(Gnevin 20:51, 25 August 2006 (UTC)) P.S i comprised with out over the jacks thing where the balance of evidence was in my favour but i odo feel strongly that this section should remain(Gnevin 20:53, 25 August 2006 (UTC))


 * I respectfully disagree. In fairness, the balance of evidence was not in your favour.  Dublin are not, nor have they been, commonly referred to as the "Jacks".  It's unfair to suggest otherwise.  The article does reference the fact that some people consider the Dublin crowd to be soccer fans or at least to be heavily influenced by soccer.  THat said, adding a link to a song sung more than 30 years ago is absolutely POV.  I have never heard that sung and I've been following Dublin since the win in '83 (when the brought the cup to Joeys).  It's just not that common and it shouldn't be in the article.  And when we're at Croker (once Mayo go away) in 3 weeks it isn't going to be sung either! Now the song "Come on you Boys in Blue" is a different story.  Lochdale 22:50, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Here is how the article currently reads


 * The supporters of the Dublin team on match days, to which the name The Dubs is commonly applied, are often called one of the best or one of the worst set of fans within GAA circles. This contradiction is best explained by the fact that while many consider the colour and noise that Dublin support brings to the game to be unrivalled, others consider many of the Dublin supporters to be soccer fans, because of the anglo sports orientation of the Dublin population at large.  I think that's a fairly balanced POV.  Adding that link is just belabouring the point.  Lochdale 22:52, 25 August 2006 (UTC)


 * The balance of evidence was more than with me i've read at least 3 articials in the national press where the dubs where called the jacks and you have []

[] thats with out reading the forums at that site, I dont see the harm in that link in fact i think it adds to  the artical as it explains where it comes from. Am rv as such. Maybe in the 20 years you've followed the dubs that song had not being sung doesnt mean its never been song before or that it didn't helped created the dubs are soccer fans thing (Gnevin 00:38, 26 August 2006 (UTC))


 * You've posted from overheardindublin.com. Not exactly the Indo now is it?  The 'Jacks' is not a common nickname for the Dubs (which is their nickname).  Moreover, just because they sang a song associated with Liverpool FC does not mean that they are suddenly soccer fans.  As I noted, it's a complicated issue.  Dublin fans would have been much more exposed to soccer etc. living in a big city on the eastern seaboard.  A song that has not been sung in more than 20 years does not belong on this website.  The article, as is, covers this issue (as I noted above) and the link is just POV.  Lochdale 18:53, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

[] [] [] Is that enough for you ? (Gnevin 19:11, 26 August 2006 (UTC))


 * Yep. Thanks for the links.  I've never heard it.  Looking at my Heffo's Heroes DVD right now and they make no mention of it.  Played for Vincents' for years and heve never heard the term.  Feel free to add it back into the article.  I still think that they song is POV as just isn't needed.  It's creating an issue that doesn't need to be created.  Lochdale 19:21, 26 August 2006 (UTC)


 * I think we need to remove the reference to "you'll never walk alone" or at least remove the flags and songs. Flags have been a part of GAA matches for a long time regardless of what they were doing in England.  Lochdale 20:13, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Excellent changes to the fans section Gnevin. Nice touch with the links too. After today though, not sure I can visit this page for while. Vaughn uses far too much bleech, clearly affected his ability to, you know, score from frees!!!! Lochdale 17:20, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Arranging regular delays?
The first paragraph of this article seems incorrect. How does the Dublin County Board arrange delays to inter-county matches? Lochdale 20:08, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Vandilism again, page is suffering for it alot .just remove where you see it (Gnevin 20:41, 28 August 2006 (UTC))


 * Will do. Have the page on my watchlist so will keep the eye out. Lochdale 21:34, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

The Fans section
Please post here before changing the fan section of the articial .An the moment it is NPOV most peoples changes tend to push it away from NPOV (Gnevin 17:33, 31 August 2006 (UTC))
 * "Dblin spporters are probably the best and most vivid fans in the contry." lol think this is a bit controversial. NPOV? Derry Boi 17:41, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I've removed the uncited claims that Dublin footballl supporters are crucial to keeping the GAA afloat. No doubt it'd be a serious blow to the GAA if Dublin didn't exist, but you would need a good source to back up claims that it would be the end of the organisation. Tameamseo (talk) 19:47, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Famous Players
The famous players section only refers to footballers, should it be in the Gaelic football section? Frainc 00:06 17 November 2006
 * Yes, it doubtful dublin will produce any famous hurlers in the next few year (Gnevin 15:40, 24 November 2006 (UTC))

Gaelic footballers who switched codes
I have being working on the article Ireland national football team (IFA) and have noticed that at least three players - Jack Kirwan, Val Harris and Con Martin - who turned out for this team also played gaelic football for Dublin. Does anybody here have any info on Kirwan. He is mentioned as a Dublin footballer at the article Players who have converted from one football code to another. Is he the same J. Kirwan mentioned in Dublin GAA Honours as an 1894 All-Ireland winner. Plus is J. Ledwidge mentioned in in 1898 and 1899 All-Ireland the same person as Joseph Ledwidge. Djln --Djln 13:48, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Dublinnewcrest.png
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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Geographic county versus GAA "county"
By my count, HighKing has reverted my edits 2 times. That places him in danger of breeching 3RR. I think that he should explain his behaviour. Laurel Lodged (talk) 18:32, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

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