Talk:Ellis Paul

Boston School
Does the Boston School of song writing really exist? I have never seen or heard it mentioned anywhere outside the Globe articles cited.
 * That is something better taken up with the author(s) of the Globe articles. Kmzundel (talk) 15:10, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

Length
I know this might seem like POV, but to me the verbosity and length of the article seems to suggest Ellis Paul is a major folk artist. I am not sure if that is the case. It rivals the length of Woody Guthrie's entry! I was surprised Ellis Paul even +had+ an article...
 * The length of a Wikipedia biography of a living person article (WP:BLP) in no way correlates to the degree of that person's notability. (See article for Grammy-award winning songwriter Bill Miller.) A well-written, well-sourced article is simply that. With the number of cited sources in the article, in addition to the list of Paul's awards, I would be surprised if Ellis Paul were NOT represented in Wikipedia.Kmzundel (talk) 15:06, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

Paul's name
Why the change of name to Ellis? Headhitter (talk) 16:06, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Do you mean why a stage name? Or why in particular "Ellis"? Are you saying this is a fact that should be included in the article? Kmzundel (talk) 15:12, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just added archive links to 8 one external links on Ellis Paul. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20110807145049/http://bceagles.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/bc/sports/m-otrack/auto_pdf/outdoor-top-times to http://bceagles.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/bc/sports/m-otrack/auto_pdf/outdoor-top-times
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20120304081748/http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/6057683/MA/Cambridge/Ellis-Paul39s-20th-Anniversary-Weekend/Club-Passim to http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/6057683/MA/Cambridge/Ellis-Paul39s-20th-Anniversary-Weekend/Club-Passim
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100807104653/http://www.nimbit.com:80/ellis-paul-day-in-boston/ to http://www.nimbit.com/ellis-paul-day-in-boston
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20070927234943/http://www.ebdailynews.com/article/2007-5-11-ellis-paul to http://www.ebdailynews.com/article/2007-5-11-ellis-paul
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20140727195247/http://www.albertwhitman.com:80/content.cfm/bookdetails/The-Hero-in-You-(Book-and-CD) to http://www.albertwhitman.com/content.cfm/bookdetails/The-Hero-in-You-(Book-and-CD)

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External links modified
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 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20070202225507/http://alpha.fdu.edu:80/wfdu/Folk%20Alliance.htm to http://alpha.fdu.edu/wfdu/Folk%20Alliance.htm

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Album
Please note related move request at Talk:Say_Something_(A_Great_Big_World_song) In ictu oculi (talk) 09:25, 19 April 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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I have just modified 6 one external links on Ellis Paul. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927011658/http://www.hcnonline.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=6963646&BRD=1574&PAG=461&dept_id=532207&rfi=8 to http://www.hcnonline.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=6963646&BRD=1574&PAG=461&dept_id=532207&rfi=8
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070202225507/http://alpha.fdu.edu/wfdu/Folk%20Alliance.htm to http://alpha.fdu.edu/wfdu/Folk%20Alliance.htm
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080219102904/http://www.timesrecord.com/website/archives.nsf/56606056e44e37508525696f00737257/8525696e00630dfe05257371006d0575?OpenDocument to http://www.timesrecord.com/website/archives.nsf/56606056e44e37508525696f00737257/8525696e00630dfe05257371006d0575?OpenDocument
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100115070558/http://www.readthehook.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/09/ellis-paul-5 to http://www.readthehook.com/blog/index.php/2010/01/09/ellis-paul-5
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120304081748/http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/6057683/MA/Cambridge/Ellis-Paul39s-20th-Anniversary-Weekend/Club-Passim to http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/6057683/MA/Cambridge/Ellis-Paul39s-20th-Anniversary-Weekend/Club-Passim
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927234943/http://www.ebdailynews.com/article/2007-5-11-ellis-paul to http://www.ebdailynews.com/article/2007-5-11-ellis-paul

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Third Party Opinion request
I respectfully request a Third Party opinion regarding removal of the sound sample file by User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz. The sound sample file is in compliance with guidelines noted here Template:Non-free audio sample and has been included in the article for 10 years including at the time the article went through peer review and received Feature Article status. Kmzundel (talk) 00:04, 23 March 2017 (UTC)
 * I am a seasoned Wikipedia editor, and after reviewing the history, I agree with Kmzundel, especially since this is a Featured Article.--Dthomsen8 (talk) 16:02, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Until recently, there were three sound samples, and now there are two.

Kmzundel writes above: "The sound sample file is in compliance with guidelines noted here Template:Non-free audio sample". This lists a number of conditions, among which the first is: "the sample is being used for commentary on the recording in question".

Hullaballoo Wolfowitz twice removed this third file; the second time, with the comment "no critical discussion of track, and there are multiple other examples of subject's work -- statement that it was used in a film does not call for nonfree file support"

Here's the description that was provided for the sound sample:


 * Sample of Ellis Paul's "The World Ain't Slowing Down", originally recorded for Translucent Soul and included as the romantic theme in the 2000 comedy film Me, Myself and Irene

And here are the only mentions of the song I find elsewhere in the article:


 * 1) Highlights of the year 2000 included Paul singing the National Anthem at Fenway Park, and having his song "The World Ain't Slowing Down" chosen for the theme song in the Farrelly brothers movie Me, Myself and Irene starring Jim Carrey and Renée Zellweger.
 * 2) In 2009, country musician Jack Ingram chose to record a song written by Paul. According to CMT, Paul's "The World Ain't Slowing Down", may be the song that takes Ingram to the "next level". Ingram says "It'll be fun for me to expose people to a fantastic song from an artist who's had a 20-year career of being a very successful folk artist."

(I've stripped two references from the latter: these seem irrelevant to this discussion.)

Have I overlooked anything here? (I don't claim to have examined this matter closely.) If I haven't, then I see little or no "commentary on the recording in question"; and if I'm right about this, then inclusion of the file fails the first condition stipulated in the template that's cited.

Of course there are other possibilities, such as that there was once critical commentary on the recording but this commentary disappeared at some stage. -- Hoary (talk) 23:13, 3 April 2017 (UTC)
 * IMHO, the usages seem fine for a couple reasons. I would say they conform to the policy Wikipedia:Non-ftee_content_criteria here regarding fair use length and context (recordings are specifically providing context to the matching text), and more importantly, if these items were okayed during the peer review / featured article reviews they can be assumed to be legit uses. If there is some disagreement, I'd suggest reverting them and asking for another peer review rather than just removing them. --Dannygutters (talk · contribs) 15:38, 6 April 2017 (UTC)


 * If the main criticism is the lack of "critical discussion of track", then I think the audio clip for "The World Ain't Slowing Down" could be restored with a slightly different caption, possibly based on the information that it was "the song that takes Ingram to the 'next level'". That would be comparable to the other soundbytes and their level of supporting discussion. Mary Mark Ockerbloom (talk) 18:55, 8 April 2017

(UTC)

One of comments by User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz in support of removal was "excessive use" of the sound sample. (The article originally contained three.) I would like to point out that the Bob Dylan article contains seven sound samples. So three sound samples do not seem excessive in comparison. Kmzundel (talk) 11:39, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just modified 9 external links on Ellis Paul. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927223813/http://www.visnat.com/entertainment/music/folkwax/mp3/bio.cfm?artistnumber=1368 to http://www.visnat.com/entertainment/music/folkwax/mp3/bio.cfm?artistnumber=1368
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070927223738/http://www.visnat.com/entertainment/music/folkwax/backissues/folkwax_042.cfm to http://www.visnat.com/entertainment/music/folkwax/backissues/folkwax_042.cfm
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FA criteria
The article needs improvement to meet the WP:FA criteria. Entire sections (awards) are unsourced and the article has not been sufficiently updated since 2014, although the musician appears to still be active in 2021 (t &#183; c)  buidhe  00:58, 28 November 2021 (UTC)