Talk:Fishing/Archive 1

Fish shooting
What about hunting fish with firearms?--JianLi 00:02, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Heading formatting
Thanks to Gaius Cornelius for the instructive link to proper heading formatting. The point that I was trying to make with that edit, although I was in error in starting at level H1, is that what are now numbered as sections 1.2, 1.3 and 1.4 are all given equal valence with 1.2 being entirely empty. I was of the opinion that it should be 1.2, 1.2.1 and 1.2.2.

No matter, though, whatever. I'm not wedded to any of this. It's just a hobby for me, after all :-)

Dave 03:06, 10 November 2005 (UTC)


 * Dave: I see what you mean. Sorry if I was a little hasty. Actually, I am pretty sure that it was me that created the heading "Ancient archaeology", I had thought to put in that section much of the text that ended up in the first paragraph of origins and the heading was left, as you point out, empty. A bit of sloppyness on my part! Something should be done. I am inclined to simply delete the "Ancient archaeology" heading altogether. Thanks for contributing Gaius Cornelius 17:31, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

Rewrite
This article is one that has been bothering me for some time, for much the same reasons as other commentators have given below.

I am working on a complete rewrite which I shall be posting very soon.


 * Ahh, I feel better now. Time for a break. I'm very hungry for anything but fish! Gaius Cornelius

I plan to replace much of the original text, some of what is in the current article shall be moved to a new article Angling.

When I am done, I plan to move some of the text from this talk page to the angling talk page.

Gaius Cornelius 16:08, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

I've added the above notice because the article seems to overlook the fact that fishing is a very old subsistence method among many peoples all over the world. Let's try to ensure a global perspective. &mdash; mark &#9998; 1 July 2005 15:54 (UTC)
 * Will there be any mention of Sport Fishing, in other words, Bass Fishing? More specifically the Bassmaster, has worldwide recognition, and there is nothing about it in the Wikipedia.
 * I don't know anything about Bass fishing or Bassmaster, but there are already articles on angling, sport fishing and specifically Bass fishing and I guess these articles would be the right place for it. The term Fishing is generic and the current version of the article reflects that. Gaius Cornelius 19:03, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

"How to Fish" is Highly Myopic
I just wanted to say that the "How to Fish" section is so very narrow that it is silly. Rather than give an overall description of how to fish, this author it seems, has solely focused on small river and stream fishing. Furthermore, the author describes "How to Fish" as if Fresh Water fishing were the only way to fish. The techniques that are described in this article do not apply to a very large portion of fishing, they seem to be limited in scope to Northern Temperate areas with small lakes and streams. These techniques would not even have all that much application in the Great Lakes for that matter, much less the Atlantic, Pacific, Mediterranean, the Black Sea, The Gulf of Mexico, Indian Ocean, and on and on and on.

To describe "How to Fish" in such a way is errant. That article would be more aptly entitled: "How to fish in Northern Temperate Streams and Small Lakes"

I will edit the title and leave the article. (which is not a bad article for that specific type of fishing, but is severely lacking to be entitled "How to Fish")

Also, Bonito do not have large teeth. The fish pictured next to the article has clearly visible teeth. It is some type of Mackeral. Here in Florida, that would most likely be a Kingfish, a.k.a. King Mackeral. It may be a different species depending upon where it was caught.

Edits
The external link I just recently added(Its How You Wiggle Your Worm) is from my own site. Just making this clear before it is removed for copyright violation. Anyone from Wikipedia has complete persmission to link directly to any of our pages.

-


 * I removed a link placed recently partly because it is a local United States page with lots of commercials, but mainly because the link is in conflict with the copyright message placed on the cite, stating that "links to specific pages internal to our site are not permitted without our written consent". --Arnejohs 06:38, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Encyclopedia Brittanica on Fishing
There's a HUGE amount of public domain text available on this subject at http://www.gutenberg.net/dirs/1/3/6/0/13600/13600-h/13600-h.htm should anyone be interested in adding to this page or spawning more articles. --Tagishsimon
 * "spawning"? now really... -- Visviva 13:29, 7 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Ice fishing
A substantial section of text was recently added to the sub-section on Ice fishing. I have moved the text to the Ice fishing article -- I hope that's OK. Gaius Cornelius 20:27, 29 November 2005 (UTC)


 * It looks good, Gauis Cornelius. It's a much better fit there than in this article. Dave 23:09, 29 November 2005 (UTC)


 * I am glad that it looks good to you. Thanks, once again, for your contributions. Gaius Cornelius 09:50, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Aquaculture
I have no real variance with the accuracy of what's contained in the fairly-new Aquaculture section. What I'm wondering is why it's contained in an article on fishing. There's no reference within the section to what aquaculture has to do with fishing. I can hypothesise tenuous connections between aquaculture and fishing but those connections occur through fish planting (stocking) or sea ranching or similar and there's no mention of those anywhere in the article, either. At best, I'd recommend that a link to the main Aquaculture article be put in the "See also" section or some such. Aquaculture is simply a form of animal husbandry and including a section on it would be like including a section on pork production in an article on hunting. I propose deletion of the section, notwithstanding the careful prose that's gone into it. Dave 17:03, 30 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Good point, and your hunting/pork analogy seems fitting. I thought that there ought to be some reference to aquaculture, but maybe I have overdone it. I will have a think... Gaius Cornelius 19:29, 30 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Job done, I have taken it out. Gaius Cornelius 01:24, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

Fishing as a blood sport
There have been some recent reverts relating to whether fishing is a blood sport. At least one of these reverts has overwritten an unrelated, but perfectly good, edit &mdash; please take more care.

Whether fishing is a blood sport should be discussed here and not be the subject of an edit war. Let us try to reach a consensus.


 * Delete: I belive that this article is about fishing in its most general sense: the worldwide and time honoured practice of gathering fish of which recreational fishing is just a small part. As such, it is not appropriate to include this article in a list or category of blood sports. The word fishing may sometimes be used in a more restricted sense of angling or sport fishing and these are indeed blood sports, but they already have their own articles. Gaius Cornelius 01:24, 4 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I also note that fishing is already a sub-category of the Category:blood sports. Generally, an article should not be in both a category and in a sub-category of that category. Gaius Cornelius 01:32, 4 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete:"Fishing is a very ancient practice that dates back at least to the Mesolithic period which began about 10,000 years ago...." (from the article).... as a way of producing food. Today the total fish production is close to 150 million tonnes every year in commercial fisheries worldwide. The new concept of recreational fishing (main articles: Angling and Sport fishing) constitute a minor part of the total fishing activity in catch terms. Placing the Fishing article into the Blood sport category indicates that the article is about a sport activity already covered by several articles. ---Arnejohs 07:08, 4 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete: In general, fishing is not usually a sport. -- That Guy, From That Show! 07:12, 4 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete: It might be argued that angling, sport fishing or recreational fishing are blood sports. One cannot argue that fishing is a blood sport since fishing is a more inclusive term that also subsumes subsistence, food and commercial fishing. In the entry for blood sport, it says that "a blood sport is a sport". In the entry for sport it's defined as "a physical and mentally competitive activity carried out with a recreational purpose for competition, for self-enjoyment, to attain excellence, for the development of a skill, or some combination of these." Commercial, subsistence and food fishing meet none of the criteria in this definition. Hence, fishing is not, by definition, a blood sport. &mdash; Dave 05:49, 6 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, now that I think about it more carefully, I will argue that angling is also not, by definition, a blood sport. Angling merely refers to a method of fishing and says nothing about the purpose to which that end is put. Angling can be used for food and subsistence fishing. There are also many commercial fisheries which use hook and line. Hence, angling is not, by definition, necessarily a sport. I do think it's clear, however, that recreational and sport fishing are blood sports. I hereby move for deletion of the category from the angling article, as well. I'll start a parallel discussion over there if anyone thinks that's necessary. &mdash; Dave 05:56, 6 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep Please note I have been fishing since I was a boy and continue to fish for "Muskies" :) Blood Sport (hunting) def'n "A blood sport is a sport involving bloodshed or the killing of animals for food, pest control, or entertainment." If fishing falls within this definition the category should stay.  If not, then it should be removed from Category:Bloodsports article Blood Sport (hunting).  Cordially SirIsaacBrock 01:45, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

Conserving links
Some of these may yet prove useful.


 * THE TECHNOLOGY AND PRODUCTIVITY OF ANCIENT SEA FISHING, Tønnes Bekker-Nielsen (pdf)
 * Project Gutenberg: The Compleat Angler
 * Traditional uses of plants for fishing in Micronesia, Dr Mark Merlin (pdf)
 * The Coral Reef Alliance
 * EcoViability
 * Reef Central
 * Fishing gears (by FAO)

Kenny "The Jet" Smith's Gone Fishin'
Who has seen the NBA on TNT during the playoffs? This should get some recognition here and on the Wikifile for Kenny Smith.

Fish traps
An editor has proposed that fish traps material should be broken out in Summary style from this article into an article titled fish trap. Anyone interested in this is invited to view the discussion over in that page. cmh 00:08, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Delete image


I have deleted the image shown. It is a nice picture but is disrupts the flow of the text. Also, it simply is not clear exactly what is being illustrated. Articles need pictures, but one can have too many. If there are many fishing related pictures available, the best thing to do is to collect them in Wikipedia commons and put in a link to a commons category for those that are interested. Gaius Cornelius 08:01, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Move sections
I have removed two sections and conserved the text here for the time being.


 * Fly Fishing


 * Ancient Macedonian pottery paintings indicate that fly fishing, that is, fishing with a lure constructed of feathers to imitate an insect, was the first form of angling with a rod. Fly fishing differs from most other disciplines of fishing today because the fly must be cast on a fly rod, a very whippy, limber pole which is bent or "loaded" by a fly line.  Whereas a bait fisherman uses the weight of his lure or bait to pull line out behind it when thrown, a fly fisher uses the weight of the line itself to bend and unbend his rod.


 * Fly casting is the discipline of manipulating the rod so as to deliver a fly and is an integral part of fly fishing.


 * See fly fishing, trout bum, trout, fly tying.


 * Beach Casting


 * Beach casting involves the use of the longest possible fishing rod. Usually between 12 feet and 20 feet, the beach caster will stand on a beach or shore line and cast out to sea with either a water filled float, or a small lead weight. Bait used in this form of fishing might include Limpets, Mussels, Fly's or even Spinners. It is a common pastime in Scotlands costal areas and often results in the capture of large specemens of many species of flat fish.

To me, this article is a generic article on fishing - the ancient and world-wide practice of hunting fish. Consequently, these two sections would sit much better in a more specific article because they are sub-topics of angling. Perhaps somebody would like to move them there...

There is actually a Beach casting article.

The reference to Macedonian fly fishing might be deserving of a mention in the main fishing article provided a cite can be found.

Gaius Cornelius 08:17, 7 April 2006 (UTC)


 * I concur. Additionally, I'm fairly certain that the Macedonian pottery to which the editor refers is from the Bronze age. Consequently, several of the many Egyptian fishing illustrations would pre-date those by a millenium or more, I'd wager. &mdash; Dave 12:28, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

More Angling Specific Text
I have deleted the following text from the main article for which I feel it is too specific. It may have a place in another article, so I am preserving the text here in case somebody want to move it.


 * Shockleader Line
 * Probable the most important thing to remember whilst shore fishing with large wieghts.


 * Shockleader is a length of monofilament line that connects your reel line to your sea fishing rig. It acts like a shock absorber as casting a weight can put a lot of strain on your main line.


 * You use a shockleader to stop ' snap offs ' which is when the line snaps. A shockleader shou:ld always be heaver breaking strain than that of your main line on your reel.


 * Here are some guidelines on what to use to your weight -
 * 2oz of lead = 20lb.
 * 4oz of lead = 40lb.




 * A tapered shockleader is a length of mono line that is tapered i.e. starts at 15lb and then progresses in strength and thickness to 60lb.


 * The benefits of using a tapered shockleader on these types of reels is that the knot is a lot less in size and thus reducing the snagging when it goes through the line feed arm.


 * On some makes of fishing reels there is a line layer this is a device that lays the line evenly using a bar.

Gaius Cornelius 14:17, 14 April 2006 (UTC)