Talk:French Canadians/Archives/2017

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Number of French Canadians
There are two problems here. First, this article appears to focus on all people of French-Canadian descent, regardless of whether they live in Canada or the United States. Yet, the 5,077,215 figure we're claiming in the info box is only for Canada, based on the 2011 census. In the French Canadian American article we claim that there are 8,124,280 in the U.S. Shouldn't we add the two figures up, given that, again, this article is focused on all people of French-Canadian origin?

Secondly, that 5.077M figure for Canada seems awfully low, especially when we are talking about ethnicity and not language. The French version of this page gives the number as 10,563,805. I haven't perused all the census figures, but the latter figure seems more plausible to me. If there are really only five million Canadians of French ancestry, then at least one-third of all Canadian francophones would have to be of non-French ancestry, which is very questionable. I've got to assume there is something wrong with the methodology used to compile that 5M figure. 108.254.160.23 (talk) 06:23, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Does the fr.wikipedia article have sources we could use? Dbrodbeck (talk) 11:48, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Stale discussion, but I wanted to add a data point for context in case new readers are still confused by this discussion. At the present time, the infobox actually includes both the Canadian census number and the US estimate — but it lists them as two distinct statistics, rather than as one total number divorced of context. And the "10,563,805" number given by the OP derives from the same source as the 5,077,215 figure — but it represents the number of people who identified their ethnic background as "Canadian" in the census. That identity does not necessarily correspond to French origins per se — while it was the dominant choice of label in all of Quebec except the mostly-aboriginal Nord-du-Québec region, it was also the dominant choice of label in several regions where it clearly doesn't correspond to French-Canadian, such as Essex-Kent and Loyalist country in Ontario and most of mainland Nova Scotia and all of Newfoundland except, oddly, the part of Newfoundland where the Franco-Newfoundlanders actually live. I will grant that use of "Canadian" as one's choice of how to self-identify on the census does appear to have a high degree of correlation to the regions where French Canadians are a significant or dominant demographic factor, but it does not have a perfect correlation.
 * So if that was ever what the article on fr actually said, it was a misrepresentation of what the source for it was actually implying — and what the article on fr actually says now is "5,065,700", which is still a slight discrepancy from what our article says but not a discrepancy of five million. That said, the 5,077,215 figure isn't quite perfect, either — it's not clear, for instance, whether that number includes or excludes the 193,885 who specifically listed their ethnicity as Québécois, nor is it clear whether it includes or excludes the people of French-Canadian descent who are included among the 10,563,805 who self-identified as Canadian. And for added bonus, all of this derives from the 2011 National Household Survey, also known as the longform — which means it's less than fully reliable, because longform in 2011 (bloody hell). Most likely, in fact, the real number is higher than 5,077,215 but lower than 10,563,805 — but absent a more solid number, 5,077,215 is about the best we can actually do for a reliably sourced figure. Bearcat (talk) 22:21, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

"Today, French Canadians constitute the main French-speaking population in Canada"
"Today, French Canadians constitute the main French-speaking population in Canada"

What does this mean? I am bewildered.67.85.99.3 (talk) 12:21, 11 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Very oddly worded. As it's written it means that most French speakers in Canada are Canadians, rather than citizens of other French-speaking countries (France, Haiti, etc). Obviously this is true, but since the cited ref does not address this issue I suspect that what is meant is that either most of Canada's French speakers are in Quebec (supported by the cited ref but redundant as this is mentioned later in the lede) or that most of Canada's French speakers are French Quebecers (not supported by the cited ref). I'm just going to yank the whole sentence. Meters (talk) 22:57, 15 June 2017 (UTC)
 * In addition to French-speaking immigrants who are not of Québécois de souche descent, "French Canadians" also does not include the Acadians, the Brayons or the Métis, and it's a historical toss-up as to whether it includes the Franco-Newfoundlanders or not since they weren't "Canadian" until after 1949 either. I agree that the sentence could have been worded better than it was, but "francophone Canadians" and "French-Canadians" are obviously overlapping, but not at all identical, sets — there are francophone Canadians who are not ethnically French-Canadian, and there are ethnic French Canadians who are not francophone. Bearcat (talk) 15:29, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Agreed. I like your additions to the article. Meters (talk) 19:43, 18 June 2017 (UTC)