Talk:Guo Shoujing

THIS is the "talk page"
Please stop changing my article. I'm just a 16 year old girl who is trying to turn in her AP World History project. Please stop since all this information is credible and I have the sources to prove it. STOP ERASING IT!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.202.97.183 (talk) 05:24, 10 December 2008 (UTC)


 * What do you mean by credible? How is anyone supposed to trust you, when none of your hyperlinks work, you don't provide a single inline citation for any statement, and last I checked AP world history courses don't assign students homework to do at Wikipedia. How do I know that all of this "work" you've done here isn't just copied verbatim from a source that you haven't listed? You need to provide citations quickly, or else I will revert your edits again.-- Pericles of Athens  Talk 23:01, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Don't touch my page. I've been working on it for months. I'll fix the links. Or u could copy and paste them into a search engine and it works there. And by the way, two of them do work. Just back off! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.152.0.81 (talk) 06:04, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I will not "back off"; I expect you (if you aren't here simply vandalizing the page) to at least reach the bare minimum of what is required in terms of citations. Since you are here on the talk page, you don't seem to be an outright vandal, so instead of reverting your edits I have simply placed citation tags where you need to provide them. Also, Please fix those links, otherwise there's no use in having them, since readers will not be able to access them.- Pericles of Athens  Talk 14:10, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Hi everybody. I don't really know what's going on here, but it's not very clear who is addressing whom. The third message (from 32.152.0.81) says something about "my page," but I don't see any edits from 32.152.0.81 on this particular page (and no Wikipedia page is technically anybody's page, but this is a different matter). 32.152.0.81 also tells someone to "back off," but I'm not sure who that would be and in what sense. I can guess what's going on, but could someone make it clear how many parties are involved in this dispute so that we can work on solving it? Also: it might be a good idea for the parties involved to sign in in order to discuss these matters. For the sake of disclosure, I "know" Pericles of Athens (though only online, not personally) and I admire his enormous contributions to China-related articles on Wikipedia. Here I also see that the large new additions to Guo Shoujing, though not properly "wikified" (no hyperlink in the text) and not directly referenced, seem to be serious, fairly well researched, and made in good faith. Also, this article was originally a stub that demanded to be expanded, so I'm sure we can work something out! Let me assure you that Pericles of Athens was acting in good faith too, and that he didn't mean to terrify anybody (or to "terrorize the lives of high school girls," which was a great image), so there was no need to get angry at him personally as someone did on his talk page. Let's all calm down, smile at all this, and discuss this issue coolly. For one thing, all the parties involved are interested in Guo Shoujing and seem are acting in good faith, so I'm sure we'll find a solution. One last detail: inserting inline references is actually very easy: press "Edit this page" on top of the wiki, look at how previous editors have done it, and just do the same. Oh and another "last detail": if you log in, you get a user page where you can create "sandboxes." In your sandbox, you can write all kinds of essays until they're ready to be posted into main pages, and nobody will be able to bother you, because they're yours (check my user page if you need examples). Cheers to all, Madalibi (talk) 09:38, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry, but all of this sounded fishy from the start. What kind of AP history teacher assigns homework at Wikipedia? That doesn't make any sense, and so far the multiple persons I appear to be having a conversation with haven't fully explained themselves (perhaps it's one prankster who has copied all of this info verbatim from a source). And if you don't understand how to make inline citations in Wikipedia, use this model here: . "Joe Schmo" is just a joke, of course; that is where you put the name of the author you are citing. If you have any questions about how to cite sources (including online sources), visit this link here: Citing sources. And as for this being "my page", no one owns this page, especially anonymous IPs. You must understand, I revert vandalism on a daily basis. I looked at your edits, how you deleted the name from the introduction, how you deleted my entire section from contributions, how you deleted all the original references, and thought: VANDAL, of course. My apologies if I "terrorized" little school girls, but quite frankly, I have doubts about that as well. Exactly why are you utilizing Wikipedia for your homework project?- Pericles of Athens  Talk 13:22, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Madalibi: perhaps 71.202.97.183 and 32.152.0.81 is the same person, but one who is simply using a different IP address (i.e. computer), perhaps the one at school, and the one at home! Lol. Seriously though, it's hard to keep good faith with anyone when they make bizarre statements such as writing a Wikipedia article for AP world history homework.- Pericles of Athens  Talk 13:42, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * The two IP's are from the Oakland/San Jose/San Francisco area, one AT&T, one Comcast. Probably the same person indeed. Madalibi (talk) 14:17, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Plus, if this person was at all serious about learning how to cite (something an AP history class even requires, I should know, I completed a brutally difficult AP course), without even going to Citing sources, they could have easily gone to the edit page of the citations section and looked how already existing citations were set up. Here, let me put citation tags where I think they're needed, and I hope that if this person is at all serious about this, they will follow up. Sound fair?- Pericles of Athens  Talk 13:43, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * You know what? After reading through this and adding some tags, I might have to question my previous assumption about this new info being copied verbatim from a scholarly source, since this article now does sound like it was written by a high school student! Oh I remember those days: adding a bunch of filler to flesh out the page in time to turn in an assignment of a required page length. Lol. Seriously, though, break some of these gigantic chunks of text into paragraphs; what are they teaching kids in school these days? Also, if you want to know what the tags are, go to Avoid weasel words.-  Pericles of Athens  Talk 14:10, 12 December 2008 (UTC)


 * A few days ago a whole host of biographies of ancient people got modified in this way by contributors originating from 67.111.218.66 (Sacred Heart School apparently). There have been other changes since from other IP numbers and new user names. All of the pages involved follow the same pattern, essay-style biographies, with no inline citations, and a strong resistance by the creators to their work being modified or reverted. :-) If it is a school project, which seems possible, then it is a weird one! Singinglemon (talk) 02:09, 13 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the heads up, Singinglemon. This person hasn't returned to discuss anything here on the talk page and has not taken into consideration any of the suggestions raised here, so I'm going to assume that he or she isn't being very serious about providing necessary citations which are a basic requirement in Wikipedia. I'm going to revert the material again; let's see if that produces another high school temper tantrum.-- Pericles of Athens  Talk 16:53, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

I'm still here. I made the references work. Everything's fine. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.202.97.183 (talk) 03:16, 14 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi 71.202.97.183 (whoever you are behind this IP address). One way to show your good will would be to add at least one inline citation to the article in question, though more than one would be better, of course. User:PericlesofAthens did not delete your additions out of spite: he has posted long responses to your pleas in many places (including on the talk page of User:The Red Eyebrows) and took time to indicate where the article would need citations, but it's been two days and he has received no response from anybody. I do believe that you're in high school and trying to turn in a homework, and I'm sure it took you a long time to research and to write. Your current experience must be frustrating, but if I were you, I'd be more upset at your teacher for making you post this assignment on an international online encyclopedia (instead of a class website) without telling you the rules (including the rules of citation) of that encyclopedia. Do you think you could add inline citations soon, because I think this is the key to our problem! Cheers, Madalibi (talk) 03:19, 14 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi 71.202.97.183. Ignore my last request about inserting "at one inline citation." I wrote the message after I saw that you had reverted PericlesofAthens's last delete, but before I realized that you had already inserted the inline citations. Thanks for inserting them, by the way! Cheers, Madalibi (talk) 05:14, 14 December 2008 (UTC)


 * That's all I wanted to see, IP 71.202.97.183. A little bare minimum effort on your part. Perhaps there are not as many citations as there should be, given the mountain of uncited text, but it's a good start. Thank you for finally following Wikipedia guidelines.- Pericles of Athens  Talk 03:41, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Some encouragement
I read all the above. Whilst objectively much of the criticism is justified, I think whoever our '16 year old' is, she deserves some credit for her attempt to contribute to an article on a key figure in the history of not only maths but also astronomy. So my advice to her is try and pick up where the Wiki editors/critics are constructive and implement what they say. Then this could be not only a great history project but also a first class Wikipedia article.

But from what little I have read on the remarkable Guo Shoujing it could end up being a lifetime project!

Neil Parker (talk) 08:27, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20051112144702/http://www.zhengzhou.org.cn/english/Culture/story/story10.htm to http://www.zhengzhou.org.cn/english/Culture/story/story10.htm
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150721211223/http://www.chinaculture.org/gb/en_madeinchina/2005-09/02/content_72418.htm to http://www.chinaculture.org/gb/en_madeinchina/2005-09/02/content_72418.htm

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