Talk:Hail Satan

Some info
Some old uses of "Hail Satan" can be found at books.google.com. More info seems to be here, and here.

More info
Some old uses of "Ave Satanas" (in the form of "Ave Sathanas"), can be found here. Jimhoward72 (talk) 08:49, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

factual accuracy is disputed
The person who put this on the article without explaining any reason for it. All the info is sourced wiith WP:RS. Sticky Parkin 19:04, 15 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I added some fact tags for statements that I think are inadequately sourced, and removed a statement to an unreliable source. Having done so, it occurred to me there were sufficient unsourced statements to important claims that the article as a whole ought to have a tag. So if you want to know the reasons for the tag, I suggest you check the individual fact tags. Gatoclass (talk) 03:46, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

"Visual abbreviations"
How can a verbal statement be a "visual abbreviation"? Could you please provide a quote from the source clarifying this. Thanks, Gatoclass (talk) 13:37, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I have changed it for another phrase used in the source iconic topoi which could refer things involving the other senses. We do visually see when someone's mouth says something usually, I suppose.  Except in cases of ventriloquism. :) Sticky Parkin 20:29, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, the article says Hail Satan is part of pieces of film which became iconic topoi, rather than the verbal statement being an iconic topoi on its own, it's accompanied by visual actions such as the black mass.Sticky Parkin 20:45, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately I have no way of checking this source, so I will have to take it on good faith that your interpretation is correct. Gatoclass (talk) 06:00, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Why would I have any reason to lie?:) Seeing as how the article has plenty of other sources, anyway, and I think the sense is obvious from the abstract there anyway.:) Sticky Parkin 03:18, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Baudelaire?
I see the article is up for deletion. If it ends up getting kept, I hope someone will remove or amend the Baudelaire part and its attribution to him of the phrase "Glory and all hail, Satan". Looking at the text on Project Gutenberg, I see: "Gloire et louange à toi, Satan", which doesn't necessarily translate to "Hail" (I'm not at home in French but from the dictionary "Praise" would be nearer), a parody of Psalms 28, 2 perhaps. Where does the translation come from? That part of the article is unsourced. N p holmes (talk) 13:51, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Hmm, you are right, "louange" translates as "praise". And "Glory and hail to you, Satan!" would not seem to make very good grammatical sense. So this is another part of this article that appears to be original research. Gatoclass (talk) 14:00, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It is a quote from a source and how the source translates it, not me, so not original research at all. <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Sticky</b> <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Parkin</b> 20:20, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * What source? I didn't see any such translation, and even if there is one, it appears to be a mistranslation. Gatoclass (talk) 05:29, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Whatever, not my translation anyway and now it's gone from the article.:) <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Sticky</b> <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Parkin</b> 03:18, 25 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Isn't this arguing over how many devils can dance on the head of a pin? Tuxraider reloaded (talk) 03:14, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I imagine sour grapes leave a very unpleasant taste in the mouth, maybe arguing takes one's mind off it.:) <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Sticky</b> <b style="color:#FF8C00;">Parkin</b> 03:18, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No, sorry, the only thing that leaves an "unpleasant taste" in my mouth is the fact that a certain editor continues to sprinkle snide comments and assorted bad faith accusations on sundry talk pages, even after being politely asked to refrain from doing so, and agreeing to "put this behind us". Gatoclass (talk) 07:38, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

See also's
There is no particular relationship to Crazy for God that I can see. However since that is one of "my" articles, I'll take the free publicity. :-) Steve Dufour (talk) 04:41, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Richard Ramirez.jpg
The image Image:Richard Ramirez.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check


 * That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
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This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Media copyright questions. --21:00, 2 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I have added a Fair Use Rationale for this image being used in this article, and also updated the FUR for Richard Ramirez. Anyone who is interested in improving the rationale should go here and do what you can. Ed Fitzgerald t / c 21:17, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Latin Declension of "Ave Satani"
I changed the article from accusing Goldsmith of using incorrect Latin, to saying that he used the modern Italian declension. However, it may be more complex than that. But I don't think the article should accuse an artist of using "incorrect Latin" in their musical score. Is there an authoritative source that discusses the Latin grammar of Goldsmith's work? I doubt it - and if there was a source, they certainly would have asked Goldsmith himself why he chose to decline it as "Ave Satani". Another clear reason he could have selected "Satani", is that it is the same form as "Christi", which it replaces. In Roman Catholic liturgy, there are phrases such as "Ave Christi", as well as "Corpus Christi". Goldsmith made an inversion of these common Latin phrases that his audience was familiar with, coming up with "Ave Satani", "Ave Versus Christi", and "Tolle Corpus Satani". It clearly was an effective choice for his short Latin song for the hit movie "The Omen", probably a better source than some obscure Latin declension that the public would not be familiar with. At any rate, his award-winning artistic work shouldn't be brushed of in an encyclopdia article by saying that he used "incorrect Latin".Jimhoward72 (talk) 09:02, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

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