Talk:Isaac Asimov/Archive 5

Advanced formatting of TOC
13-Jan-2008: I have triggered advanced article formatting to wrap text around the long Table-of-Contents (TOC) box, to shorten the page. Over 99% of large articles on Wikipedia use the default formatting that prevents text beside the TOC box, but leaves a large text-gap in the area. A wikitable plus word-joining has been used to allow right-side text to wrap along the TOC box, without splitting text into one-word lines. Three constructs are used in advanced formatting: (1) a wikitable TOC, (2) a left-side image, and (3) word-joining:



Most&amp;nbsp;of&amp;nbsp;Asimov's The wikitable (enclosed by "{|" and "|}") narrows the Table-of-Contents box as a left-side table ("align=left"), allowing text to wrap along the right of the TOC. However, wikitables can overlap nearby text during the text-wrapping, so a left-side image is added to wake up the observance of box margins, keeping text clearly between the TOC-box and the righthand infobox. Smaller screens might force text to wrap as one-word-per-line, so word-joining is used to connect the 3 words "Most_of_Asimov's" as the minimum-width phrase between the TOC & infobox. If those 3 words won't fit between the boxes, then that text slides down to appear below the infobox, effectively forcing the whole paragraph to be typeset into a larger area, but auto-wrapping depending on how wide the browser window is narrowed. When those 3 constructs are used (together), the auto-typesetting is almost magic, auto-shifting the text, boxes, and image placement, depite switching between tiny or high-resolution screens. -Wikid77 (talk) 05:22, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Someone recently removed the wrap text coding without providing a reason in the edit summary. Is there concensus to returning the coding or a reason why it should not be returned? TheRedPenOfDoom (talk) 16:03, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * 22-March-2008: I have restored the text-wrapping using the 13Jan08 techniques above, but using template { {LeftTOCwrap}}. Removal of advanced formatting is typical due to wikirot, what I call the natural progression of edits after hacking, vandalism and reverts.  Every 2 months, perform a "sanity check" on prior articles to see what has been hacked. "Wikipedia life is messy - clean it up" just like rooms open to the public must be cleaned periodically. Few people will test an edited article to ensure formatting on wide screens with a hidden TOC. -Wikid77 (talk) 13:15, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Ashkenazi Jew?
I'd not heard this before and a (admittedly) moderate search of the web turns up no mention of it (other than the entry here in Wikipedia. Damn, but them googly spiders is fast!). I'll have to check thru my copies of I. Asimov and In Memory Yet Green tonight. In meantime, can anyone provide a reference that clarifies this? Sean Martin (talk) 00:38, 13 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I cannot provide a citation. However, Asimov was ethnically Jewish.  Asimov was from Russia.  Therefore, there is a nearly 100% chance that he was Ashkenazic, since Russian Jews, are by definition, Ashkenazic Jews.  THere is  slight, theoretical chance, that he was Sephardic, or even Kuzari, if his immediate ancestors immigrated to Russia from elsewhere.  However, without some indication that this is the case, it is very safe to assume that he was Ashkenazic.  96.60.70.254 (talk) 19:24, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

When the Asimov Family arrived in Liverpool en route for New York the Family emigration documents were found to be incomplete or inaccurate. The Hebrew Emigration society in Liverpool had to find either the correct documents or confirmation of the old ones. Which is a way of saying can we be sure of the 'exact' history of Asimov's past?.Johnwrd (talk) 23:11, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure what you're getting at. Asimov's family history back in the old country is pretty much an open book, to put it mildly. -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  15:19, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Image
It seems to me that the current infobox image should be changed. It is adequate, but Asimov's iconic look is with the sideburns, and that picture could throw people off. Is it the only fair use image available? Mightn't we be able to come up with a rational for this or maybe this? Just a suggestion. Cerebellum (talk) 02:54, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The recently added image is also being challenged as not actually a free image. I would prefer an image with the sideburns.TheRedPenOfDoom (talk) 16:07, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Also, the image with the Galaxy with the description "Asimov writs science fiction" seems useless and unnecessary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by User: (talk • contribs)

Letters
Per [ http://astore.amazon.com/exchrisnetenc-20/detail/0385476248 this] mention it seems likely that 90,000 is more likely correct; it mentions 45,000 existing letters, which may exclude postcards and correspondence that doesn't survive. I don't claim this as a reliable source, but the one used to correct this to 9,000 seems no more reliable, and to judge by what it says may even have taken it's info from Wikipedia and accidentally dropped a zero from the 90,000. Mike Christie (talk) 22:28, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

All right, I'll change it back. Cerebellum (talk) 23:35, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Retrofit topic-year headers
17-March-2008: I have grouped the older topics above using level-1 headers as "Topics from 2006" (etc.) to emphasize age of topics. Older topics might still apply, but using the tactic of yearly headers to note the age helps avoid rehashing old news, without archiving any ongoing issues. Also, new topics are more likely to be added to the bottom, not top. In sorting years, I had moved a topic to 25-Sep-2006 and removed 70 line breaks in topic "Petrovichi, Russia". -Wikid77 (talk) 12:31, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Criticism section: Unsourced opinions
The criticism section contains a lot of unsourced opinion. Editors need to refrain from adding there own criticisms or defenses of Asimov. Only opinions from notable sources are allowed in wikipedia articles. There is still more there, but I chopped this bit for starters:


 * This is perhaps slightly overstating the issue given that, for example, The Naked Sun (1957) deals with social issues as a core part of its central setting and motivation, depicts genetic engineering in the guise of eugenics as a fundamental part of that society, presents the reader with inverted arcologies where a single person is the focal point of the artificial environment as well as a hero who hails from a "normal" arcology on earth. Meanwhile, totally artificial birth, although not specifically cloning, is the aim of the leaders of the society, sexual want is the major driving force of the main female character (albeit veiled in 1950s sensibilities), and the entire story is used to make the point that too much order is ultimately a stagnant dead end to be avoided.

Ashmoo (talk) 13:29, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Titles
Asimov was known as the Grand Master, the world Maestro of science fiction and and the Good Doctor. Are any of these titles in here? If so, they should be moved up to the first part of the page, along with the sentence about the "Big Three". —Preceding unsigned comment added by User: (talk • contribs)

Pronunciation (again)
There was an earlier discussion on this topic (from 2006) but I felt I shouldn't be posting new replies under the old heading of "Topics from 2006". It seems that the pronunciation similar to "has-him-of" for the author's name has been chosen. I don't understand this. I do not know the IPA, but I do know Russian, and the natural way to pronounce the name for me would be aZEEmov. In fact, the Russian version of this article shows this too, with an emphasis mark clearly placed over the middle of the last name, and not the beginning. It would be appreciated if anyone could clear this up for me. Is it just that the other pronunciation is more common?

LK (t|c) 18:47, 31 July 2008 (UTC)


 * As the 2006-7 discussion makes clear, Asimov himself stated in print that his name should be pronounced h as- h im-of; moreover, the placing of the stress on the first syllable has always been the norm when referring to him (though I myself never met him, I have met and heard many people who did), and if this did not also correspond to his own preference he would doubtless have mentioned it at some point. Remember that although he was born in Russia, his family was Jewish rather than Russian, and he was taken to the USA at a very early age and grew up speaking Brooklyn-accented English, not Russian, so neither they nor he would necessarily conform to conventional Russian pronunciation. Bear in mind that many surnames are pronounced two or more different ways by different families who bear them - they themselves are the only arbiters. 87.81.230.195 (talk) 08:48, 8 March 2009 (UTC)


 * If it's any help at this late stage, I once met Isaac Asimov. He pronounced his name AZZ-im-ov, not ah-ZEE-mov. He was American, and pronounced it the American way. --NellieBly (talk) 07:37, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Science fiction novels
Wouldn't it be an idea to mention how many science fiction novels he wrote during his lifetime? I think I read somewhere that he wrote no more than 18 in total, so it shouldn't be too hard to make a list of them. A collection of his shorter stories would be interesting as well, but at least the novels should be mentioned. 80.202.40.85 (talk) 04:24, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
 * His novels are all already mentioned in the article. There four Robot novels, three Galactic Empire novels, seven Foundation novels, six Lucky Starr novels, ten Norby novels and five independent novels (including the two Fantastic Voyage novels). That's a total of 35 science fiction novels. In addition there are the three novels with Robert Silverberg, but it's debatable to count them since Asimov only wrote the underlying short stories, the expansion to novels was completely done by Silverberg. Furthermore there are two mystery novels, so counting everything there are 40 novels. –Darkday (talk) 20:01, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, but the section says "Selected bibliography". Maybe it should be mentioned that the science fiction novels listed is the complete list to avoid confusion. Since it says it is a selected list, some could believe there are more novels (science fiction and not) which is not mentioned. 80.202.40.85 (talk) 00:08, 16 December 2008 (UTC)