Talk:Jessica Watson

Suggest removal
I think this entry should be removed. The paged is plagued by factual inaccuracies and seems to have been captured by people representing Ms Watson's interests and by her sycophantic fans. I have made a number of attempts to correct the page's accuracy, but these are invariably shouted down in favour of alternative facts. Further, Ms Watson has fallen from the public eye and her former celebrity status was the only justification for this entry's existence. Ms Watson did not achieve anything of note and most importantly did not achieve the thing she claims to have achieved. Pke81885 (talk) 20:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC) Pke81885 (talk) 20:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Personally I view Ms Watson's accomplishment as noteworthy irrespective of the records standards, and I found the entire page interesting, engaging, respectful of Wikipedia requirements, and well composed. And the "Notable?" debate in the first archive of this talk page seems to support a notable consensus.


 * And I perceive no evidence of significant factual inaccuracies or domination by undisciplined editors.


 * If honest and objective observers can't control a subject due to persistent editing misconduct by interests who are unable or unwilling to remain objective perhaps removal would be required as a last resort. But I see no evidence of that here - on the contrary the talk archive seemed vigorous and well populated by hearts of high integrity through early 2015, and almost no conversation has occurred since.  In my view removal of the article clearly isn't warranted and would be harmful to Wikipedia's mission, the article's editors, and to everyone associated with the subject.


 * I hope all who edit can embrace stout personal discipline in objectivity, honesty, and civility for everyone's sake. H Bruce Campbell (talk) 10:13, 31 May 2020 (UTC)


 * The editorial discipline may not breach Wikipedia's standards, but given that Ms Watson did not achieve what she claims to have achieved (I.e. to sail around the world), one still has to question why this page exists. What exactly did she achieve that is sufficient to justify this page? One might argue the case on the basis that Ms Watson was awarded Young Australian of the Year. However that, in itself, is not sufficient. Several recipients do not have Wikipedia pages. The same goes for recipients of the OAM.


 * The existence of this page might be justifiable if it was centered on the attainment of celebrity status by claiming to have achieved something which you did not, but that is not its primary focus. The page needs to be either substantially edited (without interference by people representing Ms Watson's interests and her sycophantic fans), or removed. Pke81885 (talk) 23:26, 8 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Whether fully deserved for her sailing achievements alone, or not, Watson has gained a level of notability that probably justifies this article existing. The controversy about the level of her achievement is discussed in the article, but clumsily. It's mentioned in the lead, and discussed in more detail in both the Circumnavigation and publicity and Criticism sections. This isn't ideal, but would take considerable effort to clean up. What concerns me too is the first sentence which, while technically accurate, doesn't tell us much at all about things with the words "...for completing a southern hemisphere solo circumnavigation". It sort of qualifies the achievement, but in a way that will be unclear to lay readers. I will think about improving this situation. (All other efforts welcome of course.) HiLo48 (talk) 04:48, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * I agree there are grounds for the page's existence, but the impression given by its current form is that Ms Watson achieved some form of circumnavigation, whereas in reality she did not achieve what she set out to achieve and has subsequently claimed to have achieved. There are two reasons behind Ms Watson's notability: 1. Prior to her departure, there was an extraordinarily high level of public opinion claiming that she was too young for the voyage and that authorities should intervene to prevent it, and 2. That she did not achieve a global circumnavigation yet has persistently claimed afterwards that she did.


 * The phrase "...for completing a southern hemisphere solo circumnavigation" is certainly misleading. That wording is actually a compromise after previous efforts to add the word "attempted" to the first sentence were shouted down by Ms Watson's supporters. To say that Ms Watson attempted a global circumnavigation should not be controversial. Yet her supporters point to contemporaneous news articles claiming that Ms Watson actually completed a global circumnavigation to justify the claim, notwithstanding the fact that those news articles are now known to be incorrect. I will make another attempt to edit the first sentence. Stay tuned for the reaction.Pke81885 (talk) 22:43, 24 September 2020 (UTC)