Talk:List of Austin & Ally episodes

Season premiere
We seem to be having a dispute about the meaning of the table row labeled Season premiere in the series overview section. The meaning of that table row as described in the linked article, is the first episode of the season. Disney has chosen to label the episode that aired December 2, 2011 as a preview and label the second episode, that aired December 4, 2011, as the premiere. Disney's labeling is noted in the episode entries for episodes 1 and 2. I am asserting that the reality of when things actually happen overrides how a Disney press release labels things. Geraldo Perez (talk) 02:07, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * (below copied from User talk:Geraldo Perez to keep discussion in context) who the fuck cares?
 * You've used the 3-revert rule, the information you're providing is TW/OR. That page has no references so anything in that page isn't reliable. These's pages (1 2 use the reference of what the reliable source states by the channel of when the season premiere is. It's not by the "first episode" aired. According to the Featured lists page, it's standard practice to use the reference of the channel and not the "Season Premiere" linked Wikipedia page. Some pages don't even link that page, it's just bold text (which should be used as that page has no references).
 * EDIT: You also missed the t=fact that this isn't a "Season Premiere" but rather a series premiere which is treated differently.- Alec2011 (talk) 02:14, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * (I made 2 reversions after my initial edit was reverted) - In the links you gave the initial air dates matched premier dates as far as I can see. I don't get the point you are trying to make here. Where specifically at Featured lists does it state that we follow press releases. In general we prefer secondary sources over primary sources for all information. Press releases are primary sources, a example of a secondary source for a show is the sources used for the viewing data that shows what actually happened (and when). This article should match what actually happened, not what Disney advertised. --Geraldo Perez (talk) 02:41, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Here's some primary sources that state the "Season Premiere" of the series (1, 2, 3) Also the Season premiere link uses no references that you can say are reliable when the page is not. Previews are different than the actual premiere, the actual premiere is where the show airs at it's regular day/time every premiere. Here's a secondary source for a "preview" not the premiere (1). - Alec2011 (talk) 02:58, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * All sources from Disney are primary sources including the show itself. Info in scheduling guides such as TV Guide use a scheduling feed provided by the networks and are planning info. The actual information broadcast, including the show content, credits and actual airdate is more current and "correct" than any planning data. It doesn't matter what Disney plans or advertises, what actually counts is what actually happened. In this case the first episode of a new TV series was broadcast December 2, 2011. That is factual data backed up by a reference titled "Disney Channel's "Good Luck Charlie: It's Christmas" and "Austin & Ally" Deliver Big Premiere Ratings" and states "premieres in its regular timeslot Sunday, December 4". The first showing in its regular timeslot is Dec 4, the actual first showing of the series, the series premiere, was Dec 2 as documented.
 * The article on Season premiere is just based on common definitions of words in an entertainment context. You are asserting that the lack of references for that article makes the article irrelevant. Just taking the word "premiere" and http://www.thefreedictionary.com/premiere definition, the standard English meaning is "first public performance". Season/series premiere is just the first public performance of the season/series. In this case it was Dec 2, no matter what Disney choose to label that performance. --Geraldo Perez (talk) 03:32, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I added a reference to support the definition of the term in the article "Season premiere". The phrase has a well understood common meaning. Disney looks like they use another. The article should stick with what people competent to read in the English language would understand. Geraldo Perez (talk) 05:34, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I plan to use TV Guide as a reliable source that is also a secondary reliable source. Per WP:PSTS articles are supposed to rely on secondary sources and only use primary sources for straightforward, descriptive statements. TV Guide source is:




 * Geraldo Perez (talk) 05:57, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm voting with Geraldo Perez. It's basically a question of semantics.  The show first aired on December 2, 2011.  There can be a a little "note" in the table explaining that Disney technically called it a "preview", but I think the December 2 date is the relevant date we're looking for here.  For a while, Nickelodeon was calling every new episode of iCarly a "special" episode, however, the consensus was that a network's marketing quirks are to be disregarded when it can lead the reader to misinterpret the essential information.--- Crakkerjakk (talk) 06:38, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Disney often labels the first airing of the first episode of a new series as a "series preview", with the "official" series premiere occurring at a later date. Nickelodeon has also done it with programs such as The Penguins of Madagascar and Fish Hooks (and probably others), where they call the first episode a "sneak peak". The series premiere is always a different episode. This invariably results in an editing dispute over the first series premiere date. Common sense would seem to dictate that the season premiere date is the date that the first episode of the season aired. The first episode of season 1 aired on December 2, so that's what should be in the series overview table. I've raised this matter at WT:TV as it's not the first time, and won't be the last, that this discussion has been had somewhere. --AussieLegend (talk) 11:50, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I've noticed it before, but when I've noticed Nickelodeon has done it, it's usually been several months before the series begins (as they did with Supah Ninjas), so I can actually see some validity to making a distinction in that case. I haven't noticed it much with Disney shows, but I have noticed they will often air a "preview" of a show in other countries (after the show is already airing in the United States) a month (or sometimes more) before putting the series into regular rotation in that country.  I'm suspecting in this case, the "preview" moniker was bestowed because Disney Channel intends Sunday night to be the show's "regular" time-slot and they simply wanted to pull in big ratings for this new show on the back of the Good Luck Charlie Christmas movie that aired on Friday night.  If this was a real "preview" that aired months before the "official" premiere date, then I could understand the need to make a clear distinction, but a matter of 2 days based on Disney's attempt to pull in blockbuster ratings on the back of an established "hit" just seems like a silly technicality - especially since the December 2 episode was obviously the "pilot" episode, specifically designed to set the stage for the entire series. --- Crakkerjakk (talk) 12:32, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree with the general consensus. The first air date IS the first air date, sneak preview or not. The "sneak preview" date should be listed in the overview table regardless not just the so-called premiere date by the network. Alec2011 has made edits like this in the A.N.T. Farm episode list, List of Disney Channel series and List of programs broadcast by Disney Channel. Years from now, when it comes down to it the so-called "sneak preview" date will matter the most.  Quasy Boy  18:25, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree as well. I was going by what the "References" said that the premiere date was, the column title is "Premiere Date" not Sneak Preview date. Regardless, now that there's a"Reliable" source in that page, we can include both the "Sneak Preview" and "Premiere" date in the column for future reference. - Alec2011 (talk) 22:51, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Tickets & Trashbags Is Not Going To Premiere On January 16th, 2012.
I checked my TV Guide and There was no sign of any premieres that day. Therefore I Am Turning The Date Into TBA. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.165.92.132 (talk) 01:45, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Zap2it, which is Disney's official scheduling outlet still lists it. Geraldo Perez (talk) 04:05, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
 * As does futon critic and msn. --AussieLegend (talk) 04:40, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/user/alternativexpurple This Person Uploaded The Episode. Therefore, I am adding Guest Stars. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.165.92.132 (talk) 21:56, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

Please Don't Add Episodes Where The Airdates Are Unknown/Unconfirmed, or the Episode Has Not Been Announced yet.
Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.165.92.132 (talk) 22:04, 16 January 2012 (UTC)


 * I won't, but for future reference, the upcoming episode “Albums & Auditions” has the production number #118, according to Eric Dean Seaton's official website. DanTD (talk) 23:05, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

Club Owners & Quinceneras / Deejays & Demos Summaries revealed.
I found it On reference 16 in the references. Please Don't Delete The Summaries. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MoshiMonsters1 (talk • contribs) 05:37, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Are you sure it's reference 16? It doesn't show anything like that. If you can't find a real reference why not just wait for the episode to air? Here's reference 16: http://www.thefutoncritic.com/ratings/2012/01/31/sundays-cable-ratings-sag-awards-simulcast-on-par-with-last-year-638510/cable_20120129/

Also, if you're adding a new episode summary, add a citation to that summary. Otherwise everyone should assume you're making it up. Ratemonth (talk) 13:59, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Oh Sorry It's Reference 19. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MoshiMonsters1 (talk • contribs) 16:21, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Production code numbers
Direct from Raini Rodriguez's twitter page(sorry I can't get the direct link to the message);

Glad everyone enjoyed the new episode of Austin & Ally tonight! This episode was special, because it was our 11th episode filmed on 11/11/11 27 Feb via web

So would that make the production number for "Deejays & Demos" officially #111? DanTD (talk) 17:01, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Burglaries & Boobytraps Summary
Austin skips practice with Ally to go to a Bruno Mars concert. Ally is mad, so Austin borrows the new guitar to have it autographed by Bruno Mars. However, Ally noticed that the guitar is gone, and she looks at the security camera to see who took it. Ally confronts Austin, but he denies. Trish turns Austin before knowing that he only took it to get it autographed. So they have to catch the real thief to clear Austin's name.They find out that the thief steals from stores in alphabetical order. Ally and Trish set up a bird cage to catch him, and Dez sets up a giant mouse trap. Dez gets trapped on the mouse trap, so Ally and Trish try to help him, but Ally accidentally sets off her trap and she and Trish get stuck in the bird cage. The thief comes and takes the piano, but Austin was in the piano and he knocks out the thief while coming out.

At the end Austin gives Ally a book for all the times she wants to practice with him, and said he'll always be there when she needs him.

The episode is available on Kids on Demand on Virozen FiOS. Jon23812 (talk) 21:50, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 11 September 2012
Can you make the color box for season 2 red please? The shows colors are red yellow & black -___-

96.244.229.138 (talk) 20:42, 11 September 2012 (UTC) — Berean Hunter   (talk)  21:47, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
 * No.

Can you make season 2 background text color white, please? It does not look cool as black. 88.238.239.217 (talk) 09:34, 12 September 2012 (UTC) — Berean Hunter   (talk)  11:31, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
 * There won't be any color changes for the next two weeks minimum. Too many socks...not interested in what they have to say.

Taylor Swift "Costumes & Courage"
Since Austin And Miss Swift are singing together she's obviously the special guest--Bella##Fan##262 (talk) 17:42, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
 * What did the show credits say. That is what is supposed to be in the article. Geraldo Perez (talk) 17:53, 8 October 2012 (UTC)
 * She clearly wasn't. If anything a young uncredited stuntwoman posed as Taylor Swift. -User:DanTD (talk) 00:21, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

Writers for ep25 - "Austin & Jessie & Ally All Star New Year"
Editors are removing two of the credited writers from the episode list for this episode. I watched the episode and the writers listed are "Wayne Conley" and "Mike Montesano & Ted Zizik". "Written by Wayne Conley" is listed at 4:39 in the episode and "Written by Mike Montesano & Ted Zizik" is listed at 27:02 in the episode. It is obvious that different parts of the episode were written by different writers. How it was written doesn't matter, all that matters is what is what actually aired. This is a single 49 minute episode. It is Season 3, Episode 6 for both Jessie and Austin & Ally. The title and content is the same for both shows. It had three writers, all three need to be in the writers column of the table. Geraldo Perez (talk) 22:18, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Edit Request on March 8, 2013
Can we make season 2 color box black? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Liam0035 (talk • contribs) 09:19, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 4 June 2013
solos and stray kitties? Its past june 2nd give us info!

142.161.53.217 (talk) 03:13, 4 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Feel free to provide some information from a reliable source. If you're not able to do so, demanding that it be updated will not make it happen faster. -- El Hef  ( Meep? ) 03:26, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 8 June 2013
put information fot Boy Songs & Badges its june 8th!

142.161.53.217 (talk) 18:09, 8 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: As I said last week - feel free to provide some information from a reliable source. If you're not able to do so, demanding that it be updated will not make it happen faster. -- El Hef  ( Meep? ) 20:21, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 9 June 2013
please put info for Boy Tracks and Badges. Its June 8th!

142.161.53.217 (talk) 01:13, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Do you even bother reading the replies to your previous demands demands? Geraldo Perez (talk) 01:52, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 9 June 2013
the info for boy tracks and badges is the following:

Ally is under a tight deadline to finish writing new songs for her demo reel, so Austin tries to write his own song instead of relying on Ally. Meanwhile, Trish becomes troop leader of JJ and Nelson's Pioneer Troup, and Dez becomes an honarary member to get the merit badges he never got as a kid.

the source:http://austinally.wikia.com/wiki/Boy_Songs_%26_Badges

142.161.53.217 (talk) 01:16, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: First sentence is copyright violation from Disney press release. Episode has aired. Someone who has seen the ep should be able to write originally worded summary. Geraldo Perez (talk) 01:55, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 9 June 2013
the info for tracks and troubles is the following:

Jimmy Starr signs his daughter, Kira, as the newest recording artist to his label. When Kira has her first performance, she wants to sing one of Ally’s songs, but Ally wants to sing it herself. Meanwhile, Austin accidentally records over one of Kira’s demos for her new album, and Jimmy thinks Austin and Ally are trying to sabotage Kira’s career.

The source: http://austinally.wikia.com/wiki/Tracks_%26_Trouble

142.161.53.217 (talk) 01:18, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: No the actual source is a Disney press release - see and the above description is a blatant copyright violation. We can use wikia for descriptions of aired episodes if we provide attribution. See WP:PLAGIARISM. But not for future episodes particular when Wikia blatantly rips off Disney. Best is view episode and write up a description in your own words. Geraldo Perez (talk) 01:49, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 14 June 2013 For the views of 6/8/13
I have the real views for 6/8/13 2.5M http://sonofthebronx.blogspot.com.br/2013/06/disney-channel-ratings-june-3-9-2013.html

98.18.47.240 (talk) 22:15, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Viewing numbers must be from a reliable source, not some anonymous person's blog. Geraldo Perez (talk) 23:02, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Production Code 2-10
The US copyright office messed up the entries for 2-10, showing this for "Freaky Friends & Fan Fiction" and this for "Partners & Parachutes". I suppose the "Partners" one was registered first but both were registered within a month, but we may need a second source to confirm which one belongs.

Eric Dean Seaton's website credits confuse it even further: http://ericdeanseaton.com/credits/ shows a completely different numbering scheme for all episodes, "Freaky Friends" at 211 and "Partners & Parachutes" at 212. -AngusWOOF (talk) 22:51, 15 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Looks like Disney made a mistake in their filing with the Copyright office. The Copyright office only reports what Disney tells them. What is filed there by Disney is supposed to be authoritative. I am a bit surprised with conflict with Eric Dean Seaton's website credits. I'd expect he would have the right production codes for the stuff he worked on. The futon critic episode guide codes, the ones they have anyway, seem to match the Copyright office and also conflict with what Seaton's site says. I suggest we drop 2-10 from the list for now and wait for another source. Geraldo Perez (talk) 23:16, 15 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't know how many of you are aware of this, but production codes aren't always in sync with genuine episode numbers. -User:DanTD (talk) 13:04, 16 September 2013 (UTC)
 * That seems to be the case here with Eric Dean Seaton's blog's covering only the episodes he directed. I'm okay with listing both, as long as there's a reliable and accurate source for the episode numbers. -AngusWOOF (talk) 20:18, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

I finished filling out all the production codes for season 2 - all episodes are listed now at the copyright office. 210 is still shown for two episodes. 217 is missing completely from the list. "Freaky Friends & Fan Fiction" is listed first in the list along with a bunch of other episodes in production code sequence. "Partners & Parachutes" is at the very end of the list, added almost as an afterthought, and it is out of sequence. I think from that we can be confortable with listing 210 for "Freaky Friends & Fan Fiction" and 217 for "Partners & Parachutes" in the list. Geraldo Perez (talk) 17:45, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

Edit request on March 22 2014
The viewer number info for "Cupids & Cuties" is listed as 1.9, this is actually the prime time average for the shows airing on the Sunday premiere night on Disney Channel, listed by Futon Critic http://www.thefutoncritic.com/ratings/2014/03/11/sundays-cable-ratings-and-broadcast-finals-resurrection-walking-dead-top-both-viewers-demos-336013/cable_20140309/I notice the * sign. 1.9 was not the individual numbers for Austin & Ally. May I please suggest for 1.9 not to be listed as the total viewers, as it the prime time average for Disney Channel that night. The viewer numbers of the other episodes are the total viewers and the 1.9 prime time average does not match up. (talk) 16:30, 22 March 2014 (UTC)


 * You're right, I commented out the info and the invalid reference used to support it. Geraldo Perez (talk) 05:34, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Is this reliable
I found a source from the Austin & Ally writers that has the prod. code for Hunks & Homecoming https://twitter.com/austinallyroom/status/427983467297505281 108.234.108.77 (talk) 00:24, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Twitter not usable unless marked verified by twitter. Geraldo Perez (talk) 00:30, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Proposed article split
I was wondering if we should split the content of this page into Austin & Ally (season 1), (season 2), and (season 3) CHall2002 (talk) 03:42, 19 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Any split would require that season articles contain significantly more than just the lead, an infobox and the episode table. Have you drafted something like that in your userspace? -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 03:48, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

New Crush?
For Ally's and Austin's New Crush should we move them back to Hunks & Homecoming and Fashion Shows & First Impressions because Ally's and Austin's New Crush are just alternate titles that air on TV. And all of A&A's episodes have an & While The titles with ampersands were confirmed by the writers of the show. CHall2002 (talk) 18:02, 21 August 2014 (UTC)
 * They are also the titles that Disney is selling the show as on Amazon.com and iTunes. See for iTunes titles and Amazon. They are the primary titles as that is the final title chosen when the show is being sold for download. What the writers desire does not override what the final production chooses for the titles. Geraldo Perez (talk) 18:13, 21 August 2014 (UTC)


 * The "New Crush" titles have been used on ATT Uverse On Demand and broadcast rerun material as well, so we should retain those titles or list both versions. -AngusWOOF (talk) 19:05, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

Edit request on December 12 2014
Can we please change the color of Season 4 to Gold instead of a brighter red? (talk) 16:59, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

Copyright
This articles contains a lot of copyright text. I've only checked the season 4 sub-section, and Google proved at least 3 or 4 were copied from other sites. Callmemirela ( Go Habs Go! ) 03:35, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Please remove the WP:COPYVIOs you find with explanation of where you found the source. Need to be careful for aired episodes, though as sometimes other sites copy wiki. Also we can use descriptions in Wikia if we give attribution as Wikia has same license terms as wikipedia. Geraldo Perez (talk) 03:44, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I will do small bits by bits. I will start with season 4 right now, then move on later. Callmemirela  ( Go Habs Go! ) 04:04, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Is there any way to detect between copyright violations on Wikipedia and copy-pasted content on other websites? Callmemirela  ( Go Habs Go! ) 02:29, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Not that I know. It is possible that wiki is the original and the other site is the copy. Only way to tell is timestamps if that is available. It could also be the same person editing both sites. Geraldo Perez (talk) 03:03, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Season 4 Episode 14: Bad Seeds & Bad Dates
I've changed the source for RTitle to The Futon Critic as the September 20, 2015, air date was no longer being supported by Zap2it. Zap2it and our DirecTV listings, which I'm not sure where they get their info from, show an air date of September 4, 2015, while Disney ABC Press and The Futon Critic show an air date of September 20, 2015, which is the correct air date. I suspect this is an episode that aired in Canada first, but of course we should only focus on the US aspect since that's where it originated. From looking at the Broadcast section of the main article, the series premiered in Canada on September 1, 2015, but this is a season four episode. If the series is just premiering over there, the first season would be season one.

I've noticed the same thing with the season four Jessie episode "Identity Thieves," where its actual air date is today (now airing), but Zap2it and DirecTV show September 2, 2015, so my only other guess is that these are simply typos, but I'm not sure. Amaury (talk) 23:57, 11 September 2015 (UTC)
 * http://tvlistings.zap2it.com/tv/austin-and-ally-bad-seeds-and-bad-dates/EP014948480089?aid=zap2it (http://www.webcitation.org/6bTY04YCv) shows "NEW" for Sun 9/20 but says first aired September 4, 2015. So Zap2it is inconsistent on its own page. Probably correct that the first aired statement is for the Canadian airing and the "NEW" for the US airing. The fact that there is no watch online video link on main schedule means it hasn't aired in the US yet as that must happen before iTunes and Amazon are permitted to sell it for downloading or streaming. Geraldo Perez (talk) 00:53, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Makes sense, kind of, and the promotion commercial on Disney Channel confirms September 20. Still, you'd think they'd have the US premiere date, if that is indeed the case. Amaury (talk) 01:27, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I can't really add much more, 's explanation seems plausible. nyuszika7h (talk) 09:59, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

Alternative title for "Hunks & Homecoming"
I found some sources that call the episode "Popstars & Parades" (spelling varies):


 * http://www.disney.co.uk/disney-channel/videos/austin-and-ally/austin-ally-popstars-and-parades-v~1_vn7u8uc1/#/videoId/austin-ally-popstars-and-parades
 * http://go.sky.com/catchup/programme/content/videos/episodes/01ad7c37d57fd410VgnVCM1000000b43150a____

It seems Sky incorrectly lists it as episode 56 instead of 57, but the summary matches. nyuszika7h (talk) 13:33, 26 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Since this originated in the US, I think we only use the US episode titles, but don't quote me that. I know for a fact we only use the US air dates for shows that originated in the US, but, again, I'm not sure if that extends to episode titles as well. Amaury (talk) 13:45, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

Unlock
Any reason why this page has been locked for so long? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 106.131.168.23 (talk) 10:23, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
 * This is the fourth time the article has been protected. Typically, each block is longer than the last. This one expires on 29 January 2016. -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 11:12, 24 December 2015 (UTC)

Series finale
Is this considered a reliable source? nyuszika7h (talk) 10:52, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
 * I can't answer the question, but I find it interesting how the third season was originally going to be the last. Also, I don't know why they're calling the episodes airing on January 10, 2016, the mid-season finale. Even if they are the final episodes, we're already past the mid-season. Amaury (talk) 14:39, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
 * You mean "mid-season premiere", and that's probably used for the show returning from a hiatus anywhere within a season. nyuszika7h (talk) 14:40, 24 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Whoops. Yeah, that's what I meant. I guess that could be said for any show, really, but that just makes things confusing, honestly, especially when in this case, the hiatus isn't only with Austin & Ally. Nickelodeon, Disney Channel, and Disney XD air new Christmas episodes on the last week of November or the first or second week of December before taking a short break, and that's how it's always worked from as far back as I can remember. It'd be better to just go by the number of episodes that have aired in the current season, in my opinion, to use mid-season or whatever term.


 * Anyway, for your question, I'm sure or  could provide answers. Amaury (talk) 14:51, 24 December 2015 (UTC)


 * International Business Times is generally a reliable source but reading the article in that Indian edition I get the feeling of reading something from a non native-English speaker. The focus is their market in India, not sure how the terms used there match the ones we use. The facts are likely correct about those being the last two episodes of the series and details about what the episodes are about. I'd ignore stuff about mid-season finale, premiere as generally we don't care. Would be nice to get another reference for the info though. Geraldo Perez (talk) 15:05, 24 December 2015 (UTC)

Disney Channel is now running ads about the episodes on January 10, 2016—"Musicals & Moving On" and "Duets & Destiny", as indicated in the list—comprising the one-hour series finale. However, locating a reliable source which can be used in the series overview section is pretty hard to come by at the moment. The summaries of the episodes from either Zap2it or Disney ABC Press don't explicitly reveal the two episodes to be the finale. There is at least one clip on YouTube about this but may not be used as a reference due to copyright concerns per the uploader of that videoclip. MPFitz1968 (talk) 20:17, 30 December 2015 (UTC)


 * It looks like the info is not seriously in doubt and the IBT source at the top of this section looks solid. I suggest using that as the reference but tagging it with . Geraldo Perez (talk) 20:24, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
 * I saw the commercial in question as well within the last week, but I didn't think it was reliable enough on its own as it's just hearsay. Amaury (talk) 20:48, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Meh. It's not "hearsay" when a television network advertises its own show's "series finale" – in fact, that's pretty much the definition of "definitive". It's also worth remembering that WP:V doesn't require sourcing in all cases, just in those in which information is likely to be "challenged" – I'm not sure a network advertising the end of the run of one of its own shows is really "challengeable"... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 07:17, 31 December 2015 (UTC)
 * WP:V doesn't require citations, but it does require that everything is verifiable, and TV commercials aren't verifiable. This has been a long term problem with them. If somebody challenges content based on a commercial, how do you cite it? -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 07:58, 31 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Flip it around – we shouldn't be challenging stuff on our end and insisting upon "inline sourcing" for something that we know to be true. While we can't "cite" a TV ad, if we know that the ad exists and we know what it says, that provides the verification. What I'm suggesting is, at this point, it doesn't make any sense to keep reverting the "finale date" anymore, as we know when that is, and it's only about 10 days away in any case. Insisting upon a "reliable source" in a specific case like this is not "a hill worth dying on"... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 08:06, 31 December 2015 (UTC)
 * The ad has been published on an official outlet so is a reliable primary source for the info it includes. This discussion is documentation that multiple wiki editors have independently verified that source and confirmed the info presented. So if verification fails in the future we have proof that verification was done. Much like dead links, we trust that the editor who originally added it verified the contents. Primary sources should be backed up with secondary sources, though, which also makes verification much easier. And we do have a secondary source for the info, not a real good one, but sufficient. This info is pretty solid. Geraldo Perez (talk) 16:34, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Austin and Alias
In the summary episode summary, it says that After Dez spills Trish's drink of her shirt that she becomes "extremely angry". It should be "extremely nasty to him".

Tretty 05:49, 2 January 2016 (UTC)
 * You'll need to be more specific as to what it is you're referring to. Amaury (talk) 05:52, 2 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Do not remove other users' comments. In any case, you're still not being clear as to what it is you're referring to. It doesn't really matter, though. Both essentially mean the same thing. Amaury (talk) 15:33, 2 January 2016 (UTC)
 * It should be "she's so angry that she becomes extremely nasty to him". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.83.60.230 (talk) 22:51, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

I've updated this episode summary a little, in light of persistent editor who continues to inject a more detailed interpretation of what leads to Dez's nearly depleting the gift card. In the end, I don't think it is necessary to even bring up Trish's explosiveness at the end of the episode. The fact is, every time she insulted Dez, even if Dez provoked her (i.e., spilling the drink on her shirt), he used the card. I just updated the summary to say, "This eventually gets out of hand...". Why make a fuss over whether Trish is angry or she "unleashes a lot of nasty insults at him"? Episode summaries should provide enough info to make readers aware of what the episode is about, but not so much unnecessary detail that it attempts to substitute for watching the episode. MPFitz1968 (talk) 20:37, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

A number of episodes are lacking guest starring credits
This is especially the case for the early episodes, although for those, there is also the alternative method of providing the actor/actress name in parentheses by the character name in the summary text. By the fourth season, however, there are a number of episodes listing guest stars, though I can't say whether they are complete based on how the rest of the article is. There needs to be consistency in the reporting of the credits throughout the episode list, and I'm planning to add the missing guest starring credits to whatever episodes I can catch while it is still running on Disney Channel.

So far, I've updated two episodes: "Presidents & Problems" from season three (though still an incomplete guest star list, as I recall seeing two names listed—was more focused on correcting Reggie Brown's credit in that episode anyway); and "Buzzcuts & Beginnings" from season four. Anyone else who wants to help fill in the missing guest starring credits is welcome to do so. MPFitz1968 (talk) 18:20, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I don't currently have this show downloaded and it's not on Netflix but I'll try to find the episodes online and help correct/complete the list. nyuszika7h (talk) 18:56, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * This a problem, as like other "ended" Disney Channel shows, I've noticed that reruns of A&A (esp. the "early" episodes) are continuing to wane in frequency. (Shake It Up has only been done for about 3 years, and AFAICT, they don't rerun it much at all, anymore. Meanwhile, I think all reruns of I Didn't Do It and Dog with a Blog have been halted entirely...) So if somebody's going to try to do this, they'll probably need to do it soon!... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:13, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I can confirm Dog with a Blog and I Didn't Do It are still running on Disney Channel, though I Didn't Do It isn't on that much, but Dog with a Blog is on plenty late at night/early in the morning, depending on if you watch the East or West feed. http://tvlistings.zap2it.com/tvlistings/ZCSGrid.do?stnNum=12510&channel=34&aid=zap2it Amaury ( talk &#124; contribs ) 21:23, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I see four episodes from season 2 that are available on demand (both thru my ISP and Watch Disney, the same episodes: Ferris Wheels & Funky Breath, Girlfriends & Girl Friends, Campers & Complications, Freaky Friends & Fan Fiction). Working on getting the credits from those right now. MPFitz1968 (talk) 19:18, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Some of those will be useful: I think "Ferris Wheels & Funky Breath" is the first appearance of Kira; "Freaky Friends & Fan Fiction" may be the first appearance of Chuck. As to your earlier point, for a show like this, I vastly prefer "Guest stars:..." listings below the episode blurb rather than "in-text parenthetical" listings of guest stars like a number of the earlier episode listings of this page does currently... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:23, 27 July 2016 (UTC)

Most of the season four guest stars should be correct as I'm the one who added them when I started keeping track of that information shortly after I started working on TV articles in summer 2015. I kind of went about things a weird way when I started, though. At first I just cleaned up articles and fixed grammar. Then I started adding upcoming episodes on top of that. Then I started adding guest stars on top of that. Then I started adding director and writer credits on top of that. Then I started adding viewership data on top of that. Although for that last one, it took a little while longer after I started adding director and writer credits than it took to start adding the other stuff. Amaury ( talk &#124; contribs ) 21:29, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * On that topic, do we want to note the actors for the main characters in the first episode's summary? I guess it doesn't hurt since this is a separate page, but then again, readers are expected to also read the main article, which gives this info. Also, I see that the actors for some co-stars are also included in parentheses, do we want to keep those, or not as we don't normally list them as they are considered minor roles? nyuszika7h (talk) 12:22, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Co-stars shouldn't be listed as they're only minor roles, as you say. Amaury ( talk &#124; contribs ) 14:19, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Caveat: "Minor" characters, if recurring like Dallas, should probably still be included IMO. I think there is a fair expectation that a subset of readers will want to know who the actor playing a character like Dallas is. But I agree that "one-off" "co-stars" should generally not be included... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:44, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I am surprised that a significant recurring character, and I mean shown to be significant when the character is described in the episode summary as important to that episode, was not able to get his agent to negotiate a guest star credit. The listed guest stars in the episode summary should stick with actors who actually got that credit. Adding the actor's name in parenthesis after his first mention in the episode summary seems like a real good idea here. Geraldo Perez (talk) 17:07, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Noah Centineo was actually in three different A&A episodes – could somebody please check and verify that he wasn't credited in any of them?! (I can see him not getting credited for his first episode appearance – but I'd be shocked if he didn't get credited for the later two episodes... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:17, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I've finished adding the guest stars for season 1, and in episode 3 he's only a co-star, but in episode 10 he's a guest star. I think this also happened with a character in Girl Meets World (initially co-star then eventually guest star), though I don't remember who. nyuszika7h (talk) 21:23, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Likely Smackle – IIRC, Smackle is barely seen in "Girl Meets Popular"; she doesn't become a character in her own right until later ("Girl Meets Smackle"). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 22:04, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * So he's just credited as a "co-star" in "Club Owners & Quinceañeras" (ep. #1.8) too? If so, that surprises me, as his part is beefier in "Club Owners & Quinceañeras". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 23:14, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Oh, yeah, I didn't pay much attention to that episode's co-stars. But I just re-checked, and indeed, he is just a co-star in that episode too. nyuszika7h (talk) 08:37, 29 July 2016 (UTC)

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Unjustified removal of author from The Futon Critic ratings sources
As I mentioned, it's not rocket science. The ratings came from Travis Yanan's Twitter, which therefore makes him the author. It's even mentioned where they came from on The Futon Critic ratings posts. Amaury ( talk &#124; contribs ) 01:34, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Hmmmm... I think I agree with on this – for Travis Yanan to be the "author", his Twitter posts would need to be sourced directly. But as we're actually sourcing TFC, and they're putting their ratings reports down as a "staff report" (though with the reports citing Yanan), I think there shouldn't be an author for the ratings sources... But this is an odd situation where TFC is getting the ratings second- (third-(??!)) hand, so it's kind of weird... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 01:39, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
 * It's similar to how they report their broadcast ratings, although with broadcast ones they add a summary. The source is "Nielsen Media Research" but that doesn't make Nielsen the author of TFC article. - Brojam (talk) 01:44, 30 November 2018 (UTC)