Talk:List of Oval Office desks

Roosevelt Desk
There are problems here. The Taft Oval Office suffered a major fire on December 24, 1929, and had to be rebuilt by Herbert Hoover. Did the Theodore Roosevelt Desk survive the fire? Also, the two photos at right show different desks. Which is the Theodore Roosevelt Desk? -- BoringHistoryGuy (talk) 23:00, 22 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, the Theodore Roosevelt desk survived the 1929 fire. According to William Seale (The President's House 1986), Hoover's sons moved the desk before the fire reached the Oval Office. A group of Grand Rapids, Michigan furniture-makers donated a new desk, which Hoover used for the rest of his term, and FDR used as his Oval Office desk. -- BoringHistoryGuy (talk) 14:23, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Trump
As editing has begun with a new president i just thought i would attempt to build concensus here. While trump has done a quick redecoration of the office, it seems the new rug and curtians are merely the ones george w bush used. I dont think we can say without a doubt that trump will keep the resolute desk, even though he is currently using it less than 24 hours into his presidency. My suggestion is to leave trump listed as using the resolute for now, but if he chooses a new desk at some point, we will switch him over to that desk in the list without a caveat that he used the resolute for x number of days. Found5dollar (talk) 03:37, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

DiaperDon Desk
Shouldn't we get the #DiaperDon desk into this page somehow? It seems historically significant since he signed H.J. Resolution 37, 44, 57 and 58 while sitting at it per https://edition.cnn.com/2017/03/27/politics/donald-trump-tiny-desk/index.html

Or maybe, if it wasn't used in the Oval Office, it needs it's own article and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Furnishings_of_the_White_House can link to it? I'd like to know more about this desk and how Trump came to use it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.190.64.125 (talk) 20:19, 27 November 2020 (UTC)
 * 107.190.64.125, Unfortunately that table is neither a desk, nor is it in the Oval Office. Therefore it does not belong on this page.--Found5dollar (talk) 15:55, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Shouldn't we list Theodore Roosevelt on the table...
...using the desk named after him? He used it from 1903 to 1909. Problem is that the table lists 'term of office', and TR started using the desk a couple of years into his unexpected term. Solution? Randy Kryn 16:02, 21 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I guess the problem is the Oval Office wasn't created until after Roosevelt's term, so TR's use of his desk wouldn't fit the page name. I pity the poor fool (referring, sadly, to myself). Randy Kryn 16:07, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

FDR
So did FDR use the Resolute desk at all? The Resolute desk article states he was the one who had the door added to the front, but this article says he used the Hoover desk...74.137.104.182 (talk) 22:41, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
 * quote from this article "The desk resided in the White House in various rooms, and had a hinged front panel added to it by Franklin D. Roosevelt, until Jacqueline Kennedy found it languishing in the "White House broadcast room."[8]" In other words, he used the desk, just not in the oval office.--Found5dollar (talk) 08:40, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

C&O desk, where is it now?
A chart on the page has a '?' about the current location of the C&O desk. Anyone up for a desk hunt? Its page says there is replica at the GHWBush library, but that is the only mention of a current rendition and apparently it's not the original desk. Any ideas or research? Randy Kryn 14:36, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I have literally been working on figuring that out for years. I even tried reaching out to the White House Office of the Curator but never heard back from them (it is possible I had the wrong email). Please feel free to try to find this info. Perhaps a second try at reaching out to the Curator or maybe the George Bush Presidential Library knows where it is.--Found5dollar (talk) 17:20, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Theodore Roosevelt tenure
By my count, the TR desk was used 1909-1929, that's 20 years, and 1945-1961, that's 16 years, or 36 total. The Resolute desk was used 1961-1963, that's almost three years, 1977-1989 12 years, and 1993-2021, almost 28 years, or 42 total, taking one off for the partial years. I'm going to change the lead, do we really need a source for this? I think it falls under WP:CALC. Also check my math please. GA-RT-22 (talk) 02:07, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * GA-RT-22, you are right! I think I may have meant "most administrations" when I wrote that but since that has also changed. thank you for updating.--Found5dollar (talk) 15:54, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I think it was correct when you wrote it, but the years have caught up with us. GA-RT-22 (talk) 18:43, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Is there a calculation template for routine arithmetic? It would be pretty handy to be able to include code like these examples:     
 * I know that there are Help:Extension:ParserFunctions that do a lot of that sort of thing, but are they permissible in an article or only within a template?
 * It's probably a moot point here, since the tables (in the formatting sense of "table") don't have columns for number of years in use. But it's still good to know for cases when WP:CALC applies, since it helps show the calculation, at least to editors. — Steve98052 (talk) 11:59, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Earlier presidential desks
This list article covers only the six Oval Office presidential desks. But there were presidential desks before the Oval Office existed. I would assume that there is a list of those desks too, though I haven't been able to find it. This article should have a "see also" list that includes the "List of presidential desks before the Oval Office", whatever that post's actual article title may be. Steve98052 (talk) 05:27, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Steve98052, there does not seem to be a page listing other desks used by presidents in their executive offices before the creation of the Oval Office, but it is a great idea! It most likely makes sense as an additional table on this page. I'm currently working on overhauling the pages for each of the 6 desks right now (starting with the Wilson desk and Johnson desk based off new documents I'm finding in the national archives. I will come back to this page to update it with the new info I've found eventually and will look at adding new sections at that point.--Found5dollar (talk) 15:52, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm glad my idea is useful. Unless there turns out to be a lot of presidential desks from before the Oval Office, and enough documentation about them to build a substantial article for earlier desks, including them on this page in their own section makes more sense.
 * In that case, it would be appropriate to rename this page to a more inclusive title, with the appropriate redirect of course.
 * — Steve98052 (talk) 01:41, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Wrong desk
Hey everyone that watches this page. I've been fixing up the pages on the Wilson and Johnson desks and stumbled on something. I just found |this picture of people actively redecorating for Nixon's Oval Office on January 20, 1969. The only issue is the desk in the image. It is clearly not the Johnson desk or the Wilson desk. It could possibly be the Theodore Roosevelt desk due to the carved detail in middle of the center drawer. Do you think they brought the desk over from the Vice President's Ceremonial Office in the Eisenhower building instead of the Vice President's office in the Capitol and had to switch it out later? What do you think is going on? --Found5dollar (talk) 00:59, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
 * My guess, and I have absolutely nothing to back this up, is that LBJ took his desk with him when he left. He was obviously quite attached to it, having used it for so many years, and it ended up in his museum, suggesting he may have made arrangements for it before he left office.
 * Then along came inauguration day, they needed a desk for the Oval Office, but Nixon hadn't made any arrangements, having been busy with the transition. So they just grabbed any old desk. The one in the Eisenhower building would have been a lot closer and more convenient than the one in the Capitol. So maybe a mistake, maybe just expediency.
 * By the way, there is a replica Resolute Desk in the Nixon Museum, even though he never used it. GA-RT-22 (talk) 18:33, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Biden administration
Can we just leave out Biden for a day or two? We don't have a source that says he is using this desk. He also can't possibly have used it yet. Wikipedia is not the newspaper, and Biden could still pull a Jimmy Carter. GA-RT-22 (talk) 18:55, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

In this live stream (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYL3gkqUVb8) here, we can see him still use the desk to sign executive orders. If the desk was to change, it would have changed it by now. So i'm confident to add it to the  article - JamesHawkes0161 (talk) 22:16, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
 * the Oval Office has not been redecorated yet. We need to give them at least a day or two to settle in. Most presidents claim they didn't pick a desk until their first full day in the job. --Found5dollar (talk) 22:26, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
 * The live stream is not a source. It's WP:OR. Recentism applies here. I'm sure Biden used the desk today. Carter used the Wilson desk for a day or two before staff could move the Resolute desk in, but we don't say the Wilson desk was used by Carter for three days or whatever. There is no urgent need to update this article right now today. GA-RT-22 (talk) 22:37, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

And we may have a reference. If there is agreement I think we can start saying Biden is using the resolute until/if he redecorates again.--Found5dollar (talk) 00:01, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Personally I would wait at least until tomorrow but I withdraw my objection if someone wants to put this in. GA-RT-22 (talk) 00:05, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Today, the telegraph released this article, outlining the offices changes, the desk has been reported as staying, https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/21/spot-difference-joe-biden-has-swept-away-signs-donald-trump/. With this I am happy to add it back to the article and finalise this addition JamesHawkes0161 (talk) 15:06, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

New section about other presidential desks
Just trying to build up a consensus and figure out what we want from a section about other desks used by presidents before the Oval Office was built. I found this blog that, while it can't be used as a source in and of itself, nicely lays out other desks used by presidents. The issue I'm running into is what exactly this new section should be. Should it be a chronological list or just a paragraph touching on the other desks? Should it only be for desk used by presidents in their official offices or is it broader and includes their personal desk too? It also gets messy because the further back we go the less official spaces get. Do we include Lincoln's small personal desk that meetings could never have happened at? What about Jefferson's writing box or drafting table? I'm kind of leaning towards writing the section just as "Other Presidential desks" so we can talk about the important furniture pieces with out worrying if they were in the presidents official office or not. Maybe only includes ones that they used while president and in US owned or leased buildings? Right now I'm thinking the Treaty Table, Washington's desk, Lincoln's desk, and the "Mahogany Desk" mentioned in the | Frank Pagnotta memo. That Mahogany Desk may be better wrapped into a new early section about how the desk is chosen, but I haven't really started thinking about that yet. This is all a bit more confusing that planned.--Found5dollar (talk) 00:16, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Pinging.
 * I suppose this risks bleeding over into Presidential furniture in general. I'd like to know more about LBJ's helicopter chair for example. I think it would make sense to start with a "Other Presidential desks" section here, it can always be split out if it gets overgrown. I might include the "tiny desk" that Trump took some shit for, even though it's been used by other Presidents before him. GA-RT-22 (talk) 04:28, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Replying and :
 * Although I proposed the idea of an "other presidential desks" section, I don't claim to be a scholar of presidential furniture. I will mostly defer the matter to the editors who do the hard work of researching things.
 * I think the "tiny desk" belongs in such a section, even if it's more a table than a desk. My understanding, from more detailed stories about the "tiny desk" incident, is that it has long been used in bill-signing ceremonies, but that it had never before drawn attention. The explanation is that it is used in signing ceremonies because it's tiny, which allows more people to crowd into a photograph while a bill is signed into law. For example, the table in the photo illustrating the Signing ceremony article looks a whole lot like the table in this "tiny desk" article. I suppose I could offer this stub text for use in such a section:
 * == Signing table ==
 * Although technically a desk, the signing table has long been used in presidential signing ceremonies. Its first known use for that purpose was on [date], when President [name] signed the [act name].&lt;ref>...&lt;/ref> It has also been used for signing ceremonies by Presidents [name],&lt;ref>...&lt;/ref>, George H. W. Bush Bill Clinton, George W. Bush, Barack Obama, Donald Trump, and Joe Biden.
 * The signing table gained notoriety when President Trump used it for his 2020 Thanksgiving address.
 * I'm jumping to the conclusion that "signing table" is the customary name for the table. I dug up documentation of uses of the signing table as far back as Elder Bush and ran out of time.
 * And having researched the signing table this much, I suppose it's more than a stub at this point. But since there's not yet a consensus on where to put it, I'm just putting the draft here for now.
 * — Steve98052 (talk) 11:33, 1 March 2021 (UTC)
 * — Steve98052 (talk) 11:33, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Pre-Oval Office presidential desks
I've been working on discovering the desks used by presidents in their executive office or private quarters while Presidents. here is the messy info I have found so far. Lots of gaps and lots of doubles. I was compiling this in my personal sandbox but I figure laying it out here may welcome others to add to it. Feel free to edit this, add to it, or comment after it if you have suggestions or see any issues. I may start adding this info into the main article in a less messy way soon.--Found5dollar (talk) 01:37, 4 February 2022 (UTC)


 * I've spent a fair amount of time at the Hayes house and museum in Fremont. They have a couple dozen desks. I believe only one of them was used by him at the White House. But it wasn't his main desk, it was a standing desk he used in the library. Desk, Slant-Top – Register Desk GA-RT-22 (talk) 04:56, 4 February 2022 (UTC)


 * Added below. Parsing out which desk to include and which to leave out is a bit tough. I've been going by desks used by presidents in the official residence or executive office. This Hayes one seems to fit that bill.--Found5dollar (talk) 15:57, 4 February 2022 (UTC)


 * Nice work. The photograph of Washington's writing desk is so good it would be nice to see it go to article space. I'm adjusting the sorting properties, including the addition of an ordinal column. — Steve98052 (talk) 10:24, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

Before the Oval Office was created in 1909, several notable desks were used by presidents in their executive office or private quarters. The following table lists these furniture pieces.

info about the various spaces used as executive office

Layout
I know you're still working on this, but the problem I have right now is that the timeline graphic in the Chronology section gets cut off by the photos. Maybe add a "clear" or put the photos in a gallery. GA-RT-22 (talk) 01:50, 6 July 2022 (UTC)