Talk:Lugh

2005 edits
Deleted Lugansk from the list under following reasons:


 * originating Lugansk (as well as Luga) from that god is only a hypothesis - since there is a much more wide-spread Slav word "lug/luh/luka" (meaning a meadow - no mystics);
 * Lugansk is actually in Ukraine.

AlexPU

Odd-seeming that "lugs" are listed in an article named "Lugh". I suggest we might instead make Lug a small disambiguation page, rather than an immediate redirect. Alai 22:33, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)


 * I agree that Lug should be a disambiguation page, e.g.:

=Lug (disambiguation)=

In Irish mythology, Lug was an ancient god.

LUG is an acronym that stands for Linux User Group.

A lug is also a bicycle part.

Lug handles are a kind of flattened knob attached to the side of pottery. Lugs may have small perforations to take a cord. They are sometimes found on prehistoric ceramics such as Hembury ware.


 * Who wants to make it happen? Skoosh 01:58, 13 May 2005 (UTC)


 * I'll gladly do the spadework, if nobody minds me moving this page from Lug back to Lugh. The latter is, I'm quite sure, more commonly seen in English publications; it's also more commonly linked to than is Lug. (And if we were going to have this article at Lug, we would do better to use the accent – Luġ. [Yes, yes, that's a later-than-Old Irish innovation, rarara.]) QuartierLatin1968 [[Image:Red Flag waving.png|20px|The worker's flag is deepest red,/It shrouded oft our martyred dead]] 03:51, 23 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Works for me. Lug is technically more correct in an archaic sense, but Lugh is very common in modern parlance. Is it worth creating Lug (deity) preemptively? -- nae'blis (talk) 15:18, 23 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Yes, that's just it – in recent years we've gotten used to seeing gh and bh and mh everywhere. I don't see how it could hurt to make that preemptive redirect (maybe Lug (god) too) – I'll get on it. Other than that, the move should now be complete. QuartierLatin1968 [[Image:Red Flag waving.png|20px|The worker's flag is deepest red,/It shrouded oft our martyred dead]] 22:34, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

Welsh counterpart confusion
The article's introduction includes his Welsh counterpart is Llew Llaw Gyffes. The "Portrayal in Classical Times" section says that The Irish and Welsh cognates of Lugus are Lugh and Lleu, respectively. This confusion continues throughout the article. Different pages on Wikipedia give different opinions about whether Llew/Lleu are the same character, so I am not touching this one. Just a heads-up. :) --Telsa 09:47, 30 May 2005 (UTC)

Replacement of Irish Hubris
Someone needs to go through this article and remove the heavy Irish connotations that are leant to the God. He was in no way a primarily Irish god, and the idea that the first sentence of the page deems him an "Irish god." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Taintedruins (talk • contribs)
 * Lugh is entirely an Irish figure, testified only in Irish literature. Other articles discuss the early pan-Celtic Lugus and the related Welsh figure Lleu Llaw Gyffes.--Cúchullain t/ c 14:31, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

Myth Origin theory

 * I see this article presents a theory of the origin of Lug's fight with Balor, it claims that this story is of Greek and Mesopotamian origin, and it further claims that it is "widely held by scholars"...
 * "It is widely held by scholars that the battle between Lugh and Balor reflects a common Indo-European motif, the battle between the youthful hero and his tyrant Grandfather. This motif is likely to have come to the Celtic speaking lands through contact with Greek traders in the colony of Massillia (Marseille), to whom it came from the Persians, and originated in Mesopotamian tradition through the Prophecy of Sargon."
 * Well, if it so widely held then it shouldn't be difficult to find a reference or source for this claim/theory. I'm not saying it's not true, but it does seem an odd claim that a Celtic god is inspired by a Sumerian King, anyway the way it's currently put is unacceptable, it needs to be cited and possibly reworded. --Hibernian 04:43, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Question
Is it possible that the words 'Lugh' and 'Loki' have something to do with the English 'Luck', English 'lucky', German 'Glueck' (=Luck), and German 'Luege' (=Lie)? (This would surely explain the function, or role, of these deities (i.e. that of deception), as well as their ambiguity, or ambiguous status: afterall, luck can go either way). -- Lucian.

The English word luck appears to have come from the dutch word "luc". Luck and Lugh seem to be unrelated.--69.245.43.176 (talk) 22:58, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Remove section
Following this bit, which I've retained:
 * It is widely held by scholars that the battle between Lugh and Balor reflects a common Indo-European motif, the battle between the youthful hero and his tyrant Grandfather.

there was the following bit, which I've removed:
 * This motif is likely to have come to the Celtic speaking lands through contact with Greek traders in the colony of Massillia (Marseille), to whom it came from the Persians, and originated in Mesopotamian tradition through the Prophecy of Sargon.

Firstly, this multi-part journey of a single story is absurdly speculative. We would have a hard time proving even one of the steps. Second, it completely contradicts the preceding sentence: if it is supposed to be an "Indo-European" tradition, why is being tied to the Mesopotamians? And finally, if it is indeed supposed to be an Indo-Europeans, there is hardly a need to invent some complicated story explaining its tranmission through the historical placement of peoples. The Celts spoke an Indo-European language: if they could acquire that in the mists of prehistory, they could easily acquire an Indo-European legend as well. --Saforrest 22:45, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks for getting rid of that bit, it seemed very suspect to me too. But I think the first part also needs some revision. As I said above, if this interpretation is so "widely held by scholars", then it should be relatively easy to cite a reference for at-least one scholar or book or whatever, that mentions it, otherwise the "widely held" bit must be taken away, as we have no evidence whether it is widely held, or whether it's a fringe theory. And again I'm not saying it's not true, maybe it is, but it needs some citation and explanation. --Hibernian 04:21, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

"King of Suck": What's going on fellas? Hovea 11:16, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Removal of "Lugh in other media" section
Why was the "Lugh in other media" section deleted? The section was far from complete, but the content of the section had begun to present the continuing presence and influence of the mythology of Lugh in modern culture, thereby offering a context in which to appreciate the stories and details presented earlier in the article. The existence of the section created the opportunity for other editors to contribute and flesh out the subject matter. The section was deleted without any prior discussion. No article currently exists on the subject of Lugh's influence on modern culture, and if one were to be created it would likely be suggested for merging with the main Lugh article. The deletion of this section strikes me as premature, especially since the subject matter seems far from irrelevant. Why was the section deleted? Soundout (talk) 01:46, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

dxgf —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.187.109.66 (talk) 19:55, 15 June 2009 (UTC)

Lugh is just a dialect of the name Luz - the legendary leader of the the Lusitanians. Rus is a dialect of Luz. Russians are named after Celtic god Lug. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.145.120 (talk) 04:44, 14 September 2009 (UTC)


 * They're a Slavic tribe named after Norsemen, which makes this doubly unlikely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.179.27.219 (talk) 17:17, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

ENDOVELLICVS. This lusitanien god has a clear celtic etimology, from ie. *en(i)-dheub-wo-ell-ik-os (celt. *en(i)-dubwellikos), where ie. *dhew- > *dheub-/*dhub-, celt. *dub-i/*dub-u 'black', with ampliation *dub-wo-: cp. gaul. PN DOVEI, DOVELVS, DOVILVS, DOVALLVS; ogham. PN DOVATACIS, DOVATVCEAS, DOB(I)TVCI; celtib. PN DOVILIQ(VM), DOVITERVS, DOVIDENA; lusitanian PN DOVILONICOR(VM),DOVILVS, DOVITENA; callaecian PN DOVAECIA, DOVAIVS, DOVILVS.

Then, it is a darkness, an infernal god, dweller of the underworld (EN-DOVELLICVS or IN-DOVELLICVS, "[lit.] into the darkness").

PN = Personal Name.

Curiously, in the galician Middle Age, the first day of August, the door of the Cathedral of Santiago de Compostela was opened (Ianua foris), in which the pilgrims sought divine protection and blessing.This tradition is explainable by the cult of Ianus, a deity that is often identify the God lugu- or lucu- (cp. loºkoºbo in celtic tartessian inscriptions,c. VII bC; LVGVBO and LVCVBO in callaecian language and the cantabrian deity LVCVBO)(1).

Also in the Roman Walls of Lugo was found a relief where represents a naked warrior with spear (Lugus?), two oaks and an eagle over the fortress of Lugo (symbolic syncretism between the indigenous tradition of the "celtici gentis" and the augustean roman tradition).

(1) Related, in Callaecia, on other hand, with the greek god Hermes (roman Mercurius: cp. callaecian inscription ERMEEI DEVORI "to Hermes the king of the gods"). It is sure that the callaecian form LUCU- doesn't mean "sacred wood" like latin, because this word was celt. *nemeto-: cp. callaecian two place-names NEMETOBRIGA and other called NEMETOS. Think that some celtic tribal names and place-names can be related with ie. *lou-gh-/*lu-gh- "swamp".

From Lugo (Galicia).

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.60.137.167 (talk) 15:42, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Lugh's name and nature
The first four paragraphs of that section are so messed up, one would almost have to just erase them and start over to fix them. Almost every statement that isn't already given a cite needs to be marked with cite needed or original research tags. I don't have the time or energy to go through all of that, but someone needs to. Whateley23 (talk) 05:53, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Transcription of Ar-éadbair
I'm no expert on this subject, but the Early Modern Irish text listed for Ar-éadbair/Areadbhair, i.e. Aɼéadḃaiɼ, (Lugh) seams to be wrong. From what I can tell the ɼ character is simply a phonetic character, and one which isn't currently in use by the IPA at that (see Obsolete and nonstandard symbols in the International Phonetic Alphabet). My best guess is that whoever wrote it was attempting to write "insular Rs", i.e. ꞃ. However, the rendering of what is actually there is closer to an insular S (ꞅ). If this is the case then it should be changed to either normal Rs or ꞃ characters. (I suspect the former since strictly speaking insular characters, unlike dotted consonants for example, are simply glyph substitutions rather than characters in their own right.) Could someone please either confirm this or explain why the "tailed r" is used. Thanks.  Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ ( talk ) 01:08, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Lugh is not Irish, it is Celtic
The article focuses on Ireland, but there is a lot more to Lugh than just Ireland. He was present throughout the Celtic space, as can easily be seen looking at the article in other languages. Thanks, Regards. Rui &#39;&#39;Gabriel&#39;&#39; Correia (talk) 14:01, 28 February 2016 (UTC)


 * Lugh is Irish. For his ancient Celtic counterpart, see Lugus. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:54, 28 February 2016 (UTC)


 * Thanks. I see. What is happening, is that whereas there are two articles one Lugh and one Lugus as you rightly pointed out, when you are viewing Lugus in another language and want to switch to English, it goes to Lugh, which is what led me to arrive at that conclusion. Naturally this is not something wrong with the English-WP, but rather a question of the interlinks. Regards, Rui &#39;&#39;Gabriel&#39;&#39; Correia (talk) 15:14, 29 February 2016 (UTC)

Apollo
The connection of lux-words with Apollo (and comparable deities) is bad etymology. -λω is only a suffix here; none of the gods mentioned have a comparable etymology.Otto S. Knottnerus (talk) 18:06, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

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Origins of "Brionac"
I've heard a lot about Lugh's supposed spear Brionac and how it was apparently made up by a JRPG. I don't doubt this for a second, especially after the crap with Ichival and especially Mespyrian, but does anyone know which one it was? With "Ichival", I can point the misinformation about it to FE Genealogy of the Holy War. But does anyone here know which RPG made up Brionac? --Hawkatana (talk) 01:42, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Lugh is also Surya and There's Hinduism text that says his father is Dagda in Hinduism it's Kashyapa The Mythology and stories are the same.
Plus Cain is Found in The Book of Genius in The Christian Bible Cain is not Celtic in any form or Indian or anything outside of Christianity I have multiple sources That say Dagda is Lughs Father in Pre - Christian Ireland and most likely all the Lands that we're Celtic. Also In Gaul Lughus Married Epona, many believe Macha and Morrígan our sisters that would be how Morrígan is Dagdas wife in Irish mythology so if Dagdas Son Gets Married Morrígan would be Related to Macha yes by Marriage so Macha would be Morrígan's daughter in law. In Hinduism Kashyapa which is Dagda and or Sucellas in Hinduism is married to both Krodhavasa & Danu, Danu is Dagdas Wife not Daughter I have many books and information proving it.

Message me somehow Drecelto (talk) 00:37, 27 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Hinduism is not remotely "the same" as Irish mythology, and the Dagda is not a figure in Hinduism.
 * If Lugh is not actually a god of sun or light, what would the connection to Surya be?
 * Cain is not mentioned in the article at all, and seems to have no relevance to Lugh. (While there is indeed no apparent connection to Celtic myth or Hinduism, it isn't true that Cain is not found outside Christianity - Genesis is also part of the Torah in Judaism.) Vultur~enwiki (talk) 03:26, 23 January 2024 (UTC)
 * is so Kashyapa his mythology matches The Celtic Deity Sucellas & Revo & Dagda etc and Lugh matches Surya I studied Hinduism and have friends who practice. I also read many Scholarly Books on The Ancient Celtic Past as well as other Ancient people's Mythologies Drecelto (talk) 21:07, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Also Know Cain is found in Judaism I wrote about it in my book so Cain he Hebrew not Celtic. Drecelto (talk) 21:08, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
 * preserved by Bards in fact
 * Cain The Orgin of
 * The Name is Hebrew
 * it is also a story told in
 * The Hebrew Bible
 * 45.
 * The Tanakh which is Judaism,
 * That's from my book and I also learned many religions and studied. Also have sources from Scholars matching Celtic Mythology with Hinduism as well which I listed in my book my Researches.
 * I study Irish mythology Welsh mythology Iberian mythology Gaulsih Mythology, Greek Mythology Roman mythology Basque Mythology,  Muisca Mythology Hinduism, Christianity, Buddhism & more. Drecelto (talk) 21:15, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
 * I never said Lugh isn't a God of Light I believe he is. Surya is also a God of Light and Sun. Drecelto (talk) 21:25, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
 * I didn't say that Dagda himself is but Kashyapa a God that is pre Celtic that would be his parallel is. Also yes Surya is a sun God so is Vishnu Celts didn't believe in individual avatars like in Hinduism so all of Suryas avatars would contribute to Lugh in some way. In Gaulish Mythology Lughus was seen with Epona another connection for Surya & Saranyu. Lughus and Epona are also found in Hispanic Mythology in Hinduism though Kashyapa's son is Surya and his wife is Danu there for abroad it was the same of course without added Characters of later myths like kings and queens Irish mythology has. Drecelto (talk) 21:37, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Not sure how to message you wish I could Drecelto (talk) 21:43, 26 June 2024 (UTC)