Talk:Makaton

Untitled
Am researching the use of Makaton in the mainstream classroom and am looking for practical teaching approaches. Can anyone help?

"State to state"
"Makaton Keyword Signing varies from country to country and can even vary from state to state within each country" sounds a bit POV to me, suggesting that all countries have states. The US certainly does, but the UK and Canada do not. Is there a NPOV term that could be used instead? I would say "region" but that does not denote a particular demarcated subdivision. &mdash; Paul G 07:27, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Paul G - I agree - i suggest 'from country to country and within countries' which retains the meaning and is more succinct Sarahjeantaylor 19:24, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure the original "varies from ... state-to-state" is true - forget the issue about the wording. Generally the Makaton signs are based on those from the deaf language in a particular country. Never quite sure why, might be more politically convenient as it means there are people out there that understand the signs. However this means that Makaton as an approach is adopted - rather than the specifics - from one country to another. Literally the signs used in one country differ to another. To a lesser extent ths symbols too. Whether there is a country where more than one set of signs is in use that is officially designated Makaton, I doubt it. A glance at the web site shows that getting Makaton developed for a new country is not easy.

--Mcajfo (talk) 23:39, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

population
What is the estimated number of those actively using Makaton? -Tim Rhymeless (Er...let's shimmy) 08:17, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

POV?
This bit in particular strikes me as having an un-wikipedian tone (original research?):


 * When teaching Makaton, you must ensure the person can see your hands and that you teach signs relevant to the person, rather than always working through the stages. Nouns like 'toilet' should be taught before non-practical signs e.g. please, hello, goodbye etc. You must always say the word while signing or the pupil won't see the need to use it.

85.226.59.234 (talk) 22:11, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

It is important sometimes to remember what Makaton is not. Specifically it is not BSL, nor really a sign language. It is deliberately intended as a way of emphasising English (or whatever natural spoken language is used). There is no real Makaton grammar. You are supposed to talk English at the same time as speaking - something you can't really do with BSL. This wording could be seen as a point-of-view, but I believe it represents the official line of the Makaton charity, and is partly to do with this usage. I've had the first few levels of official training, and I remember this being emphasised.

--Mcajfo (talk) 23:27, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Copyright of the language
The Makaton language is copyright to the charity, it is not permitted to create Free software that helps people to learn Makaton or share videos of Makaton signing. This is pretty unusual in a language, perhaps a section on that would be of value. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.189.65.98 (talk) 14:32, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Broken link
[http://www.makaton.org/about/mvdp_history.htm. "Makaton: the early years". Retrieved 2010-05-17.] is broken. Any other source for early history, please? Vernon White '''. . . Talk''' 18:50, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Discussion about blanking section
Please discuss blanking the section here before blanking it yourself and reverting the edits of bots and other community users. Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 17:35, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Re: the current conflict on the vocabulary section--it remains vulnerable to deletion so long as it's unsourced. It's also unclear as to the rationale for its rather voluminous listing here. 76.248.147.199 (talk) 18:11, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

It is very unclear as to the rationale for the voluminous listing. It is the same as listing every digit of PI, or every song from the discography of an artist. I would like to see it removed from this article. 85.237.211.184 (talk) 18:14, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Aha; also note IP range of 85 is akin to that of recently blocked accounts for edit warring and harassment of users--doesn't help the argument, so perhaps it would be best to allow new users to comment. 76.248.147.199 (talk) 18:18, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The sources were noted in the original section................ 'Evidence:

Harrison, D. and Virden, F. (2011). Assistant practitioners lead way. British Journal of Healthcare Assistants, 5(8),409. Hooper, H. and Walker, M. (2002) Makaton peer tutoring evaluation: 10 years on. BJLD 30: 38–42. Reeves, D. (2011). Applying choices and possibilities. Speech and Language Therapy in Practice, (3)4-6. Sheehy, K. and Duffy, H. (2009). Attitudes to Makaton in the ages of integration and inclusion, International Journal of Special Education, 24, 2."
 * I don't get why this is so controversial. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ramaksoud2000 (talk • contribs) 18:29, 31 December 2011 (UTC)


 * It doesn't strike me as particularly controversial. However, the section on core vocabulary had no inline citations, as do most other sections of the article, and as is expected of a well-written Wiki entry. Generally long lists are discouraged here, unless there's a compelling reason to include the four hundred plus words. While the purpose of the stages is explained in the article, it's not immediately clear that the listing elucidates the stages' effectiveness, or sheds light on the subject. 76.248.147.199 (talk) 18:40, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * One of the reasons for unblanking is because the ip that was blanking was making personal attacks against me and evading blocks. Also, this is a documentation of Makaton and shows what Makaton is. WHich I think is encyclopdic. Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 18:50, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * True regarding the IP's actions, but now I'm discussing the section on its merits. As observed above, the listing doesn't appear to be especially illuminating: a list of nouns itself doesn't tell us much, especially without some notes to clarify their relevance to specific stages of learning. What's occurring to me is that an expansion to justify the vocabulary's inclusion might be in order, whereby each stage is preceded by a sourced explanation regarding the choice and usage of the words, particular to that stage. A lot of work, but it would lend real meaning to the words and their value. 76.248.147.199 (talk) 18:59, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I believe that Ramaksoud2000 is only supporting the original content so that he can continue to be in the right. It has no encyclopedic value. I think that when the article is unprotected, the vandals work should be left untouched. To show what Makaton is does not entail listing the name of every lesson, Ramaksoud2000. That is akin to saying it is imperative to include every mutation string of a flu when creating the page on an influenza. It doesn't make sense. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.227.97.58 (talk) 23:10, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Do not reference the user as "the vandal" because you are that person. I'm not stupid thank you very much. Please do not create more sockpuppet accounts. Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 23:42, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
 * When it becomes unprotected, I will leave it as it is and not put the section back based on the comments of the 76.248 ip. I removed it before because of the distrust I had of the user removing it as they didn't explain why and attacked and harrased me. Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 23:44, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Please file a case at Sockpuppet investigations with all the usernames and IPs that you susect to be sockpuppets. Thanks! --Guy Macon (talk) 00:04, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * By the way, I don't think including the list is a cardinal sin, either, Ramaksoud2000, and I might have reacted the same way if I came upon a section being reverted without explanation--the attacks that followed just undercut serious discussion about the best use of article space. If anyone has access to the literature that elaborates on the rationale for the words used at each stage, it could make for a very interesting piece of scholarship. 76.248.147.199 (talk) 00:54, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Just to clarify the above request, I have no opinion as to whether anyone is or is not sockpuppeting. If they are, filing a case at Sockpuppet investigations will result in all of the socks being dealt with at once. If they aren't, filing a case at Sockpuppet investigations will result in a determination that there is no sockpuppetry and that no more accusations should be made. --Guy Macon (talk) 03:21, 4 January 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't need SPI because I already have a range block for the user's 85. ips but the user appears to be out of town because this ip vandalized my sandbo an removed my entry at the welcoming committee members and reverted many other edits by me proving tht this user is the same one that got rangeblocked for harrassment. I already have the 142. ip blocked for 31hr. However tht is not the discussion here. Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 04:39, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

So just to clarify, the section is to be left out until that literature comes to light? Ramaksoud2000 (talk) 04:49, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

External links modified (February 2018)
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150313124026/http://www.bbc.co.uk/cbeebies/shows/something-special to http://www.bbc.co.uk/cbeebies/shows/something-special

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Name derivation
What's the origin of the name? Interested to know but it's not mentioned.Gymnophoria (talk) 13:32, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I wondered that too! It’s from Margaret, Katherine, and Tony; more details in the second paragraph of the article. —82.40.14.9 (talk) 00:06, 4 August 2022 (UTC)

Something Special?
Just wondering if there's a reason why Something Special (a show specifically designed around Makaton usage, and which ran for over a decade on CBeebies) isn't even mentioned in the main article and is only listed as an external link? Considering that the host received an MBE in large part because of his work with Makaton on that show, it seems strange that it doesn't merit a mention where Rob Delany's later bedtime story does. 82.27.48.105 (talk) 07:10, 11 February 2020 (UTC)

Article reads weird?
It feels like an ad. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KylieMBrooks (talk • contribs) 18:57, 30 January 2021 (UTC)