Talk:Navadurga

Dhyana mantra
Durga Puja is the time when Devi is worshipped in nine holy aspects in nine days. These nine aspects have individual dhyana mantra, mantra for meditation. a free version is added with a little copy edit and modified formatting. VMO 14:55, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Murti Images
Is there some reason why only eight images are showing, and what is (in my opinion) the most important one: Brahmacharini, is missing? It would be fantastic to have the complete set for this article. AaronCarson (talk) 02:34, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I asked the uploader of the 8 images the same question. He said that the Durga Puja pandal did not have the Brahmacharini image in it. I will crop Brahmacharini from File:Silver door in Amber Fort, Rajasthan.jpg and upload. -- Redtigerxyz Talk 05:08, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Upsetting news. I guess it's better than nothing, although it will look glaringly out of place with the others. AaronCarson (talk) 18:40, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

Article not written properly
This article is entirely written on basis of Shaivism, claiming that the goddess is Parvati. But the truth is that these all 9 devis are the forms of Mahadevi Parashakti Durga. Durga is the most supreme form as clearly mentioned in the holy texts named Bhagwat Gita, Shiv Mahapuran, Devi Bhagwat, etc.

This article must be re-written. All devis including paravti, lakshmi, saraswati, etc are the forms of Durga as clearly stipulated in all holy texts. Also Durga is the creator of Tridev/Trimurti - Brahma, Vishnu, Mahesh. Keshavv1234 (talk) 01:39, 27 April 2022 (UTC)


 * Source? Firestar464 (talk) 02:27, 27 April 2022 (UTC)

Parvati is only worshipped as Shailputri which is the first of the nine forms of Durga. However the supreme goddess here is Durga. Parvati is a form of Durga only. Moreover, Durga has created Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesh and this is mentioned in almost all major holy texts of hinduism. Durga or Mahadevi Shakti is the principal form of creation and is the creator of Tridev. Durga is also connected to Sada Shiva energy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Keshavv1234 (talk • contribs) 06:38, 27 April 2022 (UTC)


 * Quora is not reliable; see WP:SPS. As for the TOI, I'm not sure. I'll wait for the opinion of other editors. Firestar464 (talk) 09:36, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
 * According to Puranas, Paravti is Durga but because Tridevi is considered as single entity thats why Laxmi is termed as Durga in her Sahasranamam and Parvati is often termed as Narayani. AarushSinha10 (talk) 13:13, 3 October 2023 (UTC)

Laxmi Durga
Parvati as Durga in Bramha Vaivarta Puran Brahmavaivarta Purana, Prakriti Khanda-

गणेशजननी दुर्गा राधा लक्ष्मीः सरस्वती । सावित्री वै सृष्टिविधौ प्रकृतिः पञ्चधा स्मृता ।।

Comments- The above Shloka lists the 5 forms of Mulaprakriti- Durga, Radha, Lakshmi, Saraswati and Savitri. While describing Devi Durga, the Shloka calls Her "Ganeshajanani" or mother of Ganesha. Now we know who's son Lord Ganesha is.

गणेशमाता दुर्गा या शिवरूपा शिवप्रिया । नारायणी विष्णुमाया पूर्णब्रह्मस्वरूपिणी ।। ब्रह्मादिदेवैर्मुनिभिर्मनुभिः पूजिता सदा । सर्वाधिष्ठातृदेवी सा ब्रह्मरूपा सनातनी ।।

Comments- The above Shloka once again describes Devi Durga to be mother of Ganesha, and then further proceeds to call Her "Shivaroopa" (as She occupies left half of Lord Shiva's body and is thus indistinct from Him) and "Shivapriya" (as She is beloved consort of Lord Shiva). Further Her association with Lord Vishnu is described by the names "Narayani" (as Her abode Manidweep is in the middle of Sudha Samudra, and She also is sister of Lord Vishnu), and "Vishnumaya" (as She in Vaishnava theology is personification of Lord Vishnu's Leelavidhayini Shakti). AarushSinha10 (talk) 13:58, 3 October 2023 (UTC)


 * What are these and how does it explain your content removal? If you feel the existing referenced content is misleading, then please link to the sources here that backs up your content removal. Also, I suggest you to not use the edit summary to discuss the dispute every time someone reverts you. Jeraxmoira (talk) 19:41, 3 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Tacking on to the above comment, articles use secondary sources primarily and primary sources secondarily. The use of primary sources is restricted, as one of the many things editors run afoul of when using them is the "no original research" policy. — Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 20:08, 3 October 2023 (UTC)
 * This is holy hindu text AarushSinha10 (talk) 20:08, 3 October 2023 (UTC)
 * To parrot a common refrain here on Wikipedia, citation needed. — Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 22:38, 3 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Is Facebook posts reliable? AarushSinha10 (talk) 02:33, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * https://www.internationaljournalcorner.com/index.php/theijhss/article/view/140787 AarushSinha10 (talk) 02:50, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Reliable Source:- https://iskconeducationalservices.org/HoH/further-information-and-teaching-resources-secondary/photocard-texts/shakti/￼
 * https://www.drikpanchang.com/hindu-goddesses/parvati/durga/navdurga.html
 * https://www.iskcondelhi.com/maa-durga-puja/
 * AarushSinha10 (talk) 02:37, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * https://www.wisdomlib.org/hinduism/book/the-skanda-purana/d/doc423810.html
 * Source from Skand Puran which clearly mentiona Parvati is Durga and proves that mention of Laxmi as Durga in the article which references Skand Puran is incorrect. He is mistaken Mahalakshmi as Durga. AarushSinha10 (talk) 02:46, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The references given by the editor doesn't mention her navadurga form. AarushSinha10 (talk) 12:55, 4 October 2023 (UTC)

The topic of Laxmi Durga
I have seen certain people have added Durga as form of Laxmi but that is not according to scriptures of Hinduism. Although some scriptures mention the name Durga in her Sahasranamam (1000 names) but that is because they want to show the oneness of supreme female Trinity in Hinduism.

I have seen certain people have added Durga as form of Laxmi but that is not according to scriptures of Hinduism. Although some scriptures mention the name Durga in her Sahasranamam (1000 names) but that is because they want to show the oneness of supreme female Trinity in Hinduism.

Here are some sources that mention goddess Durga is form or aspect of Goddess Parvati who is the mother of Ganesha, Kartikeya and consort of Lord Shiva.

1.https://www.internationaljournalcorner.com/index.php/theijhss/article/view/140787

2.https://iskconeducationalservices.org/HoH/further-information-and-teaching-resources-secondary/photocard-texts/shakti/%EF%BF%BC

3.https://www.drikpanchang.com/hindu-goddesses/parvati/durga/navdurga.html 4.https://www.iskcondelhi.com/maa-durga-puja/ 5.https://www.wisdomlib.org/hinduism/book/the-skanda-purana/d/doc423810.html AarushSinha10 (talk) 14:43, 4 October 2023 (UTC)


 * Your first argument is flawed in itself. and . You said it yourself that Durga as a form of Laxmi exists.
 * The references you have cited have no relevance to the content that you removed.
 * Per Lakshmi : There are 11 sources backing the content you removed. Durga as a form of Laxmi exists.
 * The Facebook post and the PDF by a self-published blog has been removed with the content related to it as well.
 * Also, I am not a subject expert in this, but I feel that just like Shaktism and Shaivism, Vaishnavism should also exist in this article for the readers.
 * And finally, please do not rush other editors to respond to your arguments. Thanks! Jeraxmoira (talk) 18:49, 4 October 2023 (UTC)
 * My argument is that Laxmi Durga is added on a wrong place. It is on the ARTICLE OF GODDESS DURGA. Navadurga itself is a Shaivism and Shaktism concept. It's not related to Lakshmi. Lakshmi has a Astha Laxmi form (Eight forms of Laxmi) and Parvati has Navadurga form. When that Facebook related material was removed the entire subtopic became irrelevant. Hope you understand. AarushSinha10 (talk) 03:32, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * If Laxmi has a Durga form then her mention is already in the page of Wikipedia of "Durga".


 * Vaishnavism doesn't have concept of Navadurga - The Nine forms of Durga and the article is on the nine forms not on goddess durga. Let the readers stick to the topic. More Sources 6.https://books.google.co.in/books?id=wK-fAAAAMAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=durga 7.https://books.google.co.in/books?redir_esc=y&id=3nX1XntOtDwC&q=Durga+#v=snippet&q=Durga&f=false, as per this source given by the editor, in Page 36 it's clearly written Durga's consort Lord Of Tamas (Shiva). AarushSinha10 (talk) 03:17, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I am not sure why you are repeatedly sharing sources to prove what's already in the article with relevant citations. W.r.t Lakshmi as Durga being irrelevant - On the lead, It says that
 * Similarly, in the Lakshmi as Durga section -
 * From above, I see that both are celebrated during Navaratri by different set of people. If you feel it is less important w.r.t to this article then I would suggest you to move it to the bottom of the page, before the see also section, and rename it accordingly. Jeraxmoira (talk) 19:50, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
 * But they are not Navadurga and Mahakali, Bhadrakali, Chandi and Maheshwari too are forms of Parvati Go and read in Wikipedia Pages of them. If you don't know about Hinduism then how can you judge. The "relevant citation" themselves say that Durga is form of Parvati. Vaishnavism consider Laxmi as Supreme Goddess thatswhy they call her like that and they also consider all humans as her form especially females. Thatswhy she is termed as Durga. Not because Durga is her form. AarushSinha10 (talk) 03:43, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The the various forms of Laxmi you mentioned are just 8 not 9
 * Navadurga means Nine Durgas not Eight Durgas. AarushSinha10 (talk) 03:45, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I suspect that Lakshmi counts as one of them. — Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 04:01, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes.. According to Kanaka Durga Temple Laxmi as Mahalaxmi is one of the nine forms of Durga but not viceversa￼ AarushSinha10 (talk) 06:42, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * But in scriptural version there is no Lakshmi. SHAILAPUTRI, BRAHMACHARINI, CHANDRAGHANTA, KUSHMANDA, KATYAYANI, KALRATRI, MAHAGAURI AND SIDDHIDATRI are all the only Navadurgas in the scriptures. Even in the references given in Laxmi Durga are stating Durga as form of Parvati or wife of Shiva which is Parvati indirectly. AarushSinha10 (talk) 06:48, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * It's already there at the bottom in Kanaka Durga part. See mate, understanding that is not easy. This line is from Skand Puran
 * "Vishnu is no one but Shiva and Shiva is but identical to Vishnu" in such cases Hindu Gods are named after names of Each other. Goddess Parvati and Laxmi along with Goddess Saraswati are part of Supreme Female Trinity and are known by each others name and achivements. That's why referred with each other names. Parvati is called Mahalaxmi and Laxmi is called Durga for that reason. It doesn't mean they have those forms. In Vaishnavism everything came out of Laxmi and Vishnu so everything is there forms whether it is any God, DemiGod, Humans or even Animals. But that is something very deep and irrelevant to Wikipedia articles. "Navadurga" in every scripture starts from Shailputri and ends with Siddhidatri. There are more sources I have should I share it? There is no source denying because nobody ever thought that Durga is Laxmi's form. It was there that Laxmi came out of Durga BUT NOT VICEVERSA. There is a deep story to it related to this incident which proves it even stronger that Parvati is Durga.
 * One More- The references of Skand Puran, Markandeya Puran and Devi Bhagwat Puran are wrong because they're the Puranas which say that Parvati is complete manifestation of Durga and Laxmi, Saraswati are Partial manifestations. AarushSinha10 (talk) 04:02, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Correct me if I am wrong here.
 * In Hinduism, both Lakshmi and Parvati have Durga forms.
 * During Navaratri, Shaktas and Shaivas worship Parvati's Durga form
 * And Vaishnavas worship Lakshmi's Durga form
 * Both are worshipped during Navaratri and Durga Puja.
 * If all the above are true, then I think it is justified to have Vaishnavism and Lakshmi as Durga section in this article. As suggested above, if it is less important, move it to the bottom and have Shaktism and Shaivism at the top under the Hinduism heading. Jeraxmoira (talk) 16:49, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

Now to references given in Laxmi Durga part of the article The references given doesn't mention about nine forms of Goddess Durga in her Laxmi form. So references to Goddess Lakshmi in this article is irrelevant. Such things can be added in the article of Goddess Durga. So that the readers may have some clarity and they stick to the topic.

Navadurga means Nine forms of Goddess Durga. So her nine forms are mentioned in Shaiva Shakt traditions so only they should be mentioned here. Lakshmi is mentioned as Mahalaxmi with her eight forms which are called Astha Lakshmi. (unsigned)


 * None of the references in the "Vaishnavism" section speak of the "Navadurga". Whoever is adding the section is requesting to provide quotes from the references, where Lakshmi is explicitly linked to Navadurga in particular, not Durga in general. Removing the section as WP:UNDUE in this article. Redtigerxyz  Talk 17:39, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

The Kanaka Durga forms
According to the citation given in the Kanaka Durga forms. She doesn't have 9 but 10 forms. So that makes her Dasadurga not Navadurga. Either add the 10th form or takes necessary action. AarushSinha10 (talk) 11:06, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The reference does not say that the forms are the Navadurga exiplicitly. WP:OR and WP:SYNTH - removing the section. -- Redtigerxyz Talk 18:34, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 October 2023
X: In Hinduism, both Lakshmi and Parvati have Durga forms. During Navaratri, Shaktas and Shaivas worship mainly Parvati's Durga forms as per Shaiva-Shakta Tantra granthas and consider Shiva as her consort, while Vaishnavas worship Lakshmi's Durga forms as per Tantric Vaishnava Pancharatra Agamas and consider her as consort of Vishnu.[4][5][6]

Y: I request to Remove that because according to citation 4 given, Durga is described as wife of Shiva also spelled Siva and not Vishnu in page no 25 and other two citation doesn't say anything about her consort. AarushSinha10 (talk) 14:35, 8 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Pictogram voting wait.svg Already done . Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 13:20, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 October 2023 (2)
X: Vaishnavism Lakshmi as Durga The mention of Durga as one of forms of Lakshmi can be found in Vishnu Purana, Garuda Purana, Devi Mahatmyam of Markandeya Purana, Devi Bhagavata Purana and various Pancharatra agamas such as Lakshmi Tantra, Prakasa Samhita, Narada Pancharatra etc.,. According to Garuda Purana, Lakshmi is considered as Prakriti (Mahalakshmi) and is identified with three forms — Sri, Bhu and Durga. The three forms consists of Satva ('goodness'),[10] rajas, and tamas ('darkness') gunas,[11] and assists Vishnu (Purusha) in creation, preservation and destruction of the entire universe. Durga form represents the power to fight, conquer and punish the demons and anti-gods. In the Lakshmi Tantra and Lakshmi Sahasranama of Skanda Purana, Lakshmi is given the status of the primordial goddess. According to these texts, Durga and the forms such Mahalakshmi, Mahakali and Mahasaraswati and all the Shaktis that came out of all gods such as Matrikas and Mahavidya[12] are all various forms of Goddess Lakshmi.[13] In Lakshmi Tantra, Lakshmi says to Indra that she got the name Durga after killing an asura named Durgama.[13] Indologists and authors Chitralekha Singh and Prem Nath says, "Narada Purana describes the powerful forms of Lakshmi as Durga, Mahakali, Bhadrakali, Chandi, Maheshwari, Mahalakshmi, Vaishnavi and Andreye".[14] Among various Vaishnavism traditions, the worship of Durga is very important among the followers of Madhvacharya. They celebrate Durga Puja pompously. Madhvacharya listed out procedures on how to worship Durga in work "Tantra Sara Sangraha" and many of his granthas. As per Madhvacharya, in her Durga form Lakshmi frees us from Ajnana, Avidya, Bondage, Eliminates the obstacles in our path and Resolves problems in life. Jagannatha Dasa in his Harikathamruthasara also tells about this elaboratively.[15]

Iconography

Lakshmi Sahasranama of Skanda Purana, Lakshmi Tantra, Markandeya Purana, Devi Mahatmya and Vedic scriptures describe Lakshmi's Durga form as having eighteen hands and is described as holding a rosary, axe, mace, arrow, thunderbolt, lotus, pitcher, rod, sakti, sword, shield, conch, bell, wine-cup, trident, noose and the discus in her eighteen hands.[16][17][18]

Y: I request remove this entire part and the sources are given as citations in the part itself

Citation 10 – Doesn’t Open

Citation 11 – Seeking Mahadevi, Page 84 describes that Siva weds Durga, which means Durga is not Laxmi because she wed Vishnu.

Citation 14 - Lakshmi, Page 43 describes Kali or Durga as left side of Shiva and Radha (incarnation of Laxmi) as left of Vishnu. So she is not Laxmi Citation 15 – Harikathamrutasara, Page 36 describes Durga as consort of Lord of Tamas which is Shiva in Vaishnavism.

Citation 16 – Sakti Iconography, Page 06 describes her as consort of Rudra (another name of Shiva) and Page 106 describes her as energy of Shiva which is always a female consort.

Citation 17 – Pratima Kosha, describes that Durga is accompanied by Laxmi and Saraswati

Citation 18 – Cultural Development in Orrisa, Page 213 says “In later works mountain goddess has been identified as Durga or Parvati.” Page 218 says Sakti is worshipped in forms of Mahishasuramardini, Durga, Parvati and so on but not laxmi.

The citations given were wrong. Please correct it. AarushSinha10 (talk) 15:12, 8 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Pictogram voting wait.svg Already done Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 13:22, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 October 2023
X: == The nice forms== Y: == The Nine forms == AarushSinha10 (talk) 07:32, 9 October 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅. Thanks. Rasnaboy (talk) 09:11, 9 October 2023 (UTC)