Talk:Northern Wei

the map is not correct
Northern Wei territory is much much larger, more go into the interior of Mongolia and included Korea, the Northern Wei's Great wall can still be seen. please see Great Wall of China in Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.60.187.20 (talk • contribs)
 * What is clear is that Northern Wei's territory never extended into Korea or Mongolia. Korea (and Liaoning Peninsula) were then ruled by Goguyreo, and Inner/Outer Mongolia was then ruled by Rouran.  --Nlu (talk) 17:35, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Names
In the Chinese Wikipedia, Xianbei name was used until Emperor Xiaowen. Perhaps the same format could be used. Olorin28 04:43, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
 * That's what I'm planning on doing. The only reason why I was hesitating is because, in all traditional Chinese historical works, you're going to find, again, Zhangsun instead of Baba, Mu instead of Qiumuling, &c.  The Tuoba/Yuan distinction is easy; it's figuring out all of the equivalencies that's tricky for the reader.  --Nlu (talk) 05:48, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Cleanup & More info
I'm going to add more info to this page =) - Zhang Guo Lao 19:43, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Northern Wei's identification with China (Zhongguo and Huaren)
The Xianbei Northern Wei called their own state as "China" (Zhongguo) and sought to portray themselves as Hua ren or Zhongguoren, and started calling the original inhabitants of China by the name "Han ren" so they could be lay claim to the identity of "Hua ren" so "Hua" would not be a monopoly of the Han people.

http://scholar.harvard.edu/files/elliott/files/critical_han_studies_ch8_elliott.pdf

Because the Xianbei could not claimed to be Han and could not make up a fictional genealogy tracing themselves to Han dynasty people, they went further back in Chinese history claimed themselves to be descendants of the Yellow Emperor.

The Xianbei claimed to be related to the Chinese through descent by the Yellow Emperor

http://books.google.com/books?id=rHeb7wQu0xIC&pg=PA68&dq=xianbei+yellow+emperor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kjwQUrOJKsqQyAHVsIEw&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=xianbei%20yellow%20emperor&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=XT5pvPZ4vroC&pg=PA55&dq=xianbei+yellow+emperor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kjwQUrOJKsqQyAHVsIEw&ved=0CDUQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=xianbei%20yellow%20emperor&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=PASE4LVLzQ0C&pg=PA17&dq=Tabgatch+claimed+descent+from+the+Yellow+Emperor+the+Yuwen+created+for+themselves+a+genealogy+stretching+back+to+the+Divine+Husbandman&hl=en&sa=X&ei=w2ZEU5juCs3YyAGr14GICg&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Tabgatch%20claimed%20descent%20from%20the%20Yellow%20Emperor%20the%20Yuwen%20created%20for%20themselves%20a%20genealogy%20stretching%20back%20to%20the%20Divine%20Husbandman&f=false

page 75

"Because his forces were victorious in this battle, the Yellow Emperor's clan came to be known by the surname of "Bear" (Youxiongshi). The Weishu also states that the Xianbei were descended from one of the sons of the Yellow Emperor, ..."

http://books.google.com/books?id=-_HpAAAAMAAJ&q=xianbei+yellow+emperor&dq=xianbei+yellow+emperor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kjwQUrOJKsqQyAHVsIEw&ved=0CDsQ6AEwAg

http://books.google.com/books?id=-_HpAAAAMAAJ&q=Because+his+forces+were+victorious+in+this+battle,+the+Yellow+Emperor's+clan+came+to+be+known+by+the+surname+of+%22Bear%22+(Youxiongshi).+The+Weishu+also+states+that+the+Xianbei+were+descended+from+one+of+the+sons+of+the+Yellow+Emperor,&dq=Because+his+forces+were+victorious+in+this+battle,+the+Yellow+Emperor's+clan+came+to+be+known+by+the+surname+of+%22Bear%22+(Youxiongshi).+The+Weishu+also+states+that+the+Xianbei+were+descended+from+one+of+the+sons+of+the+Yellow+Emperor,&hl=en&sa=X&ei=vj8QUoW1LKeiyAGehYBY&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA

page 279

"They have a fanciful history complete with legends claiming the Yellow Emperor as one of their ancestors.2 Although much of Xianbei culture is similar to that of the Xiongnu, there are distinct differences.' Xianbei burials commonly contain a ..."

http://books.google.com/books?id=ZDXrAAAAMAAJ&q=xianbei+yellow+emperor&dq=xianbei+yellow+emperor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kjwQUrOJKsqQyAHVsIEw&ved=0CEcQ6AEwBA

http://books.google.com/books?id=ZDXrAAAAMAAJ&q=They+have+a+fanciful+history+complete+with+legends+claiming+the+Yellow+Emperor+as+one+of+their+ancestors.2+Although+much+of+Xianbei+culture+is+similar+to+that+of+the+Xiongnu,+there+are+distinct+differences.'+Xianbei+burials+commonly+contain+a&dq=They+have+a+fanciful+history+complete+with+legends+claiming+the+Yellow+Emperor+as+one+of+their+ancestors.2+Although+much+of+Xianbei+culture+is+similar+to+that+of+the+Xiongnu,+there+are+distinct+differences.'+Xianbei+burials+commonly+contain+a&hl=en&sa=X&ei=2D8QUpGGH4iTyQGOn4GgBg&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA

page 4

"The Taba Xianbei, however, disliked the idea that they were mixed blood of the Han and Xiongnu. Instead, they traced their ancestry to the Chinese legendary Yellow Emperor (Huangdi H^?, the symbol of "earth" of the Five Elements) in order ..."

http://books.google.com/books?id=FmBmAAAAMAAJ&q=xianbei+yellow+emperor&dq=xianbei+yellow+emperor&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kjwQUrOJKsqQyAHVsIEw&ved=0CEwQ6AEwBQ

http://books.google.com/books?id=FmBmAAAAMAAJ&q=The+Taba+Xianbei,+however,+disliked+the+idea+that+they+were+mixed+blood+of+the+Han+and+Xiongnu.+Instead,+they+traced+their+ancestry+to+the+Chinese+legendary+Yellow+Emperor+(Huangdi+H%5E?,+the+symbol+of+%22earth%22+of+the+Five+Elements)+in+order&dq=The+Taba+Xianbei,+however,+disliked+the+idea+that+they+were+mixed+blood+of+the+Han+and+Xiongnu.+Instead,+they+traced+their+ancestry+to+the+Chinese+legendary+Yellow+Emperor+(Huangdi+H%5E?,+the+symbol+of+%22earth%22+of+the+Five+Elements)+in+order&hl=en&sa=X&ei=6j8QUt3mIaWbygGL6oCwAg&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA

The Non-Han Emperors equated their state with the concept of China(中國). Non-Han rulers expanded the definition of "China" to include non-Han peoples in addition to Han people, whenever they ruled China. Yuan, Jin, and Northern Wei documents indicate the usage of "China" by dynasties to refer to themselves began earlier than previously thought.



The Xianbei called yogurt (their own ethnic food) as a food of Zhongguo.

Zhongguo

http://books.google.com/books?id=PASE4LVLzQ0C&pg=PA22&dq=yogurt+fish+wei&hl=en&sa=X&ei=klUrVN3dB5CwyASRqoGYBA&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=yogurt%20fish%20wei&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=Ch04UBWfplQC&pg=PA126&dq=wang+su+yoghurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=pFcrVMboF-L-sATUkoGABw&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yoghurt&f=false

Food

http://books.google.com/books?id=QfkWAAAAQBAJ&pg=PA66&dq=wang+su+yogurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=HlYrVMu0N8HGsQS2_oD4CA&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAzgU#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yogurt&f=false http://books.google.com/books?id=6F2XLmIVAaYC&pg=PA66&dq=wang+su+yogurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=_lUrVKK5F4OpyQS5joKwDg&ved=0CEkQ6AEwBzgK#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yogurt&f=false http://books.google.com/books?id=CWE8AAAAQBAJ&pg=PA66&dq=yogurt+fish+wei&hl=en&sa=X&ei=qFUrVO7mF5KsyATxj4CQCw&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBDgK#v=onepage&q=yogurt%20fish%20wei&f=false http://books.google.com/books?id=sV48AAAAQBAJ&pg=PA66&dq=yogurt+fish+wei&hl=en&sa=X&ei=qFUrVO7mF5KsyATxj4CQCw&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAjgK#v=onepage&q=yogurt%20fish%20wei&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=FgtFxedkgbcC&pg=PA511&dq=wang+su+yogurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=41UrVMP8IYOTyQTbxIIo&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yogurt&f=false http://books.google.com/books?id=FgtFxedkgbcC&pg=PA511&dq=wang+su+yoghurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=pFcrVMboF-L-sATUkoGABw&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yoghurt&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=AeiIl2y6vJQC&pg=PT638&dq=wang+su+yogurt&hl=en&sa=X&ei=41UrVMP8IYOTyQTbxIIo&ved=0CDcQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=wang%20su%20yogurt&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=BAcknxN_S8QC&pg=PA80&dq=yogurt+fish+wei&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ylUrVMKRBMSnyATJjIHQBQ&ved=0CCsQ6wEwATgU#v=onepage&q=yogurt%20fish%20wei&f=false

Rajmaan (talk) 01:23, 1 October 2014 (UTC)