Talk:Order of the Southern Cross

Splitting
I suggest to split the article between National Order of the Southern Cross and Imperial Order of Southern Cross. There is two articles in portuguese, Ordem Nacional do Cruzeiro do Sul e Ordem Imperial do Cruzeiro do Sul, respectively. The history parte of the National order would be carried to the Imperial, and resumed on the National article. I can do it, just checking if someone has any issue with this. ZackTheJack (talk) 15:36, 28 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Disagree. When the National Order of the Southern Cross was founded, it was intended as a successor, almost as a rebirth, of the preceeding Imperial Order founded on 1 December 1822. The insignia of the new Order even contains identical elements present in the old Imperial version, and the motto Benemeritum praemium was also retained. Even in law both versions of the Order are one and the same Order and not two different Orders: the 1932 Decree that created the republican version is titled Decree no. 22.165, of 5 December 1932 - reestablishes the National Order of the Southern Cross. The preamble of the decree mentions the convenience of reestablishing the old Order that had been created upon the country's independence; and article 1 speaks of reestablishment of the Order, under the new name National Order of the Southern Cross. So, it makes sense to treat the two versions of the Order in the same article. --189.122.100.112 (talk) 17:58, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

I think that the idea of splitting the article has been abandoned (and rightly so, if I may add), so I will remove the banner that calls for a discussion on splitting the article.--189.122.100.112 (talk) 03:26, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Class assessment
I believe the article meets the criteria for a B-class quality article, but as I'm not an native english speaker, I will not assess the "Gramar and style" as ok, so is at least C-class. ZackTheJack (talk) 15:36, 28 December 2011 (UTC)

Doubts about awarding Yuri Gagarin
The source of information is an issue 124 of Almanaque Brasil de Cultura Popular from 2009, page 9. It states, that on 3rd of August 1961 presidente Jânio Quadros "condecorou com a Ordem do Cruzeiro do Sul" and it has a photo. A searching in Google for names Jânio Quadros Gagarin brings back a page with 2 other photos, featuring presidente Jânio Quadros, Gagarin and translator Brigadier Grum Moss (in the same outfits). On the second photo the is a capture (seems like an image from some paper or magazin) which states, that Jânio Quadrosand Grum Moss awarded to Gagarin an Order of Aeronautical Merit. It is also obvious from the photo, that the award has 4 arms, as on Order of Aeronautical Merit and not 5, as on Order of the Southern Cross.

Besides, there is no mentioning of Order of the Southern Cross in memoirs of Russian cosmonauts/military/politicians, but there are references about the awarding of Order of Aeronautical Merit. Also, an official magazine "Public Administration" (published by "Russian Presidential Academy of Public Administration", which was lately included inside "Russian Presidential Academy of National Economy and Public Administration") states, that on the 2nd of August 1961 Yuri Gagarin received a Order of Aeronautical Merit (here is a snippet from that magazine, stored by Google). --Alogrin (talk) 23:44, 3 December 2015 (UTC)
 * I was just reading through the Russian Gagarin page and came across this. I agree, I independently found the same information that you did. I have removed it from this page and will remove it from the English version of Gagarin's page as well.  Kees08  (Talk)   21:15, 2 April 2019 (UTC)

Name of imperial order
Name of imperial order in article is wrong. Original order was established as Ordem Imperial do Cruzeiro, Imperial Order of the Cross in English. There is no Southern in name. In all sources citied in article is such name. Main source should be Brazilian government page citied below, on which you can read: "A Ordem Nacional do Cruzeiro do Sul originou-se da extinta Ordem Imperial do Cruzeiro, instituída por Decreto de 1º de dezembro de 1822 de D. Pedro I..." (in Portuguese), or in English version: "The National Order of the Southern Cross originated from the extinct Imperial Order of the Cross, established by Decree of December 1st, 1822, of Emperor Pedro I...". Sometimes word Southern is added erroneously to name of this order due to name of new order. Source:
 * KarlHeintz (talk) 14:33, 14 February 2019 (UTC)