Talk:Philip Morris International/Archives/2019

Edit Request
Hello, I am requesting two corrections to the text of this article with which I have a COI. I do not expect these changes to be controversial. The first carries over from my previous edit request, a portion of the request that was not implemented because the reviewer asked for clarification. This change is requested because the link referencing "Our charitable giving program" yields 404 error. I propose the following text and reference change to correct the deadlink issue:

Current text: The company says that it gives $25 million per year to charitable causes including domestic violence, emergency housing, education, combating poverty, and teaching sustainable agriculture techniques in Africa. Proposed text: The company says it contributed nearly USD 30 million in 2017 to causes and programs including education for the underprivelaged, empowering women, and disaster preparedness and relief efforts.

My second proposed change is in the "Later development" section, last sentence. The sentence indicates that Philip Morris (the company) ranks 17th among tobacco brands. The editor who first added this content seems to have confused Philip Morris International (ie the company PMI) with Philip Morris (ie the cigarette brand owned by PMI). It is inaccurate to say that the company Philip Morris is the 17th most valuable brand, because a company is not the same thing as a cigarette brand. My proposal is to make the smallest amount of text change to make the statement agree with what the source table shows:

Current text: ... and it ranks 17th among the most valuable tobacco brands of 2017 on BrandFinance website. Proposed text: ... and its top brand, Marlboro, ranks 1st among the most valuable tobacco brand of 2017 on BrandFinance website.

Note, I've also edited the reference citation, as Include digital appears to be the company that designed/created the website, but the website is copyrighted to Brandirectory. So I have removed the Include portion of the reference to aid the reader in navigating to the correct page of the reference. I also updated the reference's access date to match format of the majority of the other references. Cheers, Sarah at PMI (talk) 14:34, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

Reply 17-JAN-2019
Below you will see where proposals from your request have been quoted with reviewer decisions and feedback inserted underneath, either accepting, declining or otherwise commenting upon your proposal(s). Please read the enclosed notes within the proposal review section below for information on each request.  Spintendo   15:33, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

18-JAN-2019
Thank you for your rapid review. I accept your choice to decline my first proposed edit per WP:NOBLECAUSE. Can you please confirm whether you intend for the deadlink reference | Our Charitable Giving not to be updated, but instead remain as a deadlink?

Regarding the second proposed change marked clarification needed, I make the following updated proposal, which now mentions exactly which methodology is used, as well as the reference provided by Spintendo:
 * Current text: ... and it ranks 17th among the most valuable tobacco brands of 2017 on BrandFinance website.
 * Proposed text: ... and its top brand, Marlboro, ranks 1st among the most valuable tobacco brand of 2017 on BrandFinance website, which uses the royalty relief method of brand valuation.

Thank you very much for your time on this. Cheers, Sarah at PMI (talk) 09:52, 18 January 2019 (UTC)

Reply 29-JAN-2019

 * 1) Describing the claim as originating from Brand Finance's royalty relief methadology makes the claim acceptable for use. I've placed this claim under the Marlboro section of the Brands heading, as it made more sense being placed there than the proposed section.
 * 2) The deadlink and its claim have been omitted.

Regards,  Spintendo   16:48, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
 * 1) The directory of local brands has been omitted, per #7 of WP:NOTDIRECTORY.

Possible POV Fork
See Foundation for a Smoke-Free World. There is a dispute over at Talk:Electric smoking system regarding smoke and now a new page contains disputed content. QuackGuru ( talk ) 16:56, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

False content in lede
In response to burgeoning awareness of the harm to health of cigarettes, PMI has declared on the companies homepage the intention to replace cigarettes with smoke-free products, and to "switch ... adult smokers" to these products as the first phase of a business strategy, as a responsible decision for the benefit of "adult smokers" and the companies share-holders and employees.[6][7][8]

The IQOS produces smoke. That's not a smoke-free product. I expect the editor who restored the content to the lede against consensus to remove it. QuackGuru ( talk ) 19:07, 21 April 2019 (UTC)


 * As worded in the lede (and on the website), the term smoke-free products refers to a category of products, not specifically to IQOS, which should make it ok. Further, the company has published a report of evidence clarifying that | IQOS does not produce smoke.


 * If there is still interest in changing the language, the article might quote PMI about the smoke-free product concept, put quotes around "smoke-free", or could change smoke-free products to something else - perhaps "alternatives to cigarettes" or even just "other products". I do agree that the user's references 7 and 8 news articles mention IQOS, which puts it in that context if you dig a bit. In fact I don't see how those two news articles support the text they're referenced in. Here are a few other references I found that might make more sense to reference regarding the business changes, and if they're referenced correctly, they take the focus off of IQOS:
 * | Philip Morris shifts focus to ‘smoke free’ nicotine products
 * "On Monday, it launched a publicity campaign, “Year of UnSmoke”, to draw attention to its efforts to phase out cigarettes in favour of other products."
 * | Inside :Philip Morris International: On a mission to convince the skeptics
 * "Is this the end of the Marlboro cigarette? Philip Morris International says it will stop selling cigarettes at some point in the future as it shifts to smoke-free alternatives. But, how soon is still unclear."
 * | NEWS‘The media didn’t want our ads’: Philip Morris :comms boss
 * "According to Salzman, 80% of PMI’s revenue still comes from combustible cigarettes, but 80% of its marketing spend is focussed on promoting a “smoke-free future” "
 * Sarah at PMI (talk) 16:12, 24 April 2019 (UTC)