Talk:Rifle

more examples of rifles
reading the page there are not many examples of rifles I was surprised that the Lee Enfield did not feature in the article but the springfield and K98k did the WW1 section is also not very long (Fdsdh1 (talk) 11:53, 4 June 2012 (UTC))

Version
I found this article blank. I have changed it back to the version before. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.44.211.31 (talk) 23:53, 8 July 2005 (UTC)

I've tagged the page with cleanup as there is some repitition and it lacks narrative coherence. Anurag Garg 15:01, 10 November 2005 (UTC)


 * cleaned up by removing the repetition found in the paragraph dealing with history (before the section labeled "history") reading thus - "The origins of rifling are difficult to trace. Archers had long realized that spin produced by the natural curve of feather fletchings gave their arrows greater accuracy. Some of the earliest practical experiments occurred in Europe during the fifteenth century and some early examples used straight grooves.   True rifling dates from the mid-15th century, although the precision required for its effective manufacture kept it out of the hands of infantrymen for another three and a half centuries, when it largely replaced the unrifled musket as the primary infantry weapon." You'll find that an almost identical paragraph is included under "history." 16:33, 28 Nov 2006

The reference to muskets as non-rifled bears examination; recall, the .58 Springfield of the U.S. Civil War was a ' musket... --squadfifteen, 23/11/05

I deleted the "WW1 nightmare" paragraph as too POV and not relevant to rifles. The effect of massed rifles was seen in the US Civil War, besides. I also deleted the reference to 155 howitzers as irrelevant. --\jack off me in the bathroom

Should the XM8 be listed as a type of rifle when it's a model of several different types?It was completely out of place. Joffeloff 13:42, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Made a few minor (anon) edits correcting factual errors. --Daler 01:46, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

As first seen, the opening sentence was incorrect since it limited rifling to long arms. Obviously, handguns have rifling as well, hence the change. I also inserted a parenthetical explanation of the rifled musket.

The paragraph stating that civilian rifle development has stagnated for a century requires attention. Many rifles and other firearms (including the revolver and machine gun) were products of individuals or corporations who developed the technology before selling it to governments. The M16 is a classic example--developed by Armalite's Eugene Stoner rather than the US ordnance establishment. In fact, it is safe to say that most firearms developments have occurred in the private sector, including rifling itself.

Add information on Civilian Rifle Development
This article focuses a bit too intently on the evolution and application of military rifles without carefully considering the civilian aspect. The fact of the matter is that at many points in history civilian rifle development influenced military affairs. For instance, most of the rifles used during the American Revolution were civilian rather than military designs. They generally lacked bayonets. Even as late as Vietnam snipers like Carlos Hatchcock were using civilian sporting rifles to elminate targets at extended range. Naturally, military rifles have had a similar impact on the civilian shooter both in terms of actual surplus weapons and in terms of design influences. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.251.255.16 (talk) 11:15, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

Labelled Diagram of a Rifle
A labeled digaram of a rifle would help the article I found this labelled picture of a field-stripped assault rifle whilst browsing the Intertubes. Is this the type of image that this article needs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by CeeWhy2 (talk • contribs)
 * Yes, but a GFDL alternative. &mdash; RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 12:55, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I wonder if it falls under "fair use"... Probably not. CeeWhy2 09:35, 10 November 2006 (UTC)


 * There are some images suitable for labelling already on Commons:


 * --pfctdayelise (talk) 18:57, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Remarks - June 07
"Furthermore, in many works of science fiction a rifle refers to any weapon that has a stock and is shouldered before firing, even if this weapon is not rifled or doesn't fire solid projectiles." - It's safe to say the same holds true for ordinary fiction stories too. The section about science fiction at the end also seems inappropriate. 89.1.175.107 00:17, 1 June 2007 (UTC)Roy

Fiction
Currently reads:

Furthermore, in many works of fiction a rifle refers to any weapon that has a stock and is shouldered before firing, even if this weapon is not rifled or doesn't fire solid projectiles.

Is that usage really restricted to works of fiction? Can you give some examples? Ordinary Person 04:26, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Short or long?
Currently the article says: "Early military rifles, such as the Baker rifle were shorter than the day's muskets, and usually the weapon of a marksman. Until the early 20th century rifles tended to be very long—an 1890 Martini-Henry was almost 2 m (6 feet) in length with a fixed bayonet. The demand for more compact weapons for cavalrymen led to the carbine, or shortened rifle." I think this means that rifles were initially shorter than muskets, then became longer, which led to the development of the carbine. However someone who knows the subject should make this passage clearer. Lisiate (talk) 07:34, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Picture Suggestion
Instead of comparing the 19th and 20th century rifles to a modern assault rifle, would it be more reasonable to compare the earlier two guns to perhaps a modern bolt-action rifle, or at least a modern semi-automatic weapon? That way, it seems a much more justifiable argument. If people want to see how the rifle has evolved from the slow to fire, single-shot muskets to the modern, automatic weapon, they would read the article, which is the point of the website. Anyway, thought that it would help out. 98.246.86.122 (talk) 00:40, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

stability
"...this spin lends gyroscopic stability to the projectile and prevents tumbling..."

Though this is correct, it's not the whole story. No projectile is perfectly symmetrical around its horizontal axis. This causes differences in the Bernoulli forces acting on the shell, deflecting the shell from a straight path. When the shell is spinning, these varying forces largely average out, and the shell travels a significantly straighter path. WilliamSommerwerck (talk) 14:54, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

The word "Rifle"
The article states: "The word "rifle" originally referred to the grooving, and a rifle was called a "rifled gun.""

What an odd statement. If the word "rifle" no longer refers to the spiral grooving, what then does it refer to nowadays? I had always believed that noun "rifle" is derived from the verb "rifle," and that both are current usages. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.180.68.65 (talk) 00:05, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

Wikipedia Critique: Rifles
This article opens up with a detailed description of what makes a rifle distinct from other versions of previous firearms. As a person who takes an interest in military history I believe that the article does an adequate jon of introducing the weapon and distinguishing its "rifling" technology within the barrel. This distinction is important, because it is one of the primary features of the weapon that makes it stand out as a technological advancement. The article seems to lack a formal entry and is written in more of an educational tone. Rather than introducing the rifle to the reader prior to going into further detail, the article dives right into specifics such as barrel characteristics as well as the ammunition used. The article also clarifies the difference between the terms "gun" and "rifle", stressing the fact that a gun is referred to by military armed forces as being larger pieces of artillery, not small arms such as a rifle.

Following this somewhat ad-hoc introduction the article discusses the historical aspect of rifles, and the technological advancement they have made over time. Dating back to what is believed to be the fifteenth century (when the first rifles are believed to have been introduced in Europe) the article sheds light on how muskets were the immediate predecesor to the rifle, and the technological disadvantages they possessed. Muskets were wildly inaccurate and were time consuming to reload and operate. The article takes the reader step by step through the historical evolution of smooth bore muskets into the rifling technology used in the earliest rifle models.

The author smoothly evolves the step by step process in which this technology developed by highlighting the periodical advancements over time. he article discusses how the slow reloading procedure of the musket was improved by the introduction of "mini balls" in the mid 19th century. During the 1850s and 1860s rifles were generally single shot, breach loading weapons. The author even identifies famous instances of the earliest usage of rifle technology during the Napoleonic Wars of the 19th century. Going further down the timeline the article speaks on behalf of the introduction of cartridges, which allowed the operator of the rifle to carry a larger quantity of ammunition, which reduced the time necessary to reload the weapon. It was at this point in the article that the discussion began to address the modern usage of rifles and the current technology being utilized to maximize the weapons effectiveness.

Throughout this article there are various illustrations and photographs to allow the reader to better comprehend the information being divulged. These pictures were very helpful in visualizing how this piece of weaponry has advanced over the previous centuries. The most explicit example of photographs assisting the reader to understand the information was during the portion of the article that discussed the "rifling' of the barrel to increase the accuracy of the weapon. Without these photographs it may have been somewhat more difficult to grasp the major distinction between a smooth bore musket and the earliest models of rifles.

The content of this article was exceptionally informative and the photographs were very helpful. The sources for this article seem somewhat general yet credible. Two of the references contain information about the proper way to calculate a "twist rate", while another discusses "bullet RPM". Two of the sources were, however, somewhat unrelated to the topic of rifle technology. These two sources discussed the stories of sniper units, and one in particular discussed an elite group of snipers confrontation with Taliban forces. I'm not sure if this was a major aspect of the author's bibliography, but I can see where there could be value in studying how rifle technology was used in actual wartime scenarios. — Preceding unsigned comment added by HIST406-13acirone (talk • contribs) 01:25, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * This article is still a mess, the lead is far too long and it appears that it would benefit from a "Terminology and definitions" section. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 18:56, 10 April 2013 (UTC)
 * The critique assumes (without any justification) that the article was written by a single editor all at once. This is a fundamental error, completely misunderstanding the basics concepts of wiki-writing. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 21:51, 10 April 2013 (UTC)
 * All too true Roger, care to join in in the clean up efforts? We need to start a list on the Project page. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 19:29, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Naming the parts of the Rifle
How about a diagram naming the parts of the rifle?

Not all non english native / mother tounge know them. One reason why we visit the english page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.15.66.225 (talk) 06:57, 19 July 2014 (UTC)


 * This is a good idea, know of any free-use sources for a diagram? --Scale Hotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (Talk) 15:56, 19 July 2014 (UTC)


 * After only a few of years' looking, I found one; added it to #Terminology section. Will that do?  --A&#8239;D&#8239;Monroe&#8239;III(talk)  03:06, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

Air rifle
I've seen that someone added content about air rifles again and that it was removed (again). Is it worth a small, simple acknowledgement with a Main link so that we don't have to keep repeating this cycle? --Scalhotrod (Talk) ☮ღ☺ 20:36, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2387624/Gun-advocates-expect-flood-3D-printed-guns-result-U-S-law-changes--Canadian-designed-plastic-rifle-successfully-fires-14-rounds.html
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/innovation/first-3-d-printed-rifle-fires-bullet-then-breaks-f8C10752930
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/4/4588162/worlds-first-3d-printed-rifle-the-grizzly-updated
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130512015023/http://www.loadammo.com/Topics/July01.htm to http://www.loadammo.com/Topics/July01.htm
 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20100713065737/http://www.ringmar.net/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=814:engels-qof-rifled-cannonq-1860&catid=98:wonders-of-technology&Itemid=142 to http://www.ringmar.net/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=814:engels-qof-rifled-cannonq-1860&catid=98:wonders-of-technology&Itemid=142

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The word "Assault"
I wanted to bring to the table a request to remove the term "Assault Rifle" from the pages that have it. This term means nothing it is a media buzzword and doesn't belong in the articles IMHO. In the cases I refer to are semi, burst and auto fire rifles. Also I have fixed a few references to "Clips" when the contributor meant "Magazines". But I have in the past replaced "Assault" with "semi, burst, or auto fire" and have seen it edited to "Assault". What gives?Bjbeardse (talk) 23:49, 17 October 2017 (UTC)


 * "Assault rifle" is a genuine military term for a specific type of rifle such as the M16 and AK-47. "Assault weapon" is the dubious political and media term for semi-automatic military-style rifles that is often conflated with "assault rifle". As long as "assault rifle" is used in the correct context here, it's fine. - BilCat (talk) 03:59, 18 October 2017 (UTC)


 * The term 'assault rifle' was derived from the late-WW II German 'Sturmgewehr', the StG 44. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.173.52 (talk) 15:17, 27 December 2017 (UTC)

Matchlock Rifle Inclusion
Should a section on Matchlock firearms be added? Some Matchlocks had rifled barrels later in the lifetime of that technology.

The source: Weir, William (2005). 50 Weapons That Changed Warfare. Franklin Lakes, NJ: Career Press. pp. 71–74. ISBN 978-1-56414-756-1. linked on the Matchlock page is a source on rifled matchlocks. Joheinous (talk) 23:35, 31 December 2019 (UTC)


 * Yes, provided you have confidence in your source(s), please go ahead and add it. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 23:53, 31 December 2019 (UTC)

Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 06:20, 23 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Enfield Musket..jpg
 * Model 1886 Lebel rifle.jpg

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 06:42, 23 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Baker rifle (no bayonet).png

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 06:08, 26 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Model 1886 Lebel rifle.jpg

Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reasons for deletion at the file description pages linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 06:30, 26 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Baker rifle (no bayonet).png
 * Enfield Musket..jpg

Smooth Bored Shotguns called Rifles
As written, this piece says, "rifle is now often used for any long-shaped handheld ranged weapon designed for well-aimed discharge activated by a trigger." But no source is given there. It seems that you would include smooth bored shotguns with this definition. This claim seems doubtful to me. (TerryKave (talk) 18:02, 4 December 2023 (UTC))

This piece says, "In many works of fiction a rifle refers to any weapon that has a stock and is shouldered before firing, even if the weapon is not rifled or does not fire solid projectiles (e.g. a "laser rifle")." Yet no source is provided for this claim. Perhaps somebody has done a survey of popular writings / fiction works, and come up with percent as to out of a million works which use the term "rifle," some percent use the term as claimed. (TerryKave (talk) 18:08, 4 December 2023 (UTC))