Talk:The E.N.D. World Tour

Tour title
As per the official promotional material, there is clearly NO fullstop after the 'D' in the title. Please do not change again unless promotional material is altered. Mrincredible (talk) 12:42, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
 * What material? The poster? That's exactly the same style as The E.N.D. At least we should try to focus on one style.--Totie (talk) 15:02, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
 * As we already use The E.N.D. with full stop for the same reason, we should stick to this style. It would be confusing. The sources in this article don't support your position, as one of them clearly says "The E.N.D. World Tour". We should wait for more official sources.--Totie (talk) 11:59, 5 July 2009 (UTC)
 * As I have stated MANY times, all of the "OFFICIAL" promotional material, including the poster featured on this page, but also ALL of the television commercials and newspaper advertisements in Australia (which you would not have seen clearly) have not once used the full-stop at the end. The sources are merely local companies, and obviously the official imaging featuring the band would trump this. The album cover, on the other hand, uses OFFICIALLY both versions. You will notice (on the deluxe version at least) the front does not use the third full stop, whereas the spine does. Please do not change unless and until there is anything OFFICIAL released otherwise. Mrincredible (talk) 12:00, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
 * As I said before, it is confusing for others. While we use the full stop for the album, we don't use it for the tour (which is based on the album). I can't check the commercials, because I don't live in Australia. The poster does not support the correct title, because they could have removed the last full stop for style reasons. Note that they don't use any points at all, but interpoints. There is no clear style of writing at this time, all sources are different and posters aren't clear enough. I wan't a third opinion on this. If we let this name as it is, then we should rename The E.N.D. as well, to keep the consensus.--Totie (talk) 14:23, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
 * As I said before, the album cover uses both versions, hence why the album article could be either. The tour promotions do not. Mrincredible (talk) 06:28, 7 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I believe the article should be left as The E.N.D. because after all it is an abreviation. All abreviations should have a dot after each letter as this is considered good English and would be gramatically correct. Billboard's discography page also lists the album as E.N.D as does Amazon.com, Target.com, BlackEyedPeas.com. Plus wikipedia states under its rules for articles that albums/songs/people should be named under gramatical correctness and regardless of how it is otherwise spelt. for an example of what i mean: Whitney Houston's new album is called "I Look To You" but under wikipedia rules it has to be called "I Look to You". (Lil-unique1 (talk) 19:59, 6 July 2009 (UTC))
 * Should we then change Timbaland's The Way I Are to The Way I Am?? Mrincredible (talk) 06:28, 7 July 2009 (UTC)


 * No, the name does not change. I admit, it's not the best example, but it makes one point evident: Wikipedia's guidelines apply. According to those guidelines we should follow the official name of the album/tour or the most common. The problem is, which version is official or more common? With or without full stop? There are many sources for this, but there is no consensus. The cover art is no real source in this case, because the logo uses its own style (and not even stops but interpoints). We should follow the general guideline if no other guideline applies, namely English spelling. Abbreviations get a full stop at the end (example: U.S.A., a.s.a.p. etc.). The E.N.D. gets a full stop at the end. We use the same name on all Wikipedia articles, so this lemma should be "The E.N.D. World Tour".--Totie (talk) 15:05, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Where has it been officially said that this is an abbreviation? I've heard many source touting it as an acronym, including Australian television commercials. So perhaps it should be The END, especially since you keep asserting that they may not even be full stops??? Mrincredible (talk) 04:07, 8 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think that it matters. Most of the sources, including Dipdive.com, write it with stops. After all, it's not "The END" but "The E.N.D.", which stands for "The Energy Never Dies". The full name isn't correct either.--Totie (talk) 08:48, 8 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Now we are quibling over semantics. Your comparison of The Way I Are and The Way I Am is a poor example because by changing a word you alter the meaning/context of the phrase. The difference between the two is the level of colloqualism (one sounds more slang than the other). The album's coverart uses centralised dots to seperate letters hence the D is not succeeded by a dot. However at the end of the day the album is called Energy Never Dies which is shortened (shortened being the key word) to The E.N.D.. It is due to the shortening of the words down to single letters that it should be left as E.N.D. not E.N.D or END (this would suggest the album is called The End as in 'Ending' or 'End' of something. Even the sources in the article like "Frontier Tour Company" place a dot at the end of the END. One solution might be to move the article and call the page Energy Never Dies. Then in the introduction we can put that it is sometimes referred to as The E.N.D, The E.N.D. or The End. what do you think? (Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:28, 8 July 2009 (UTC))


 * It says "The E.N.D" on the album cover, which could be a deliberate punctuation mistake, like Fergie's misspelt album title, "The Dutchess". MatthewWaller (talk) 12:03, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think that it's a good idea to rename it into "Energy Never Dies". The official name is the abbreviation and it would be confusing to write it out. We should choose one spelling and keep it. My vote goes to "The E.N.D." and my arguments are clear.--Totie (talk) 18:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Considering the article is supposed to be encyclopedic following guidelines, I suggest it include the full name of the tour in the intro paragraph for those who don't know what E.N.D may stand for (you'd be suprised how many will read the article and not be huge Pea's fans). This will also help a bit in leaving the title as E.N.D. as it will then be explained in the article. Alankc (talk) 02:31, 11 July 2009 (UTC)
 * What about the lemma and the reason for this discussion?--Totie (talk) 10:36, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
 * No reply followed, so I feel free to move it back to The E.N.D. World Tour. See my arguments above. Please discuss about this before moving back.--Totie (talk) 22:14, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Tour Dates
There seems to be a small edit war over the tour dates and placing TBA as an end date as more dates are pending. TBA is actually against guidelines of wikipedia editing (even though it appears on many articles, those just haven't been caught and reverted yet). It's best to only have the dates known unless a valid verifiable citation can be added. when more dates are announced and confirmed, the dates and number of shows can be changed. This keeps the article more specific and accurate, and more encyclopedic rather than looking like a fan site.

As for the edit war, I suggest it end, wikipedia doesn't hesitate to block editors for such things, which is why I decided to post this here so newer editors not aware of any of this now know (assuming they know enough to read a talk page). Alankc (talk) 02:28, 11 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Of course we can just empty the field, as you already did. I concur, it's better than TBA. We should leave it until we have a viable source for this.--Totie (talk) 16:22, 11 July 2009 (UTC)
 * unfortunatly, someone will just add TBA or some random assumed date again.. need to remember to use edit summaries with why TBA is removed (among other things) Alankc (talk) 18:47, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Why, for the whole North America section of the tour, does the only reference given point to a Britney Spears page? Someone the Person (talk) 21:15, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Set List
How about using a table for the set list, with a column for the album that first contained the song? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.221.127.84 (talk) 02:54, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

missing a lot of info
There isn't a single review for the tour. Nor is there any box office score data for any shows —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.81.117.155 (talk) 20:49, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

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Move discussion in progress
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