Talk:Theatre organ

Spelling
Theatre or theater? (See spelling differences). Theatre is spelled both ways through the text. I am not in favor of the first or the second, but I think the page should be consistent. Maniadis (talk) 02:31, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

I think probably the "theatre" spelling should be retained throughout the article. Two reasons -- 1, most early movie palaces used the word "theatre" in their name, instead of "theater;" and 2, official organizations, such as ATOS, continue to use the traditional "theatre" spelling. Erzahler (talk) 22:27, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

The proper spelling would indeed seem to be "Theatre", as seen on the old brochures & sales literature of the period, coupled with the same spelling used upon the Venues of the time that had these instruments installed "As New" during their construction. (talk) 18:17, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Tremolo
This article does not state that the tremolo (and how it is done) is another distinguishing element form the traditional church organ.

Cleanup
I came across this page while creating an entry for Richard Simonton, founding member of the American Theatre Organ Society. This page a bit of a ramble, needs to be divided into sections addressing technical, historical and other aspects, so that readers can find the information they are looking for. It is also extremely shy on the technical aspects of theatre organs. I removed the references to the pizzeria in Pheonix, as it's primarily a commercial link, although a neat one.

I created "History" and "Future" sections and moved a few paragraphs around. Would like to see more history, particularly with respect to Robert Hope-Jones and the early pianolas. Not sure if the current ATOS statement belongs there or not. Suggestions for further material are welcome. Erzahler 04:40, 24 December 2005 (UTC)

I revised the ATOS and beginning paragraphs, and added a "background" header. The article is somewhat more presentable now. More information is desirable, however. Also some theatre organ photos will be a good addition. I also changed the cleanup date to January 2006. Erzahler 22:10, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the help, Autiger! :o) Erzahler 22:49, 5 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I just realized you were still editing this article right now. Apologies if I've stepped on anything you were working on and feel free to restore if you think I was overly aggressive on cuts. Autiger 22:51, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Not a problem. Looks good! Erzahler 22:52, 5 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Still a bit of linking to do and general cleanup - the article text uses way too many scare quotes. That actually makes me think the text may have been a copyvio, but I haven't Googled for it yet. I just noticed Wurlitzer article needs attention too as long as you're into the subject matter. :-) Autiger 22:58, 5 January 2006 (UTC)


 * The page is looking a lot better guys. Not knowing much about theatre organs, I was relictant to tackle it, but it looks like it's really shaping up. Glowimperial 00:36, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

You changed the links to the Pipe Dreams programs. Did the original links not work? Erzahler 20:55, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the complements on the page, several people have worked on this! I also did a little editing on the Wurlitzer page. I'd like to see separate pages on some of the other organ builders also, such as Barton, Robert-Morton, Kimball, Moller, Christie, etc. These are some of the more major builders of theatre organs. Erzahler 20:58, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Additional: the article needs a better introduction, but I am at a loss as to how to write it. Perhaps someone can help me out here? Erzahler 23:33, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

I have created a new subject on the diaphone. You may want to look at it, and add anything you think may be useful. It is another stop found in theatre organs. Erzahler 22:09, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

The page is looking good, people! I've been away for a while, but I'm glad to see the page has been cleaned up and looking more professional. Kudos to everyone for your hard work! :o) Erzahler 20:54, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

The page needs another section. The theatre organ/unit orchestra was conceived as a new and distinct musical instrument, albeit sharing design elements with traditional pipe organs. However, "theatre organs" were installed in venues other than cinemas. Auditoria, civic and sporting arenas, and private residences became homes for new theatre organs during its heyday. This page discusses mainly theatre installations, while briefly touching on some residence installations (but in recent years). One of the very largest theatre organs (certainly with the largest console!) was the 6-manual 52 rank Barton organ installed in the Chicago Stadium. I am surprised that this article contains no mention of this significant and unique theatre organ. (I wrote the 'History of the Theatre Organ' articles for the ATOS website, and I plan to make some significant edits and updates to this page soon.)Kelzeegla (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 17:19, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Technical
I have added a "technical" section on the page, as I felt the page should have something about the technical aspects of the theatre organ. Please feel free to add to or refine anything you feel is necessary. Erzahler 22:50, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Other
I don't know who "70.17.73.10" is, but please, if you are going to make changes, please state the nature of your changes. Also, let's leave the politics out of it. This article is to be a thesis on facts, not conjecture. I will be reverting to the previous edit, taking the biased information out concerning ATOS. Erzahler 18:19, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

ATOS
Other than a link, is there really a need to have a detailed section on the American Theatre Organ Society on this page? It should probably have it's own page, given that it's a notable organisation with an interesting history. By havign a major section for it on this page, it also creates the POV that theatre organ culture is controlled or in some way totally dependent on the ATOS. Glowimperial 22:08, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

You have a point there. My main emphasis is merely to show that ATOS is involved in the preservation of theatre organs. I agree that ATOS should have its own page, but a brief mention of it should be made here. Erzahler 22:19, 16 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm tempted to re-write the last sentence of your ATOS re-write as it's definitely POV (although I agree with it, and it's well written). If I can advise you to make the final sentence of that section less "shouldy", the section would be great.  Glowimperial 18:39, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I will give it some thought, but at the moment, my mind is a blank. I wanted to remove the heavy emphasis on ATOS per your previous suggestion, and this is all I have thought of so far. Erzahler 19:55, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

There is a real need to reference the American Theatre Organ Society here, as you can't have one without the other. Theatre Organs have, by and large, been saved by the organization, and its members, and almost no one else. Also, I have put in information on the promotion of these instruments to the general public because it is a direct reference to the historical value and preservation efforts of these folks. An ATOS page would be just fine, but, you have to cross reference. And, nothing in my reference indicates that ATOS has a control on theatre organs, (though you might get that argument from some members!) But, the group is no different than any of the more than 15,000 national hobby associations that exist in this country.


 * Certainly ATOS deserves some mention, but I think it would be better served if it had its own page instead of writing something about it here. In the pipe organ category, you probably wouldn't expound on the AGO in the article, but you would probably mention it with reference to a separate article. Erzahler 19:03, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

ATOS now has it's own article
Since the idea was mentioned several times here, I created the article: American Theatre Organ Society. I think the article is off to a good start, but feel free to add anything, if you think I missed anything relevant in the article. Thanks. Billertl (talk) 16:40, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

Theatre Organ Sound Files
If any of you are interested, I found some interesting theatre organ sound files to listen to. I didn't link them as I don't know if the link will work, so you'll have to paste them in your browser.

javascript:sfGo('http://organfax.co.uk/media/audio/realaudio/rodda-3.ram?pageid=av-summary-results-controller', 'www.organfax.co.uk?pageid=av-summary-results-controller')

javascript:sfGo('http://organfax.co.uk/media/audio/realaudio/rodda-1.ram?pageid=av-summary-results-controller', 'www.organfax.co.uk?pageid=av-summary-results-controller')

"Current Status" Section
This section in the article has been a subject of some conjecture. I have reworded the first paragraph to more accurately convey the intent I had for this section. The first paragraph NOW should include ONLY instruments that remain in their original installation AND still have their original specification. For that reason, the Wichita Wurlitzer and the El Capitan Wurlitzer have been removed as their specifications are no longer original (they have been modified by the addition of more ranks of pipes, thereby deviating from the builder's original specification.) I have added the Denver Paramount as that is the next largest organ I know of that still has its original specification and is in its originally-installed venue. If there are other larger original installation/original specification organs in existence, please feel free to add them. Remember, however, they MUST conform to the above criteria. Erzahler 18:35, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

If anyone knows of a Compton or Christie theatre organ in its original installation and still possessing its original specification, I'd like to have one of each added to the section in order to offer a variety of manufacturers. Remember, the organ MUST be in its original installation with its original builder's specification in order to be considered for inclusion. Erzahler 18:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

'''When considering organs for inclusion in this section, please THOROUGHLY research the organ. Remember the qualifications: 1), the organ MUST be in its originally-installed venue; 2), the organ must be playable; 3), the organ must have it's ORIGINAL BUILDER'S SPECIFICATION (no ranks added or removed (replacement of electro-pneumatic relay with an electronic relay is permissible)); 4), the organ must be in a public venue.''' Erzahler 18:02, 27 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I just made an edit to this section, because I saw that the Atlantic City Boardwalk organ was referred to as a 55 rank Kimball. So I did some research and saw that there are two organs at the Boardwalk, so I added the main Auditorium organ, identified it as a Midmer-Losh and moved the Kimball to the next line.   Then I reread the section description, and realized this list is only for original venue/specification organs.  Oops. And in reviewing the list I found many others that do not fit that criteria.
 * Since this section is not really the "Current Status" of all theater organs, I suggest renaming the title of the section to "Current Status of Original Venue and Specification Organs" so it stands out.  I am not the only editor that did not read the fine print ... but this will make me more careful in the future. Bobsd (talk) 21:38, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Unsourced statements
Something should be done about the lack of sources for this article. I might do something on this if I am able, but I am quite limited on free time at the moment. It would be great if some of you folks who've worked on this article could provide some of your sources! EthanL (talk) 06:23, 23 October 2006 (UTC) A citation needed template is indicated after the statement of the exposure of the Theatre Organ to new audiences is happening. A mere reference to the ATOS website or journal and their chapter reports and articles should be more than sufficient.24.253.220.182 (talk) 06:18, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

solenoids?
Hello, The technical section of the article describes the use of solenoids for stops, pipe valves, and other controls. I am not sure this is very accurate to say as when one mentions solenoids, people usually think of a different kind of solenoid. If we are talking about a wound magnet, then yes, but theater organs usually used electromagnets which moved metal plates, which in turn affected a larger wind pressure source. There is a nice diagram here, but I think its copyrighted: http://www.theatreorgans.com/patos/index_files/WurlitzerChestAction.htm 66.172.101.250 (talk) 16:03, 30 November 2011 (UTC)


 * The term solenoid was coined in 1823 by André-Marie Ampère to designate a helical coil. I think it's use here is correct. Bobsd (talk) 22:54, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Term "unit organ" is missing
It is "somehow" explained under "Unification", but the term "unit organ" even made it into Merriam-Webster, so it should at least be mentioned here. --User:Haraldmmueller 18:55, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Chicago Area (to do)
Some potentially useful sources for Chicago area organs: -- Theodore Kloba (☎) 20:16, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The Chicago Area Theatre Organ Enthusiasts
 * Classic Cinemas: York Theatre and Tivoli Theatre

Unification
states (as of 01/30/21): "Previously, each rank of pipes could be played on only one manual (keyboard) at one pitch level. "

This is incorrect. Even on a tracker organ, a rank of pipes could be coupled to more than one manual. There are also examples of tracker organs with octave couplers. Of course using additional pipes in extending ranks and providing the ability to play the same pipe of a rank on octaves on the same keyboard is a hallmark of a theater organ. I think we could change this sentence to read: "Previously, each pipe within a rank could be played on a manual at one pitch level." Or eliminate the "Previously ... " and just explain the theater organ capabilities rather than trying to say what it is not. Bobsd (talk) 23:12, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Appearances in TV, Films and other Media
The theatre organ can be seen and heard in the episode Cartouche of Endeavour.

What other media appearances are there? --Apisite (talk) 23:55, 27 June 2022 (UTC)

Point of View
I was not the one who raised the "fan point of view" issue, but I certainly agree with it: the article reads almost like something one would find on either the ATOS web site or "theatreorgans.com." But I have neither the expertise nor the time to actually do anything about it myself. Hbquikcomjamesl (talk) 16:20, 7 October 2022 (UTC)


 * I agree it has some issues. I like the technical detail and I think its relevant, but maybe it can be focused a bit more clearly. I was thinking a couple of sub sections could help clarify things. For example, the history section might include development, proliferation, decline and something about modern usage and application, while the technical section might be broken up into console/control systems, sound production and something else maybe. I don't really know anything about theatre organs but I have some ideas about sources. Will put on my list of things to do! Justinkrivers (talk) 15:43, 2 February 2023 (UTC)