Talk:Wes Moore/Archive 1

Added Citations
I work for Rubenstein and Wes Moore is a client of ours. To mitigate any potential conflict of interest, per BLP Standards, I did not edit the content of the article, I merely added reliable citations to key facts. If there are any questions/concerns to my actions, please discuss on my talk page. //Brycetom (talk) 21:12, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Style/Tone
Per the style/tone notice, I have restructured the first paragraphs of the entry to be more in line with Wikipedia style. I ask that an editor add the content to the page as they see fit. If the content is not moved in 48 hours, I will go ahead and edit the entry directly. If you have any concerns, please discuss here or on my talk page. //Brycetom (talk) 19:49, 28 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Per BLP Standards, content moved to entry. //Brycetom (talk) 16:14, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

Forcefully Advancing
There is a book called Forcefully Advancing which is written by a Wes Moore. Does anyone know if this is the same Wes Moore as listed in the article? The official website for the book is here. -Hardwigg (talk) 17:30, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

Not the same guy. Forcefully Advancing website has author photo. So, there are at least three Wes Moores. Don&#39;t Be Evil (talk) 01:49, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

Appearance on Real Time with Bill Maher
I believe it is very important for readers of this page to know that he appeared on the Real Time with Bill Maher, discussing the 2012 election as well as reflecting a lot on his own life and books and other endeavors. I don't feel confident in my own editing, so I just ask that someone add this to his page.

Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.50.8.182 (talk) 00:59, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Notability
How does this guy qualify for his own wikipedia page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.232.60.145 (talk) 19:51, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

I believe Wes Moore should have his own page as he is a White House Fellow, Rhodes Scholar, was a speaker at the 2008 DNC, and is on the board of several well known organizations. He is "up-and-coming" which is how I came across this Wikipedia page. It seems worthwhile to have a page to provide information about Wes Moore in one location.

He's the author of The Other Wes Moore.Don&#39;t Be Evil (talk) 01:48, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

It says he appears on MSNBC, so the reason for him to have his own page would be that he must be a liberal and ergo important. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.44.233.118 (talk) 22:19, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

Image - From publicist
I'm a little worried that current infobox image is apparently from a publicist. That seems like it might fall afoul of WP:BLPSPS and WP:NOTADVERT. Does anyone want to keep the image or can I swap it for another one? NickCT (talk) 15:33, 28 September 2021 (UTC)

NPOV and overdetail changes
Coming to discuss with and anyone else, per WP:BRD. My changes were aimed at addressing NPOV issues and unencyclopedic overdetail in the article. These issues were clearly noticed by other editors as well, hence the already-added "resume-like" template. In the past, this article has also been repeatedly edited by WP:SPAs who have added promotional content, causing some of these neutrality issues. Which specific parts of my changes did you object to? —Ganesha811 (talk) 21:08, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
 * First of all I suggest doing your major citation work separate from your content editing as combining them makes it hard to parse what changes you've made. Please also consider making incremental changes and explaining your rationale rather than wholesale changes, especially after they've been objected to. Thanks for initiating this discussion.
 * Correct me if I'm wrong but your changes make the lede paragraph a single sentence and include a misplaced comma in the same opening sentence / paragraph. You remove the entire honors and accolades section about his work and career including honors he's received such as this one. You left in an entire section of "controversies" with entire paragraphs about tax issues and minor disputes over his career history (much of which you excised from the opening paragraph). Why do you think his work as a social entrepreneur of student programs isn't important? Why are property tax issues that have been resolved more important than honors he's received and his career history? A fellowship with Condoleeza Rice and being identified by Crane's Business as an influential 40 under 40 certainly seem worth including to me.FloridaArmy (talk) 21:39, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
 * CitationBot keeps its edits separate, though I agree that here everything got a little muddled up. I tend to edit in a WP:BOLD manner, so I generally work wholesale, though I note that my initial changes took place over 8 edits. Now, down to specifics:
 * I definitely have no problem with recombining parts of the lead to avoid a single-sentence paragraph. I just felt the lead wasn't very comprehensive as it stood. Good catch on the comma, you are correct. As to the honors and awards, I generally feel that unless an honor is itself notable, like the Fields Medal or the Booker Prize, it is not worth mentioning in someone's biography. There are so many organizations, websites, and magazines that give out countless non-notable awards and accolades. To include them all, or even a subset, generally tends towards puffery and promotionalism. I don't think Crain New York's annual lists of 40 under 40 (a new 40 every year!) are truly significant.
 * With regards to "social entrepreneur" status, I left in the material about BridgeEdU, since it was clearly notable, so if you could clarify your comment there that would be helpful. As to the controversies section, I didn't change anything there because I have not yet taken the time to look into the sources for those issues and see whether the section is an adequate summary of them, so I let it be. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on them and am very open to changes. —Ganesha811 (talk) 22:26, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I am going to start re-instating some changes to improve NPOV, with the modifications discussed above. It will be broken up into a bunch of edits, hopefully with clear edit summaries. Happy to discuss any of them here. —Ganesha811 (talk) 19:13, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

Hindutva controversy
@JosephSmith1 I dispute your edit to the paragraph about Moore attending a fundraiser hosted by individuals associated with Trump and the Hindutva political movement. The edit you made adjusts the paragraph from being about Moore attending a fundraiser hosted by Hindu nationalists to one about Moore "relying on ties to the Oval Office" to get elected -- a claim made by neither of the articles cited in that paragraph. Per your edit summary, you also claim that the cited Intercept article is on Moore's ties to the Trump campaign. This is not the case, as the article's purpose is to highlight how Hindutva is becoming involved with American politics through financial contributions to various political candidates and campaigns, including Moore's campaign. Y2hyaXM (talk) 17:37, 13 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Apologies in advance, as I am rather new to this process but still very knowledgeable about the subject matter itself. Your points are somewhat valid, but not entirely accurate. The sub-headline calls out 'Trump supporters' first and by name. Regarding the second point however, I stated that the focus of the paragraph was on Moore's ties to the Trump Campaign, not the article itself. The current state of the edit is still inaccurate and also illogical. Jasdip Singh and Sajid Tarar are not at all associated with the Hindutva movement, and it would be strange for a Sikh and a Muslim to be a Hindu nationalist in the first place. Upon further research, it appears that this should not be listed as a controversy at all.
 * The Intercept article (listed on Wikipedia as an anti-Semitic news organization biased against democrats in the first place here: The Intercept) states that the main organizers of the event were Sikhs and Muslims, with some Hindu representation, and some of that Hindu representation had alleged ties to Hindutva. The linkage of the single fundraiser itself to Hindutva is weak & forced at best. The main example the author cites is of Maryland doctor Sudhir Sekhsaria, and labels him as a Hindu Nationalist without any evidence or details.
 * Upon re-reading the article, it is clear that the authors forced a narrative. The facts: Sikhs, Muslims, and Hindus gathered for a multicultural fundraiser to support Wes Moore's campaign. The Sikh and Muslims groups were the main organizers of the event, there was no dedicated Hindu group present. Of the Hindus present, two had alleged ties to the Hindutva movement (one of which the author provided no evidence of). hence the title: Is Hindu Nationalist Money Making Its Way into Maryland's Governors Race' is tremendously misleading and barely supported by the content that follows. I am requesting that this controversy be removed in its entirety. JosephSmith1 (talk) 01:09, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your reply, and no worries!
 * The article could make a better job at pointing out Sekhsaria's ties to Hindutva, I agree. I think the connection they're trying to make between the two is that Sekhsaria has contributed or hosted events for Hindutva-linked politicians and organizations like Ekal Vidyalaya and Narendra Modi. Moore lists a $9,000 campaign contribution from Sekhsaria in his latest campaign finance report (filed October 28, 2022), but lists no contributions from any of the other individuals listed in the article. Given that this is such a small amount raised compared to the total amount Moore raised that quarter ($4.85 million), I think it would be fair to remove this paragraph from the controversy section of this page and from Aruna Miller's page. Y2hyaXM (talk) 13:47, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your reply and explanation as well! I did not realize that Ekal was tied to Hindutva organizations. Thank you also for focusing on the facts of the campaign finance report.
 * I agree with you regarding the total impact (number of Hindutva-associated donors & amount donated) vs the severity of the headline. Let me know if I should make the edit to remove this paragraph and the corresponding section from Aruna Milller's page (and if so, the best way of doing so) or if you plan to make the edits. JosephSmith1 (talk) 01:38, 15 November 2022 (UTC)
 * As a general matter, I can't tell you what to do per WP:CANVASS. Y2hyaXM (talk) 02:11, 15 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Just removed the paragraph. I'm happy to continue this discussion if anyone feels anything was missed here. Y2hyaXM (talk) 03:03, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

I don’t think we should be removing sourced controversies over perceived “unseriousness.” People in Maryland were interviewed for the article who did take issue with this and other sources based in Maryland have also talked about Miller’s allahed ties to Hindutva. It merits mention. Barbarbarty (talk) 04:07, 1 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Could you provide some examples of Maryland-based sources covering Moore's/Miller's ties to Hindutva? When I first had this discussion, the only source I could find about it were Blogspot posts and opinion pieces. Y2hyaXM (talk) 12:59, 1 December 2022 (UTC)


 * https://marylandreporter.com/2022/10/28/state-roundup-early-voting-begins-with-hogan-calling-for-support-of-process-voter-integrity-groups-watching-polls/


 * It is referencing The Intercept reporting but it was obviously enough for Maryland sources to reference it.


 * There are also some groups in Maryland like Peace Action Montgomery who have made comments on the issue:


 * https://peaceactionmontgomery.org/no-hindutva-funds-in-maryland/


 * It may not merit a whole section but I do think it does deserve at least some mention. The fact that the Moore campaign put out a whole page on their website to dissuade such concerns should show they took this seriously. Barbarbarty (talk) 19:13, 1 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks for letting me know about these. Through my own research, I was also able to find the Hindutva controversy mentioned on more recent articles written by notable news sources, including Bethesda Magazine, Two Circles, and The Week. All of these sources don't have to do with Wes Moore specifically, though, so I feel this topic might be more appropriate on the Aruna Miller page. Maryland Matters accredits Miller specifically for bringing "additional fundraising acumen to the campaign" in this article and mentioned in an earlier article that she has a strong fundraising base of her own, so it's possible/likely that she brought contributors from her 2018 congressional campaign, including individuals associated with Hindutva (contributions from these individuals to her '18 campaign are mentioned in the Two Circles article), onto Moore's campaign. Y2hyaXM (talk) 21:24, 1 December 2022 (UTC)


 * I agree with these sentiments and reserving mention of them for the Aruna Miller page! I am glad we were able to find a resolution to this. Barbarbarty (talk) 21:48, 1 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Great, I'm glad we could come to an agreement on this! Y2hyaXM (talk) 22:26, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

Usage of Incumbent?
According to M Webster “incumbent” means : one that occupies a particular position or place. I’m confused. Wasn’t Gov. Hogan the incumbent? 2601:984:4101:8EB0:B898:ED12:536A:AA43 (talk) 17:00, 19 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Moore was sworn in as governor on January 18, 2023. Hogan was the incumbent governor before then, but is no longer. Y2hyaXM (talk) 19:50, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Controversies section?
Does anyone object to a controversy section, like almost all public figures have? I propose including controversy over his book and public claims that he was awarded the Bronze star and grew up in Baltimore, which he sometimes allowed people in his presence to state without correcting. Sources include the following, including video clips, as well as his pushback:

https://www.baltimoresun.com/politics/bs-md-pol-wes-moore-20220429-4m55go723nggzaf4a5fhl3ixv4-story.html

https://foxbaltimore.com/news/local/bronze-star-recipient-wes-moore-appears-to-misrepresent-military-record-in-past-interview — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xenomorphologist (talk • contribs) 19:42, 3 July 2023 (UTC)


 * This controversy is already covered in the article Y2hyaXM (talk) 21:02, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Oscar Dunn was the first black governor of Louisiana - not Pinchback
Oscar Dunn was elected Lieutenant Governor of Louisiana and on two separate occasions he served as Acting Governor when Governor Warmoth was out of the state. Dunn died in office & Pinchback was elected Lieutenant Governor to replace Dunn. Then he, too, served as Acting Governor when Warmoth was out of the state. 24.252.88.21 (talk) 17:56, 6 July 2023 (UTC)