Template talk:First Nations Australians

Basic Information
When making any changes please refer back to  The Australian Government Style Manual   as it is the most recently updated.

If you find a source better than the Australian Government, then please start a discussion. AverageFraud (talk) 10:37, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

Length of Template
If anyone would like to assist by making subsections of the template collapsible that would be great. This is so that the template doesn't become too long.

I will be looking into how to do this as well. AverageFraud (talk) 10:48, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

Image
If anyone can find an appropriate image that would be helpful, I was thinking of including both the Aboriginal Flag and the Torres Strait Islander Flag but decided against it. AverageFraud (talk) 10:50, 1 December 2022 (UTC)

Blak
I believe that we should mention the usage of Blak somewhere in this Terminology Guide

SMH and SBS have articles about it's usage.

The National Museum of Australia has used Blak to refer to First Nations Australians.

Monash University also had a panel discussing Blak design.

There also exists Sydney Festival’s Blak Out.

If anyone has some suggestions on how this should be implemented please discuss.

Thanks,

AverageFraud (talk) 07:58, 2 December 2022 (UTC)

'non-Indigenous', 'non-indigenous', 'other Australians', 'the wider community'
I am undecided on what tern should be used: 'non-Indigenous', 'non-indigenous', 'other Australians', 'the wider community'

Does anyone have any recommendations/suggestions?

Thanks,

AverageFraud (talk) 08:02, 2 December 2022 (UTC)

Hold your horses!
I have a lot of dealings with Aboriginal people, and personally regard "First Nations" as a recent, and not yet well established, name for Australia's indigenous peoples.

There is no way it should be become the primary term used in Wikipedia at this stage.

The term came here only recently from Canada, where it is definitely the primary term. It's also strong in the USA, but seems to share a place with "Native Americans". But that doesn't mean we should blindly and unthinkingly change our usage here in Australia. HiLo48 (talk) 22:29, 2 December 2022 (UTC)


 * I will no longer be making any changes to any other Australian articles.


 * My understanding was that in general the Australian Government Style Manual would be the best source and the standard on the correct terminology.


 * At what "stage" should it become the "primary" term? Is there a process that you recommend? A statistic? A survey? When is it established? How does it become established?


 * I provided the Australian Government Style Manual as the source on the correct terminology, and you are saying it's not established?


 * As stated, 'Indigenous' although in common use, many First Nations Australians feel that the term was placed on them as well. So I don't understand how your reasoning is different from mine?


 * Thanks,
 * AverageFraud (talk) 00:13, 3 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Yes, I believe the Australian Government Style Manual is wrong. My reasons are above. I will add that something coming from academia via Canberra is never guaranteed to reflect an on-the-ground reality across all of a country as large and diverse as Australia. Your question "At what "stage" should it become the "primary" term?" seems to tell us you believe it will. That's fortune telling. We don't do that here. How can "First Nation", obviously a recently imported term, be more acceptable than "Indigenous", an old, well established, English word with, as far as I am aware, no negative connotations? HiLo48 (talk) 10:55, 3 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your input, HiLo48. I understand that "First Nations" is a more recent term and may not yet be widely used in Australia. However, I believe it is important to respect the preferences of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples, and to use terms that are appropriate and respectful. The Australian Government Style Manual states that "First Nations Australians" is a preferred term, and I think it is important to follow guidelines like this to ensure that we are using language that is respectful and inclusive. I understand that there may be different opinions on this issue, and I am open to hearing other perspectives. Is there any specific guidance or resources that you would recommend for determining appropriate terminology to use when writing about Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples? AverageFraud (talk) 00:06, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

AIATSIS Guide
Would it be worth adding some resources for potential article improvement? The AIATSIS Guide to evaluating and selecting education resources page has some information that could be useful. Jimmyjrg (talk) 04:12, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

Yes please. Anything that helps improve Australian articles. AverageFraud (talk) 22:23, 22 December 2022 (UTC)


 * This might also be useful to look at as a guide for people adding First Nations content: First Nations Cultural and Intellectual Property in the Arts from the Australia Council for the Arts. It's 196 pages but offers guidance around Indigenous IP which could be very relevant to Wiki projects. Jimmyjrg (talk) 04:25, 10 January 2023 (UTC)