Template talk:Infobox settlement/Archive 2012 TfD

Statistics
Below are counts taken from Database reports/Templates transcluded on the most pages. As comparison the rank and the count for the upper case Infobox Settlement is given.

Nov/Dec 2011 and Apr/May 2012 the upper case variant was growing. Assuming there was some conversion to lower case and no conversion to upper case, then there was some new creation of upper case versions. But no way is known to find out which this were.


 * Since 23:36, 10 June 2010 Xenobot lowered the case [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Sorata&diff=prev&oldid=367314807].
 * At 01:28, 11 June 2009 the template Infobox Settlement was moved to Infobox settlement. [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Infobox_settlement&diff=295695781&oldid=281629213]
 * The 8 June 2009 value 149533 dropped to max(137966,138391) =138391 on 22 June 2009. I.e. 10 K less transclusions reported.
 * On 8 July 2009 the count was above the pre-move level.

Tools
These tools can be used to find the quantity of pages (!not only articles) that transclude a templates.

Data as of 19 December 2012:
 * https://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+settlement 304446

More work needed

 * Infobox Australian Place at Templates for deletion - 2009 September 6, Infobox Australian Place
 * Keep - discussion moved to template's talk page.

Potential

 * Category:Country subdivision infobox templates
 * the generic: Template:Infobox_former_subdivision
 * Category:City infobox templates
 * Infobox Province * series
 * Template:Infobox Russian city district - unused
 * Template:Infobox Argentinian Department - consensus was to use Infobox settlement directly
 * Template:Infobox Mendoza Department - province-specific template for departments of Argentina
 * Template:Infobox Catamarca - province-specific template for departments of Argentina
 * Template:Infobox San Juan Department - province-specific template for departments of Argentina
 * Template:Infobox Corrientes - province-specific template for departments of Argentina
 * Template:Infobox Luxembourg commune - merge+redirect already decided https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Templates_for_discussion/Log/2010_September_19#Template:Infobox_Luxembourg_commune

Converted
…to use as a back-end; see:

Category:Templates calling Infobox settlement (of which there are ).

Redirected

 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Infobox_settlement&hidetrans=1&hidelinks=1

Lower case
Used:
 * As of 2018-11-22 no lower case redirect used in article space.

Not used:
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+area - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+arrondissement - 0 (created 18:18, 13 March 2011‎)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+aspirational+state - 0 (created 14:25, 21 May 2011)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+borough - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+city - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+comarca - 0 (created 17:29, 2 November 2009‎ )
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+commune - 0 (created 11:19, 19 September 2010‎)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+county - 0 (created 09:04, 24 September 2009; 3 in user space)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+department - 0 (created 20:02, 21 September 2009‎; 2 in user space)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+district - 0 (created 18:00, 21 September 2009; 3 in user space)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+division - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+governorate - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+hamlet - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+location - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+municipality - 0 (created 18:11, 21 September 2009‎ )
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+neighborhood - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+neighbourhood - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+parish - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+place - 0 (12 in user space of one user)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+province - 0 (created 18:26, 19 September 2009‎)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+regency - 0 (created 12:13, 18 June 2010‎)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+region - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+state - 0 (created 18:25, 19 September 2009; 4 in user space)
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+subdivision - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+territory - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+town - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+township - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+unrecognized+state - 0
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+zone - 0 (created 00:57, 18 December 2012‎)

Upper case
These are used:
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+City - 66 (0 in article space )
 * http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&namespace=10&name=Infobox+Settlement - 7783 (confined to articles created between 30 June 2008 and 14 June 2009, often mass-created by User:Passportguy, User:Kotbot, User:Dr. Blofeld)

All:
 * Infobox Administrative division
 * Infobox Borough
 * Infobox City
 * Infobox County
 * Infobox Department
 * Infobox Division
 * Infobox Municipality
 * Infobox Neighborhood
 * Infobox Place
 * Infobox Region
 * Infobox Settlement
 * Infobox Township
 * Infobox Village

Deleted

 * This list is under development and is far from complete. Please add templates which have been deleted in favour of this one.
 * 1) Template:Bosnia and Herzegovina municipalities Zenica
 * 2) Template:Bosnia and Herzegovina municipalities02
 * 3) Template:CoDepartment infobox
 * 4) Template:Community area
 * 5) Template:Croatian County
 * 6) Template:District data of Japan
 * 7) Template:India UT capital infobox
 * 8) Template:India UT infobox2
 * 9) Template:Infobox Amphoe
 * 10) Template:Infobox Argentinian Department
 * 11) Template:Infobox Autonomous community
 * 12) Template:Infobox Belgische deelgemeente
 * 13) Template:Infobox Chaco
 * 14) Template:Infobox Chilean region
 * 15) Template:Infobox County Romania
 * 16) Template:Infobox District PT
 * 17) Template:Infobox Greek prefecture
 * 18) Template:Infobox Philippine region
 * 19) Template:Infobox Uruguayan Department
 * 20) Template:Infobox City in Afghanistan
 * 21) Template:Infobox city in the Republic of Macedonia
 * 22) Template:Infobox city in the Republic of Macedonia (dual language)
 * 23) Template:Infobox City of Moldova
 * 24) Template:Infobox city of Panama
 * 25) Template:Infobox City PT
 * 26) Template:Infobox City Ukraine
 * 27) Template:Infobox Crimean town
 * 28) Template:Infobox County Estonia
 * 29) Template:Infobox deelgemeente Belgium
 * 30) Template:Infobox divisions of Sarawak
 * 31) Template:Infobox District Cambodia
 * 32) Template:Infobox District CZ
 * 33) Template:Infobox District of Moldova
 * 34) Template:Infobox District Peru
 * 35) Template:Infobox districts of Selangor
 * 36) Template:Infobox England district
 * 37) Template:Infobox Estonian County
 * 38) Template:Infobox Federal Territory of Malaysia
 * 39) Template:Infobox French hamlet
 * 40) Template:Infobox Luxembourg
 * 41) Template:Infobox Luxembourg canton
 * 42) Template:Infobox Micropolitan Area
 * 43) Template:Infobox Moldovan Location
 * 44) Template:Infobox Montenegro
 * 45) Template:Infobox Municipalities of Portugal
 * 46) Template:Infobox Municipality in the Republic of Macedonia
 * 47) Template:Infobox Municipality portugal
 * 48) Template:Infobox Municipality pt
 * 49) Template:Infobox of upazilas
 * 50) Template:Infobox Pakistan district
 * 51) Template:Infobox Pakistani location
 * 52) Template:Infobox Political Division
 * 53) Template:Infobox Province GR
 * 54) Template:Infobox Province of Kazakhstan
 * 55) Template:Infobox Region of Georgia
 * 56) Template:Infobox Romania Villages
 * 57) Template:Infobox Settlement 1
 * 58) Template:Infobox Settlement (Serbia)
 * 59) Template:Infobox Statistical Regions of the Republic of Macedonia
 * 60) Template:Infobox Subdivisions of Malaysia
 * 61) Template:Infobox Tehsil Pakistan
 * 62) Template:Metropolitan cities of India
 * 63) Template:Place in Mexico
 * 64) Template:Romanian regions infobox
 * 65) Template:Statistical region of Slovenia
 * 66) Template:Tirana District
 * 67) Template:Taiwan Administrative Divisions
 * 68) Template:Tokyo-Infobox
 * 69) Template:Tokyo-Infobox/Idea 1
 * 70) Template:Union councils of Pakistan
 * 71) Template:Village in Ukraine



Comments
Based on some of the discussions that occurred at those TfD's above. I added the demographics fields, additional timezones, and a separate section of blankfields. Hopefully we'll have some examples in the explanation table soon. &mdash;  MJC detroit  (yak) 17:18, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 20:37, 12 January 2009 (UTC)


 * This Infobox is so versitile and covers a very wide range of data, I don't see why the other infoboxes (especially the subdivision ones) were created in the first place. I think the Subdivision infoboxes should be discussed for deletion ASAP because they try to use the same parameters found in this infobox and are redundant in lieu of this. Digirami (talk) 07:40, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Because they are easier for the editors. On a Vietnamese box, an editor would never have to enter time zone information, because the time zone is the same for all of Vietnam! NVanMinh (talk) 22:56, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Redirects for deletion - they break tools
Redirects break tools and also may interfere with human interaction.

Counting tools
One tool for which behavior is not known is the counter: http://toolserver.org/~jarry/templatecount/index.php?lang=en&name=Template%3AInfobox+settlement may omit redirects.

There may be other tools that don't work on redirects. And that puts an extra burden on the management of the articles:
 * finding them
 * checking the fields

At 08:02, 17 December 2012 (UTC) the counter did show 303887 then I replaced some redirects, and now 23:11 it shows 304251.

List via: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Infobox_settlement&hidetrans=1&hidelinks=1 NVanMinh (talk) 23:11, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Nominate them at WP:RFD first, then orphan them if the discussion closes as delete. Frietjes (talk) 00:44, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Why so? What is the reason to have 30 articles using Infobox city . RFD is for deletion not for replacement. The current situation breaks tools! Why do you oppose? NVanMinh (talk) 00:48, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I find it easier to find all the province articles by using what links to infobox province, and WP:RFD is Redirects for discussion the last time I checked. Frietjes (talk) 00:56, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * OK. Point taken. I stop replacement and can you stop reverting and then we discuss? You didn't address "city". NVanMinh (talk) 00:58, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I have not reverted any of your replacements of village, town, etc with settlement, just higher administrative subdivisions (zone, department, ...). Frietjes (talk) 01:15, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the clarification. NVanMinh (talk) 02:03, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Edit tools
What is with WP:CHECKWIKI, can it be used to clean up templates, e.g. order elements, add spaces so the "=" and the values align well. Will it work on redirects? If so, does it need a complete list supplied by us? NVanMinh (talk) 07:16, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

WP:OC#SHAREDNAMES
Categories for discussion/Log/2012 November 2 - SHAREDNAMES was applied to remove grouping of items by type name (province/department/division). So it was deemed not worthy for the readers of the Wikipedia. But some editors now use work around to group things that only share a name. They put "Infobox county" on articles about counties of Albania and counties of Liberia. So editors then can look at what links here to find all things named county. But the normal readers cannot. I think this is not fair WRT the average reader. NVanMinh (talk) 07:31, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Orphaning of redirects
Could you please stop orphaning redirects? We frequently have a problem where editors will try to create a fork of Infobox settlement just because they think that a Zone or a Province or a County is not a settlement. To help limit the number of forks, many have been redirected to. This also helps editors to find when they look for say. Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ (talk) 01:50, 18 December 2012 (UTC)


 * This template was plastered on articles that were not provinces in the first place. And all what these things have in common is something close to WP:OC. And the redirects on if placed in articles break functionality of tools. And orphaning does not stop people to find Infobox settlement, right? NVanMinh (talk) 01:53, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * What functionality of which tools is broken? Calliopejen1 (talk) 02:18, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * The official transclusion counter, linked from template pages. NVanMinh (talk) 02:58, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * What's so hard about adding up the numbers for various redirects? Calliopejen1 (talk) 17:46, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Why calculating values if you could have them with one click? NVanMinh (talk) 21:51, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * So your plan is to just ignore everyone who tells you to stop? That's a very bad idea. Plastikspork ―Œ (talk)  06:21, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * No. With Frietjes I have an agreement to not touch Infobox province/department/state ... there is no objection WRT neighborhood and the other smaller units. See above, there are 300000+ transclusions of Infobox settlement, that means Infobox neighborhood with 10 transclusions or so is not even a per mil. Evem Infobox City is less than one percent. Almost all new articles are created by using the generic standard template "Infobox settlement". So, what is the problem to consolidate Infobox City into Infobox settlement? NVanMinh (talk) 07:13, 19 December 2012 (UTC)