Template talk:Vancouver Canucks roster

UFAs
Please don't remove Brendan Morrison from the roster; unless he's been traded, signed elswhere, retired or the Canucks have chosen not to re-sign him. GoodDay (talk) 00:18, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Update: Morrison has signed with the Anaheim Ducks. Looks like the captaincy is gonna go to Mattias Ohlund. GoodDay (talk) 00:46, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Sedins hometown
To all who would spell differently, please refrain:

Here are four cites for the spelling of the home town for Daniel Sedin:
 * NHL.Com: Ornskoldsvik, Sweden
 * TSN.Ca: Ornskoldsvik, Sweden
 * hockeydb.com: Ornskoldsvik, Sweden
 * NHLPA: Sweden, ORNSKOLDSVIK

All commonly used as sources for hockey pages. This must demonstrate a common use/wide acceptance of that spelling in English. per WP:NCGN. I am sure I can dig up many more. Alaney2k (talk) 17:02, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * As was explained to you in a reply on a talk page, sites like these just show a laziness of web administrators to spell the names correctly. If you read the arcives in the hockey project page you will see that reliable sources for city names are atlases which spell the names with diacritics. If you wish to change consensus please take it to the hockey project and seek to change consensus instead of continually edit warring. -Djsasso (talk) 17:54, 22 December 2008 (UTC)


 * The roster articles are not about the cities, get it? The atlases are different. They are. I followed the policy. I showed wide usage. I don't believe it is laziness, that is your opinion. Alaney2k (talk) 18:11, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

More lazy websites:


 * ESPN.com
 * CBCSports.ca

How many before you admit your laziness argument doesn't hold any water? At least for the Sedins? Hmm?????????? Alaney2k (talk) 18:19, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * As long as they all got their media info from the same press kits. Is there a particular reason why you have to constantly pick a hot topic and fight about it when things finally die down. We have had diacritics on city names in the rosters for two years now. The hockey project actually came together and agreed to have them. But you choose to throw that consensus away because it doesn't suit you. -Djsasso (talk) 18:24, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * SHOW ME THE CITES !!!!!! Gothenburg is okay, why not Ornskoldsvik??? Stay on topic. I stayed with the Sedins. I did not go after every single diacritic on the page !!!!! Alaney2k (talk) 18:30, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I am currently working with the template to see if I can account for the sorting to a more agreable version. I don't feel like arguing anymore at the moment. -Djsasso (talk) 18:35, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

At first, I changed the Vancouver roster. I noticed that that roster had diacritics on the place names. The other 29 NHL teams did not. So I made the Canucks consistent with the others, believing the apparent evidence that the consensus was otherwise. Then Nurnsook went and changed all of them. It appeared to me as though he was going against the grain. I walked away, and today pointed out the Sedins. Separately, on my own talk page, I did a little rant in reply to GoodDay. You decided to argue on my talk page. You could not let the comments on my talk page pass. I believe that I am not 'starting things' in this case. Alaney2k (talk) 18:57, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I was referring more to the continued changing after you found out that Nurmsock was just reverting back to the original. Did you honestly expect me to let it pass when you said I was disagreeing with you just on principal? Anyways I am done. -Djsasso (talk) 19:01, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Who hid the diacritics from the city names, originally? Who ever did, I like his/her style (giggle giggle). GoodDay (talk) 19:32, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * CC hid them and Nurmsock reverted I believe and then A2K reverted him and then I reverted A2K and so on. -Djsasso (talk) 19:41, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Why do you deny that the common spelling in the English media, etc. is to not use the diacritics? That would be my argument as to where policy should follow. Using the unconventional spelling goes against the naming policy, goes against the naming of articles, and on and on and on. Of course, we don't have the resources to go that way. But we can try to stand on some firm ground and not this quicksand which you are happy to stand in. Alaney2k (talk) 20:03, 22 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Who originally hid them from the 29 other Roster Templates (I'm too lazy to check)? GoodDay (talk) 20:04, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Lazy, huh. Are you the NHL.com webmaster? You already like me so I won't admit to hiding them along with the cookies. They started with this season, you don't have to be that motivated to take a look.... Alaney2k (talk) 20:29, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This actually came into effect August 2007 or so when the original diacritics compromise came into effect. It was part of that massive debate when GoodDay and others threatened to leave over the mess. -Djsasso (talk) 21:02, 22 December 2008 (UTC)


 * When I was going through putting the diacritics back into the roster templates, it seemed that most were originally removed by Ccwaters, who self-admittedly thought that was the consensus, so I'm going to assume good faith on those edits. It was explained to CC why this was the case through links to the consensus reached at WP:HOCKEY and the overall Wikipedia policy (see here). Then, Alaney2k went and undid all of my policy-following edits (oh the frustration!) only to have those edits reverted by Djsasso to the proper format, and then now of course we have a mini edit war on our hands. Alaney2k, you're not going to win this battle. Overall Wikipedia policy is against you on this one. The number one reference for geographical locations are atlases and map books. You used Gothenburg as an example; however, that doesn't apply in our situation as Gothenburg is the direct English translation of Göteborg, much like Munich -> München, or Rome -> Roma. Örnsköldsvik is the English way of spelling it. The name comes from a guy who's name was spelt that way, and at no point in time have any atlases gone ahead and said..."Hey, why don't we just drop the umlauts from the O's and make them COMPLETELY DIFFERENT LETTERS." The thing is, like Djsasso has been repeating, umlauts are completely different letters. You can't just take them off. It would be like saying..."Hey John, I don't like your name in my language, so I'm going to call you Mohv. Yeah, I'll just replace that 'J' and 'n' because those aren't letters in my language." Now, Mohv may be a friggen sweet name, and I probably would be ok with it, but all kidding aside, it's wrong. You can't just make up your own word and say it's right. The fact is, any geographical location on Wikipedia (or most anyways) have their Wikipedia page name the way it should be. There should never be any hiding of diacritics as most page names with diacritics have gone through this exact argument to get the page name it warrants. This is just getting childish to the point where it is eventually going to have to be taken to mediation. And who do you think they will side with? Wikipedia policy or make-believe words? It's so frustrating to edit articles to the point where they meet policy, but then to have someone who thinks they are finding loopholes revert these proper edits. Honestly, this is the reason why good editors leave Wikipedia. The whole reason we came up with our own set of guidelines at WP:HOCKEY was to make a compromise where everyone had something to make them happy. People were going to start dropping like flies from our project, but fortunately, we made this compromise. So why do you keep brining it up? It was a done topic months ago. – Nurmsook!  talk...  20:31, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Feel better? Alaney2k (talk) 20:41, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Just curious. Why is the discussion being held here, when it effect all 30 Templates? GoodDay (talk) 20:46, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Do we really want Dj and Nurmsook ranting all over the place? I was under the mistaken impression that the consensus was not to use the non-english characters. Today, I was trying to make the point that Ornskoldvik is the common widely accepted spelling. Who cares what is correct? Dj and Nurmsook can't seem to see that.Alaney2k (talk) 20:53, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I fought this topic out with Dj & Krm500 'bout over a year ago at Hockey WikiProject. Had an edit rage & nearly got myself blocked (I wasn't reported, thanks to Dj's patients). Try not to get blocked, Al. GoodDay (talk) 20:58, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * We are an encyclopedia, what is correct is the whole point of an encyclopedia. -Djsasso (talk) 21:02, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This is hopeless. Honestly, we came to that consensus all that time ago to avoid these situations. Can't you just accept that hockey does not trump world spelling? While it may be spelt that way on NHL.com, like DJ said, all of these websites get their info from the same media kit. I've answered your question with Gothenburg and Ornskoldvik above. Like I said, Gothenburg is a dirct translation, Örnsköldsvik is not. Whatever the Wikipeida article title is, goes. Those titles come from atlases, the number one source for geographical locations. We have a consensus, we don't need to bring this up again. – Nurmsook!  talk...  21:03, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * It is not about being correct, it's about evidence. Show some that we use Örnsköldsvik in english media. (I mean that rhetorically.) We don't. I don't want to open the pandora's box. That is what I was accused of. I am just now trying to show the hypocrisy going on. I don't need the attention. Sheesh Alaney2k (talk) 21:11, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, you'd be wrong to think we don't., , , ...Happy? – Nurmsook!  talk...  21:24, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. That's what it is about. I was hoping that the Hockey News' page for Sedin would also spell it that way, but I guess they are lazy too.Sedin page So, there would be no common, consensus on Ornskoldsvik's english spelling. Then it would go back to the home town spelling. That is how I would interpret the policy. (never mind the compromise) Idealism, bah. Alaney2k (talk) 21:41, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I AM the one that's been "HIDING" them on rosters and I've been doing it for well over a year (maybe 2 or 3). There was nothing covert about it, just part of my maintenance (which has been lacking recently) and I thought I was following the norm (no diacritics on league pages). They get added it from time to time from wandering IP users and what not just like whenever player X gets scratched for the flu, someone flips on the injured reserve flag. This was the first time a WP:HOCKEY regular noticed it and acted against it. ccwaters (talk) 21:28, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, then I commend you, sir. I enjoyed the hiding, while it lasted. GoodDay (talk) 21:31, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Here, here, "death to all humans." Alaney2k (talk) 21:33, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * So here I am, standing in the middle of yet another diacritics debate, yet no one as EVER EVER taken me up on the challenge after 3 or 4 years: Show me examples of Swedish hockey publications reporting on Czech subjects while obeying Czech alphabetic rules and VICE-VERSA and I'll switch teams. That's all, no further input. ccwaters (talk) 21:44, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately I can't speak either language or I would. But I think I have an idea. I will try something. One moment. -Djsasso (talk) 21:48, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Here's a Swedish athletics website which uses diacritics in Slovakia's Dubnica nad Váhom . This Czech NHL site uses diacritics in Örnsköldsvik . – Nurmsook!  talk...  22:02, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I didn't know Swedish javelin throwers wear the same uniforms as the beach volleyballers. (the first link). The first link is not a hockey publication. He's still on our side. No cigar. :-) Alaney2k (talk) 22:09, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I found a few examples of Jagr being spelled with czech dios in finish and swedish however, not being able to read the content I can't verify strength of the sources. -Djsasso (talk) 22:18, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Send me the links and I'll be happy to do it! Here is one Finnish publication using Swedish language while obeying Czech alphabetic rules. —Krm500 (Communicate!) 00:03, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

I don't really want to resurrect this discussion, but I do want to take the opportunity to point out one thing that still, despite all these ages of the Diacritic Wars, baffles me completely: "So here I am, standing in the middle of yet another diacritics debate, yet no one as EVER EVER taken me up on the challenge after 3 or 4 years: Show me examples of Swedish hockey publications reporting on Czech subjects while obeying Czech alphabetic rules and VICE-VERSA and I'll switch teams. That's all, no further input." (ccwaters's comment from above) Why? Why on earth is this? What difference can this possibly make to the English-language Wikipedia? How does the way Swedish publications spell Czech names have any impact at all on how names are spelled on English Wikipedia? I sincerely, honestly, cannot understand what you are saying here. Elrith (talk) 07:04, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Troy Stecher
I think it's time for us to add him to the roster (and make his name invisible if he doesn't make the team) and create a page for him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TheMeaningofFun (talk • contribs) 19:28, 7 October 2016 (UTC)