User talk:Information yes

Welcome to Wikipedia
John Vandenberg (chat) 09:34, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Talk pages
Hi and thanks for your work on Wikipedia. I thought I'd mention to you that there is no manual of style covering talk pages and therefore no requirement that section headings follow any particular style of capitalization. Sometimes, people become upset when they notice someone has changed the section titles of their posts on talk pages and hopefully you can avoid that, plus save some time. Thanks again. Wildhartlivie (talk) 06:44, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Susan Atkins & SSDI at ancestry.com
The problem with adding in the reference link that goes to the search page for the SSDI at ancestry.com is that WP:ELNO expressly forbids using external links to search pages and to my knowledge, there is no way to retain the page. Plus, when I run the search for this person, I come up with one Edward J. Atkins, whose social security number was issued in New York and who died in Richmond Virginia. How do you know this is the father of Susan Atkins and where did you find that specific information that led you to believe this is the same person? Wildhartlivie (talk) 19:05, 26 September 2009 (UTC)


 * This biography Susan Denise Atkins which is well-written; not sensational, speculative or gossipy, which I added and which has since been removed, states her father died in late 1981. He is the only entry on the SSDI that fits that date - all the other Edward J Atkins' listed died years earlier or years later. He was very relevant to her life, and hence to her biography; the article benefits from the information about him that I added. Information yes (talk) 01:09, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Mansonfamilytoday.info doesn't meet the Wikipedia criteria for external sources. In case you hadn't noticed, an administrator came through and removed all those types of links from a large number of articles because they are self-published sources (published privately by private individuals with no indication of third party source checking) and therefore can't be used. Perhaps there is an Edward J. Atkins that comes on the death index search, but a) it is a search database which is forbidden by policy and b) there is no way of factually knowing that it in fact is Atkins's father. I'm not arguing with you about whether her father's name, or his death, is irrelevant, I'm stating that this type of reference isn't permitted, it isn't clear that it is her father and such content needs to be cited to a reliable source.

The SSDI also has the entry for her ex-husband. He is the only Donald Laisure listed, and he has the correct middle initial L. There is no list of results there, just his entry on its own. I cannot see why that info should not be added. Readers of her article will want to know what happened to people who were closely connected to her. Information yes (talk) 01:16, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Same issue. A link to the SSDI isn't an acceptable source, and if it were, there is still no way to use direct results from the search engine, it doesn't produce a returnable link. None of this has to do with what readers want to know, what is or is not relevant, or what benefits any given item of information lends to the article. The issue regards reliable sourcing, which doesn't include original research, which by definition includes drawing conclusions based on a death year and running a search on the social security death index that this is when someone in specific was born and died. We must reference content to reliable sources, that is the issue. Then there is the issue of how do you know that this is the same person to whom Atkins was married? How do we know that it is the only Donald L. Laisure that was ever born, not every single person everywhere who lived, or died, is on the SSDI. I have found references in court filings databases discussing the conviction of a Donald Lee Laisure, Sr. for credit card fraud. There's a Donald L. Laisure who was a Coast Guard officer. There's a Donald Laisure Sr. who was a complete fraud, who seems to have been married to Atkins, but doesn't appear to be dead according to this story. It's too speculative and why reliable sources are mandated. Wildhartlivie (talk) 20:45, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

2009 in sports
Hi. A decision was taken earlier this year by WP:SPORTS to remove births and deaths sections from articles in this series. You can see the discussion at this page. We do not record births at all in these articles while deaths are limited to very significant and preferably current performers within the section covering his or her sport (e.g., if a current world champion dies suddenly, that should be included in the sport's section). The project noted that there had been a proliferation of births and deaths which were swamping the articles and some of the examples quoted, such as the volleyball player whose team finished ninth at the Olympics, are quite ludicrous in the context of these articles. I've therefore removed the deaths section from this article. If you think any of them deserve special mention per the above, please add it to the individual sport. Jack | talk page 04:23, 15 October 2009 (UTC)