User talk:Lukex115

Welcome
Hello, Lukex115, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the New contributors' help page, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type   and your question on this page, and someone will show up shortly to answer. Here are a few good links for newcomers: We hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on talk and vote pages using four tildes, like this: &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126;. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! CT Cooper · &#32;talk 15:03, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
 * The Five Pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Editing tutorial
 * Picture tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Naming conventions
 * Manual of Style

MedCab case
Just so you know, an application for mediation has been made with you listed as an involved party at Mediation Cabal/Cases/2011-08-29/Eurovision Song Contest 2012. CT Cooper · &#32;talk 18:48, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

About the JESC 2011 song list
Good work with editing the song titles in compliance with the official song list published by the EBU. However, you didn't need to list the same reference in all 14 songs, as it is redundant. Next time, if you want to list the same reference in every line of a column, place it in the header. Cheers, Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:17, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Ah, ok, thanks for the hint. :D Lukex115 (talk) 19:18, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


 * I have noticed constant reverts by yourself on edits made by Madlen T. I'm not sure if you are aware, but the list that is published on JuniorEurovision.tv, has been purposely published using the English translation for each song (with exception to the Belgian entry for some unknown reason).  It is a known fact that all songs in JESC are performed in the native language, and should therefore be shown in the main article list as that of the native language, with English translation shown next to it (in the column provided).  A list of song titles are also shown via here if this helps.  Thanks - Wesley Mouse (talk) 16:58, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Negative. The official song list is the one published by the EBU: It features the versions of the winning songs that each broadcaster sent, and apparently most broadcasters have changed their song's title to one with a bit more "mass appeal". They are not translated in English. Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:10, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * (EC) Sorry to say, but incorrect. The official rules for Junior Eurovision, which are also stipulated on the JESC article on Wikipedia, states strictly, that all songs must be written and sung in the national language (or one of the national languages) of the country being represented.  Therefore, the list on each contest would include the song titles in both native language, as well as English translation.  The EBU list for previous contest have always shown native language,  But for whatever reason, they have decided to publish the list for 2011, using the English translations.  Consistency should be kept throughout, year after year.  Notability is vital.  Wesley Mouse (talk) 17:15, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The EBU lists the songs exactly how the broadcasters send them, just like every year. The language rule has nothing to do with that. The website does not mention any "English translation" (and the "translated" titles are far from being accurate translations), so it would be best if we sticked to that. Unless you want to argue with a primary source...-Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:24, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Now that I looked at the EBU-published song list once more, i notice that only five songs (Russia, Latvia, Bulgaria, Ukraine and the Netherlands) are "translated". Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:28, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

It is a known fact, as in previous years of JESC, that ALL songs MUST be performed in the native language (or one of the national languages) at the contest finals. There has never been the case of each nation changing their song title into English translation for the sake of the final for JESC. In the main Eurovision, there is no language rule - however in JESC there is. I'm not sure why the EBU have decided to publish the full list using English translations only - but when you read each subsequent article on the EBU site, you will see that each song being sent to Armenia is being performed in the native language of the representing nation. I'm not arguing the fact that EBU is a primary source - but even a primary source is known to publish "typo" errors from time to time. Nobody is perfect. But the rules - set by the EBU are the ones that stand really. And if the EBU strictly state that songs MUST be performed in a native language, then the list should also show that. There is nothing wrong in showing both native and English versions in the article, using the sourcing from EBU and ESCDaily in the respective columns. Wesley Mouse (talk) 17:31, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Have you checked the song titles on the ESCDaily site? I don't think that Armenia's national language is English, but their song is called "Welcome to Armenia". Same with Moldova and "No no". Same with Georgia and "Candy Music". So that kind of defeats your argument. Besides, the language rule is applicable to songs, not song titles. The point is that five broadcasters decided to change their song titles, for whatever reason, and they are fully entitled to do that. Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:41, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Please provide sources for each respective broadcaster, that shows they have decided to change the song titles into English. Until then, then the official JESC rules about native language remains.  There are no sources (apart from the English translation list from EBU) that shows song titles being changed.  Wesley Mouse (talk) 17:44, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Firstly, you never answered my question. Secondly, provide sources that the song titles published by the EBU are translated into English. Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 17:46, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * You never asked a question technically, only a questionable comment, in which you followed on by answering it yourself (which I found a little bizarre in all honesty). As for providing a source that states the EBU have published an English translation only.  You only need to view the history of previous contests to see that native languages are always used - not to forget the official rules, which are very much covered by WP:N.  Unless there is something that shows the rules have been changed, then we are not to assume they have just by viewing a list, which could easily be published into English translation for the sake of the majority of readers.  Like I said previously, who are we to question the reasons as to why the EBU have chosen to publish in a different way than in previous years.  facts are fact at the end of the day, and sticking to WP:N is by far more important, than to provide semi-incorrect details in an article.  Wesley Mouse (talk) 17:52, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * So you say that after eight years of the EBU posting the "correct" song titles, this year they suddenly decided to translate them "for the sake of the majority of readers"? And not all of them, but just five songs? - leaving "untranslated" songs like Belgium (which yourself noted as strange), Ukraine, FYR Macedonia, Belarus and Sweden? - leaving Lithuania with the translated title in brackets (?!?!) - poorly translating the Dutch song as "Teenager" ("Ik been en teenager" means "I am a teenager") and the Russian song as "Romeo and Juliet" (instead of "Like Romeo and Juliet") - while never mentioning a single thing about translating the song titles in English? This goes beyond the usual "typo" error, i'm afraid.


 * Forgive me for using sarcasm, but i doupt you'll get my point some other way. And I think we should involve again, because yet another discussion between us goes nowhere. Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 18:13, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

I have to agree with Kosm1fent; as he has stated, only 5 countries song titles have been translated. Why would EBU choose to produce a list with only a certain selection of song titles translated to English? We have a source there which shows that some song titles have been translated to English, do you have any source to say that this is a typo by the EBU? Yes, songs must be performed in their native language, but there is no rule which states that the title of the song must also be in the native language. I say that since the EBU have published this list themselves, it should be one of the most appropriate sources for the song titles. Lukex115 (talk) 18:27, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * It isn't that "yet another discussion is going nowhere" Kosm1fent... it may be a case of miscommunication or even misunderstandings between us, which makes it appear like we are chasing each other in circles. On inspection of the official rules however, it does state the native language must be used, although the EBU and host broadcasters must refer to the song titles in English (as from 2006 onwards).  I do find it strange that 5 songs haven't been translated though.  Are the EBU taking drugs and confusing themselves (as well as others) with rules stating one thing, while they go about things in a completely different way.  Wesley Mouse (talk) 18:30, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * The EBU and host broadcasters must refer to the song titles in English? That definitely is not true, look at last year's song list. It contains many songs in a national language, as well as songs in English. E.g. Sweden's "Allt Jag Vill Ha", and Ukraine's "Mii Litak". Lukex115 (talk) 18:36, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm merely going off what I read, so please don't be uncivil by being patronising. Most ungracious of you.  What I find strange though, is the EBU list itself shows majority English song titles, yet each article for the winning songs from their NFs (also published by the EBU) show the titles in native language.  This list of native song titles is also published by ESCKaz.com (and they show their source as EBU), also ESCDaily.com show the same list of native titles.  Would it be causing too much harm to show the list using both native and English, so that we don't offend people from each respective country?  Wesley Mouse (talk) 18:40, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Uncivil? Patronising? I'm sorry but I don't understand where you've gotten that from whatsoever. Those articles are from a previous date, is it not possible that the song titles have been changed since then? Lukex115 (talk) 18:44, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I've got to agree on that last bit. The official song list wasn't published until last week (I would post the link to that article, but my browser is reporting Oikotimes as infected. Lovely) Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 18:47, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * In reply to Lukex, I do agree that it could be possible the song titles have changed, as things are constantly evolving every second of the day. So in hindsight, yes the EBU may have got a list of "new English translated" song titles.  BUt like I mentioned to Kosm1fent earlier and also on his talk page (and please allow me to quote myself).  "Working on articles isn't a war to prove who is better than the other. Editors are a unit, a team; and should try hard to work together, even if it means making compromises that we may or may not agree with. We must think for the majority of people who don't edit - the biggest part of readers who would rather read what we publish, rather than contribute. Remaining as neutral as possible is very vital when it comes to publishing any article to a high standard. Think about the wider audience, and not just the small team of editors on a project. For it is better to cover all angles, than to skip vital ones all together." Wesley Mouse (talk) 18:53, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes I agree with that quote, I'm not disputing that at all, I simply believe that we should trust the most reliable sources, and of course EBU is the most reliable when it comes to Eurovision. Perhaps it would be better to change the "Song" and "English translation" columns into "Song name in native language" and "Song name in English" or something similar? Lukex115 (talk) 19:00, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Now I like the sound of that idea Lukex, very plausible indeed. Worthy of a bright idea award, me thinks.  (I'll see if I can find one, and gift it to you in due course).  Having the columns labelled in that way is covering all angles, which in turn may allow both columns to remain constant and without further alterations, as we'd be covering all aspects from the start.  Wesley Mouse (talk) 19:05, 17 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Thank you, I shall get to work on that idea then! Glad we've found a common ground :) Lukex115 (talk) 19:23, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I concur. Very good compromise until the JESC news/fan sites or the EBU make up their mind, lol. Kosm1fent Won't you talk to me? 19:28, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

Nooo now I have that Bucks Fizz song stuck in my head, after reading "make their mind up". Oh dear, my feet are tapping in time to the song - help! I fear I may have to spring into dance mode LOL. Wesley Mouse (talk) 19:31, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

Well done!!!


 * Thank you so much! :D Lukex115 (talk) 19:39, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision: Discussion on the use of navigation templates
Hello,

There is currently a discussion ongoing at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Eurovision on the future use of navigation templates (navboxes) within Eurovision articles. The consequences of this discussion could have a large impact on how these templates are organized, named, and used in future, so all project members are invited to participate in the discussion.

You are receiving this message since you are listed as a member of WikiProject Eurovision. If you are no longer interested in contributing to Eurovision articles, please remove your username from this page.

Delivered by MessageDeliveryBot on behalf of WikiProject Eurovision at 15:26, 11 March 2012 (UTC).

Disambiguation link notification for April 4
Hi. When you recently edited Ja, må han leva!, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Swedish (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ* Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 14:30, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision: Discussion on recategorizing
Hello,

There is currently a discussion ongoing at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Eurovision on the proposal of recategorising following the rollout exercise of the new navigation templates (navboxes) within Eurovision articles. The consequences of this discussion could have a large impact on how articles are reorganized in future to provide an easier index system, so all project members are invited to participate in the discussion.

You are receiving this message since you are listed as a member of WikiProject Eurovision. If you are no longer interested in contributing to Eurovision articles, please remove your username from this page.

Delivered by MessageDeliveryBot on behalf of WikiProject Eurovision at 22:24, 24 April 2012 (UTC).

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - June 2012
Note: the Newsletter is "collapsed" for convenience. To see the full letter, click on the "show" button at the right end of the blue bar.

This Newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 00:16, 30 May 2012 (UTC). If you are no longer interested in WikiProject Eurovision then please remove your name from this list.

Project Eurovision RFC discussion reminder
WikiProject Eurovision: This is a reminder to all members of Project Eurovision, that there is still an ongoing RfC discussion taking place at the project talk page. It is vital that everyone participates in this discussion, as it concerns the future manual of style and article layout in regards to Eurovision Song Contest by Year and Junior Eurovision Song Contest by Year articles. This is your ideal opportunity to contribute suggestions and ideas on a major issue, which will reflect on the way these articles will be written in future. Thank You! EdwardsBot (talk) 14:11, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - July 2012
'''This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 18:23, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - August 2012
'''This newsletter was delivered on 19:42, 23 July 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision: Recent changes
Hello,

Please note that there have been some changes to operations surrounding Eurovision articles, these being that:


 * Template names have now been modernised and/or megred into super-templates, for example Countries in the Eurovision Song Contest has now been merged into Template:Eurovision Song Contest making it even easier to find everything under one template. If you are planning to create a new template, please keep the standardised titles in mind.  Other templates have been modernised and a full list of them can be found here.
 * The Eurovision Song Contest and Junior Eurovision Song Contest articles have now been standardised to keep a consitancy throughout the project and to the genral reader too. Skeleton article drafts can be found for Eurovision Song Contest by Year and Junior Eurovision Song Contest by Year.

If you have any questions, please ask at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Eurovision.

You are receiving this message since you are listed as a member of WikiProject Eurovision. If you are no longer interested in contributing to Eurovision articles, please remove your username from this page.

Delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 14:35, 12 August 2012 (UTC) on behalf of Project Eurovision

WP:Eurovision Newsletter (September 2012)
'''This newsletter was delivered by

Project Memorandum
This mini memorandum has been delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 13:51, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - October 2012
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 23:34, 26 September 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - November 2012
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 10:42, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - December 2012
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 22:09, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - January 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 15:50, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - February 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 12:34, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - March 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 04:06, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - April 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 16:00, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - May 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 14:15, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - June 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 12:16, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision - Memorandum
This memo was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 17:40, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - July 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 18:55, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - August 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 15:50, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - September 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 11:50, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - October 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 00:25, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - November 2013
This newsletter was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 16:35, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - Issue 40
This newsletter was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of 09:51, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision - consensus discussion
There is a discussion regarding colour coding on articles taking place on the project talk page that requires input from as many project members as possible. Thank you, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 21:16, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - Issue 41
This newsletter was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of 15:49, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - Issue 42
This newsletter was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of 08:37, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - Issue 43
This newsletter was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of 13:05, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Eurovision - Urgent Message
Dear Project Eurovision Member,

There is a serious discussion been created at the WikiProject Eurovision talk page that requires utmost attention from all, or as many members as possible, as this could bear a huge impact on the project as a whole. Please click here to read the discussion, and participate peacefully. Thank you. This message was delivered at 04:41, 23 November 2014 (UTC) by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of Project Eurovision Newsdesk

WikiProject Eurovision Newsletter - Issue 44
This newsletter was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk), on behalf of 18:12, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Notice of WikiProject Eurovision inactivity
 WikiProject Eurovision inactivity notice for Lukex115! As part of our commitment to improve collaborations within WikiProject Eurovision we have now started to undergo annual checks for membership activity. Upon checking it appears that you have been inactive for more than 12 months, and we are sorry to see that you have not contributed and hope that you decide to return to Wikipedia in the near future. In the meantime in order to cease the receipt of any further correspondence from the project whilst you are inactive, we have removed your details from our members list. If you would like to rejoin the project upon your return to Wikipedia, then please feel free to re-add your details to this list.

We would like to take this opportunity to thank you for your contributions throughout your time with WikiProject Eurovision, and hope that you return to active editing in the near future. Regards! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 08:37, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

This message was delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 08:37, 8 January 2015 (UTC)