Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Sunderland A.F.C. managers


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by User:The Rambling Man 06:51, 10 July 2008.

List of Sunderland A.F.C. managers
This is a list I have based of several other manager lists, such as; List of Ipswich Town F.C. managers and List of York City F.C. managers. All managers have been listed, including caretakers, and I believe it satisfies the FL criteria. I will be willing to address the comments post haste, although I will be away for the next week. Thanks a bunch. Sunderland06 (talk) 21:32, 30 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Support Looks pretty good. Perhaps "None" can be lowercased, though, so it is not confused as a name; it can also even be replaced with an en dash (–). Gary King ( talk ) 22:31, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Cheers mate, I'll lower case it.


 * Just two comments
 * Those dates without days should be unwikilinked and rmv the commas, e.g. August 1888 not August, 1888. See WP:DATE Done
 * Restored dts2 template to the incomplete dates so that they sort properly; the template displays them wikilinked. Struway2 (talk)
 * The winning percentages should all have the same accuracy. Even those 50per cent should be 50.0 not 50. Done Peanut4 (talk) 20:46, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Also done for 0.0. Struway2 (talk)


 * Comment The first row of the table gives the date of the club's formation as 1979! - ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:10, 2 July 2008 (UTC) Done :-) Struway2 (talk) 08:09, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Support. The only thing I'd like to see is maybe changing the "none"s to en dashes.  Otherwise it looks good!  Malinaccier (talk) 02:46, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Cheers for the support, and I've changed it to endashes.


 * Comment You might consider abbreviating Matches/Won/Drawn/Lost to M/W/D/L and adding a key line above (as here). At the moment, for me on a 1024-width screen, several of the names and a couple of the flag/country entries are wrapping to two lines; reducing the width of the M/W/D/L columns would cure that without making the figures unclear to read. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 07:41, 6 July 2008 (UTC) Done - Changed columns and added key, thanks a bunch mate.


 * Support Meets the FL criteria, though if the prose isn't quite "professional", blame my copyediting. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 07:25, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Cheers for the support, you've been a big help. Sunderland06  (talk) 14:28, 8 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Comments
 * "Sunderland Association Football Club was founded in 1879. After turning professional in 1886, the club appointed Tom Watson as their first manager..." discretionary plural old chestnut warning. Just starts off badly for me, "...was founded... " vs. "their manager..." - I'd be sorely tempted to say the club "were" founded, although that upsets some of our US readers and the old grammar-warrior.  Right now it feels clunky.
 * That bit of wording's mine, so it's only fair I reply. English plural says that A number of words like army, company, ... may refer either to a single entity or the members of the set that compose it. Thus, as H. W. Fowler describes, in British English they are "treated as singular or plural at discretion" As I see it, SAFC the "single entity" was founded, but the members of that entity combine to appoint their manager. Struway2 (talk) 17:53, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, fine, still reads clunkily to a "traditional" reader like me, but no big deal. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:05, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Matter of taste, I think. I can't get my head round "Template Football Club are an English football club", but I've seen that used. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 18:13, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * And I guess it's only fair to ask why Stat Cat is a WP:RS?
 * The nominator Sunderland06 is having computer trouble at the moment and has asked me to keep an eye on the FLC and answer any outstanding questions, so I'll do my best. Having little interest in Sunderland AFC, I'm not well acquainted with StatCat, but it contains match results and team sheets for all competitions going back to the club's foundation, and appears at least as reliable as any other relevant source, including the club official site. I happened to check one of the caretaker managers, George Hardwick. Sunderland AFC official site has him "manager for one season" while StatCat has him appointed in November 1968 (three months into the season) with his first game in charge on Saturday 14 November. The Times (via The Times Digital Archive, most UK residents can access via their local library) confirms his appointment in their edition of Monday 16 November. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 22:22, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Otherwise, it looks A1. The Rambling Man (talk) 17:35, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.