Talk:A. R. Rahman/Archive 1

Archive 1

Comment

His new music from film robot should be added in discography

Artistic merits of his works

Thanks for the in Bold textformative entry. One point. This article seems to express a contested opinion about the artistic merits of his works. Opinions on the Wikipedia should be attributed to somebody of relevance. See Wikipedia:Neutral point of view, specifically the section on creative works. --Robert Merkel 05:10, 29 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Rahman's conversion into Islam

The article says his family converted to Islam post his father's death when his mother remarried to a Muslim. However there is no reference for this provided. As far as my knowledge goes, one of Rahman's close relatives fell sick and a Sufi saint apparently cured that person and impressed by the Sufi Saint, and as an act of gratitude, the family changed religion. Precambrian84 (talk) 14:03, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

His mother, Kareema Begum, who raised him since age 9, was from a Muslim family. See interview at [1]

When did you convert to Islam?

Since I had been struggling from such a tender age, for sometime afterwards I stopped believing in God. But later when I stabilised myself the concept of God in Islam was very appealing. So I and my whole family converted to Islam. This was around 1989. Anyway my mother was from a Muslim family. Family probelms and the need for peace of mind made me convert.

He is very devoted to his mother. During the OSCARs he said[2]:

There’s a dialogue from a Hindi film called “Mere paas ma hai,” which means “I have nothing but I have a mother,” so mother’s here, her blessings are there with me.

--ISKapoor (talk) 20:07, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

His religion has been edited to be Sufism instead of Islam. Sufism is the spiritual dimension of Islam and is not a religion in its own right. Furthermore, the reference indicates that he is observant of the rituals of orthodox Islam such as prayer and Hajj. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.100.50.121 (talk) 15:31, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

He has described himself as a Sufi Muslim so I think for information, its inclusion is warranted. Clubover (talk) 16:33, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Text was changed to Sufi Islam. This is important because there is Sufism is not a religion in it's own right but a part of orthodox Islam. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.100.50.121 (talk) 18:09, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

There is no such thing as "Sufi Islam". Also, lots of non-Muslims adhere to some form of Sufism, but they may not be identified as Muslims. Rahman on the other hand is a self-identified Muslim. Implying that he's a "Sufist" gives the impression that he may not be a Muslim. Hence the implication of him "converting to Sufism" is unnecessary.

Just wish to check, were all of his sisters converted to Islam? I think one did not convert (G.V. Prakash's mother) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ckannan90 (talk • contribs) 15:29, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Referencing

Please provide sources of reference wherever possible. Splashprince 09:47, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Far greater effort can be put into referencing. Better sources of reference than just Internet websites (such as books or academic journals or reputable newspaper articles) can be found to substantiate information regarding this artist. AppleJuggler 16:02, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

A start would be searching through www.scholar.google.com. See the following: http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=A.R.+Rahman+music&btnG=Search&hl=en&lr=. AppleJuggler 16:07, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Comments for action

The following paragraph seems extremely biased and does not seem to have a strong backing evidence to it:

"In fact Ilayaraaja made Tamil people (who were listening Hindi songs) to listen Tamil Songs, where as A. R. Rahman made Hindi people(who were listening Hindi songs) to listen Tamil Songs. Another point worth noting is that while Ilayaraaja brought western music in Indian Instruments, A. R. Rahman pioneered the art of composing Indian classical Carnatic and Hindustani Music and using western Instruments to play those tunes"

As pointed out by the anonymous editor above, the statement regarding AR Rahman pioneering the art of composing Indian classical music with Western instruments, and its comparison with the work of Ilaiyaraja is suspect and unsubstantiated. Unless this can be supported by evidence, I believe this comment should be removed. Splashprince 13:14, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

The first sentence is actually a fact. It is also a fact that sales of Hindi Cinema Cassattes dipped greatly in Tamil Nadu after Ilayaraja's entry into Tamil Cinema (in 1980s only Hindi cassattes were selling only in CHennai). Every one knows that ARRahman is the first Tamil (nor non-Hindi music director to rule Bollywood. The second is hard to prove with references but any one who knows the composition of songs like இளைய நிலா பொழிகிறது and கண்ணோடு காண்பதெல்லாம் நில்ல் agree with that.  Doctor Bruno  03:01, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Rahman's ethnicity

The article says Rahman is Tamilian. It is widely understood that he is in fact Malayalee. Can somebody confirm this ?

-- Um, im pretty much certain hes Tamil. His dad just worked in the Malayalam film industry, as many tamils have done in the past. Also, as far as I know it is widely understood that Rahman is in fact Tamil (not mallu). --

--Well,it is a fact that he is tamil...because he said it in an interview in a telugu channel.He does not know malyalam except for his father that to because he worked in that industry. Moreover he is a mudhaliar by birth.Mudhaliars are a tamil caste. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.194.62.100 (talk) 09:06, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

He is a malayalee, born and brought up in Kerala. He is married to Malayalam actor Rehman's Wife's sister. His first film was Yodha in Malayala, but the first film released was Roja. In yodha his name as Music Director was Dileep. His mother and sisters still talk Malayalam.

He is NOT a malayalee. He is a tamilian by birth. His father worked for Malayalam Industry. His first film was also a telugu movie [as stated by himself in an Interview], but Roja preceded in release. In the award ceremony, he said "I want to say something in Tamil, 'Ellapugazhum Iraivanuke..!'" which means All credits go to God [Allah].

Yes now it is a fact that he is a Tamilan because of the Oscars. Obviously he wouldn't say that if he wasn't a Tamilan since that award had nothing to do with Tamil. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.55.244 (talk) 22:38, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Well I dont' know why some ppl say Rahman and Kamal Haasan as malayalees. It is a known fact that he was born in a Mudaliar family. Who told he was born and brought up at Kerala. Its universally known that he was born in Chennai and brought up at Chennai and Hyderabad. His father was a composer of malayalam films that too based in Chennai. And if Yodha was his first film, why he wants to credit Mani Ratnam. --Thalapathi (Ping Back) 12:24, 19 April 2011 (UTC)

A.R.Rahman is a Palghat Iyer Brahmin who migrated to Chennai. His name was Dilip & he also studied in the famous Padma Sheshadri School where Brahmin Students were dominant. Source: http://www.timesofpondicherry.com/index.php?view=article&catid=41%3Aartsliterary&id=79%3Aanna-moi-a-franco-vietnamese-author&format=pdf&option=com_content&Itemid=78. Since his family hails from Palghat his father could have worked for Malayalam movies.

Merge

Most articles written by Indians will have these same problems. Indians tend to write their opinion and expect the same of others. Claims that sound like the one you pointed out above are very common. It is merely a way of conv eying the impact of A.R's influence on Indian music consumers. This is how we are taught in school. It is a rare Indian who can put aside opinion and state facts as they stand. Here I offer just an explanation. Being Indian myself, I don't really see a solution to this.

Personal information of Rahman

Taken from Gopal's ARR page. Should this updated further, or left alone? Should this even be in at all? Also need to verify on which of the sisters is Rehana, the music director. unni 01:34, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Hi there! Can anyone verify whether A.R Rahman went to Trinity College of Music in London or Trinity College in Oxford? I have found out that the university in Oxford doesn't do Music at all and that one is not a Music college as well. I was pretty sure that A.R went to London but since the reference was quoted, I checked the Trinity College's (oxford) website. Not only that, the wikipedia article on Trinity college of Music's article also provides that Rahman went to London's. (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity_College_of_Music#Notable_past_pupils) Thanks a lot --Nirmarun (talk) 16:35, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

There is an interview of A.R. Rahman on a radio show in which he said he has never left India for his musical education. He obtained a Trinity College of Music certificate in Keyboard, but this was done completely in Chennai. Most people around you who say they are grade 8 piano etc are pursuing a Trinity course or a similar course, and this can be done in most countries without going to England. I will try to find the interview and reference it here. Ckannan90 (talk) 15:34, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks a lot Ckannan90... Yh.. I do see what you mean, even I myself did 5 grades on keyboard under trinity college but not in chennai but in pondicherry... it will be really good if you could provide the evidence. Many people (including me) believe that ARR, Harris etc came to London to qualify degree. And thanks again for editing it. --Nirmarun (talk) 23:04, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Yodha, 1992

• Karthik.raman 04:23, 17 July 2006 (UTC): Can anyone confirm that this is ARR's first film? The edit is unsourced and I am a bit doubtful...

I would say go ahead and remove it. Every source, including Gopal's ARR page indicates that Roja was the first movie by ARR. - unni 20:31, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Roja was released on Aug 15, 1992. Yodha came out on Sep 04, 1992. Unless he was signed 1st for Yodha, Roja should be recorded as his debut in movies. Mostly Clueless (talk) 11:57, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

I think Yoddha was the Rahman's first film to have been released. I am a little confused by some of the dates. Yoddha was released in 1992 April-May timeframe. Roja came later, around the Sept-Oct timeframe. It is possible that Roja was the first film that he composed music for (though it released later). Need some supporting information on this, especially reference for the date of release claimed above. - User:Anandkmoorthy 18:06, 13 Jan 2008

Yodha was certified on 28th August, 1992. Roja was certified on 14th August, 1992. (Walrabbit (talk) 15:28, 26 January 2009 (UTC))

Kindly refer Malayalasangeetham.info. This site is done keeping a DB of Malayalam songs by senior Professionals in the field. It very clearly says that Penpada 1975 as Rahman's first work. This is confirmed by greats like K. J Yesudas. http://www.malayalasangeetham.info/secure/MalayalaSangeetham/MasterLyrics/3602.html. I think when organizations like Guiness Records, give value for the informations provided by people like KJY, this should be considered authentic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.192.225.93 (talk) 10:28, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Asian Mozart

It is common to refer to the person by nickname or other names. See Gavaskar where the name Sunny is in the lead paragraph. See Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel where the Iron man is in the lead paragraph  Doctor Bruno  02:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Aamir and Rahman

Is it true Aamir Khan and A R Rahman joined hand for Film?Guddu 06:33, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Foundation

The section I've just edited contained the same information about six different ways -- I've tried to edit it down to the essential information expressed just once. Accounting4Taste 23:17, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Attention recent editor:

Thank you for the enormous amount of work you have done on the A. R. Rahman page. This is obviously a subject that you find of great interest and you have brought a good deal of information to the article.

However, you have also introduced a lot of material that needs a considerable amount of work, and you should be aware that, until this work is done, your efforts are in danger of being removed by the next editor who sees them. Here are the areas that now need to be worked on:

1. You have introduced a large number of quotations to the article. Every single one of those quotations now needs to have a reference to its source so that anyone who reads the article can identify where the quotations come from. A couple of resources for citing are WP:CITE, Wikipedia:Citation templates.

2. The article needs to be divided up into logical sections, and the sections have to be identified with headings in the Wikipedia style.

3. The article needs to have your opinion material removed. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a fan magazine. Any material that is your opinion about how good this artist is has to go -- unless it is something that you are quoting from a respected third-party source, in which case, as per item 1 above, it needs a reference to that source. I will make a start on that by removing the paragraph you titled "Introduction", which was 100% opinion. Opinion material must be removed right down to individual words -- for instance, in Wikipedia, people do not "drool", they "say". Suggesting that they "drool" means that you are offering your opinion about how they meant what they said.

4. This article now contains an enormous amount of information, and some of this information might be more properly found in articles about other things, people, events, etc. Essentially, the article needs to be edited down to the essential information.

5. The article needs to be Wikified -- any time there is a mention of another person, film, award, et cetera, there should be a link to another page within Wikipedia (such as the links in item 1 above).

My advice is for you to (1) open an account within Wikipedia so that your editing can be identified with you, (2) go through the tutorial material within Wikipedia so you learn more about the topics I've mentioned above, and (3) complete the job you have started so that this article meets Wikipedia's standards. Since the article presently has such enormous amounts of work necessary, and doesn't meet Wikipedia standards for style and content, someone might remove your changes and "revert" the article back to where it was before, which would be the appropriate thing to do, so I recommend that you start this process quickly.

If you have any questions, I'll try to help as best I can, and you can contact me through my talk page -- which is one of the things you need to learn about. Accounting4Taste 06:02, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

This is unreadable

I'm considering just deleting that horrible chunk of text in the first section. Can someone convince me to take an hour to reorganise it? Because otherwise it's going very soon. --poorsod^talk 15:23, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

See my comments above -- yes, it's definitely not Wikistyled. If the author wants it kept, s/he should be working away at it or expect to find it gone. I wouldn't delete it, though; you might just move it to the talk page so it can be reorganized, edited down, and the quotes sourced. There may be worthwhile nuggets in the mass of unrefined ore. Accounting4Taste 16:30, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

I have removed all of the user's additions. The additions do not conform to a number of Wikipedia policies, and it appears some of the details are copyright violations (I took passages of material and found them to be identical to material found online). Nishkid64 (talk) 21:48, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

In that case, I completely support your removing the material. I was just vainly hoping that there was something there that might be useful to someone, I guess. (And I didn't have the courage to read it through, let alone check it for copyvio, so thanks.) Accounting4Taste 22:15, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

The language in the Biography section is terribly complex and staggering, probably too much so for the average reader to stay focused. Sentence structure should be straightened out a bit. We can't have sections like "...piano, in addition to, among others, the synthesizer,..." Dragu (talk) 07:26, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Number of recordings sold

I looked into the claim in the first paragraph and I don't think it's even "arguably" correct, so removed it. Madonna has sold more than 200 million albums according to Wikipedia, double what's claimed for this artist, and the Beatles have sold one billion units (one thousand million). Accounting4Taste 18:50, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

This claim has re-appeared and rather than just revert it, I did some further research, both in Wikipedia and on the net in general. According to Wikipedia, this artist is not in the top ten but is "arguably" in the top 25, and considering the claims for "number of cassettes" may well be in the top 15, but cannot be considered to be in the top 10. The second citation in this article suggests that this artist has outsold both Madonna and Britney Spears put together -- but if you read it carefully, it is in number of cassettes sold, which is almost certainly true but ignores the number of CDs and downloads.

I don't make any claims one way or the other, and if someone has reliable information that proves the number of sales for this artist, I'll certainly acquiesce in whatever claims are advanced. Accounting4Taste 18:18, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

The word "superhit" is essentially meaningless, as are any other grandiose qualifications that do not have numerical associations. If you wish to add qualifications to this article, and you mean them to be useful, then instead of adding meaningless words like "superhit" you could go to the extent of finding out exactly, or approximately, what numbers of sales are associated with specific projects and adding that information for other people's use. Wikipedia is not a fan magazine. Accounting4Taste 17:04, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Also known as Allah Rakha Rahman?

He is is famous as "AR Rahman" he is not "also known" as by that name. it just happens to be that his birth name is differnt.

--12.152.10.63 18:23, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Recent edits to A. R. Rahman article

HE IS THE MOZART OF THE WORLD. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.96.226.16 (talk) 19:20, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

The wiki pages for all academy nominated / winning artistes begin with "an academy nominated / winning". Made changes to reflect this consistence. Please see talk for more. The edit was reverted with a comment saying "gives too much importance to the academy". I feel this is a personal opinion and should not interfere with the consistence wrt other academy nominees / winners.

kgomadam 03:49, 24 February 2009 (UTC) Karthik kgomadam 03:49, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

A user keeps adding false claims using a self-published source as a citation. Previous attempt to resolve dispute on talk page here was ignored here, not addressed or replied to either, just removed. The sources in question are the blog here and this site here, whose disclaimer at the bottom states quite clearly in any case that the author is not knowlegable in the field (in this case music). His work has not been previously published by a reliable third party publication therefore these sources are in violation of WP:Verifiability#Self-published sources (online and paper). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Clubover (talk • contribs) 14:13, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

This appears to be a pretty clear-cut situation. Self-published sources are strictly not allowed as reliable sources. If independent, third party sources can be found for the information contested, please add references to them. IF there are none, they may be removed in a timely manner. The problem with self-published sources is that anyone can then create a blog and publish their own 'fact', then add it to Wikipedia, and damage its reputation. _Jame§^ugrono 10:39, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

I agree for the most part. I think this edit is in violation of many policies, it is poorly sourced negative information which can and should be removed immediately. It doesn't help matters when the User who is adding this stuff keeps deleting these discussions from the talk pages either. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Clubover (talk • contribs) 20:53, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Please sign your comments using ~~~~. I will give the user one last warning. _Jame§^ugrono 07:56, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

LOL

One Dileep Kumar adopts a Muslim name and another Muslim adopts the name Dilip Kumar. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.140.120.11 (talk) 21:22, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

And they are both married to different women named Saira Banu! Bongomatic 22:37, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Organising Summary of career section

The section seems more haphazard and less organised chronologically or logically. If it can be classified either by timeline or any other logical manner, there shall be more scope to build and expand on it. sriks8 (talk) 05:48, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

A decent TIME Magazine article you can quote in this article

This article might help provide substantiation for some of the facts that are quoted in this AR Rahman article: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,501040503-629433,00.html

Let's stick with strong, credible references whenever possible. Here's one. And it was no sweat to find with Google.com. AppleJuggler (talk) 03:30, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Remove the overpraise

The lead, introductory paragraph contains phrases that say AR Rahman is the greatest Indian music composer ever. This is a point of view. Could we remove this and other fan gush to make this article more objective please? If we are serious about creating a top-notch Wiki about AR Rahman, we must hold back from spewing laudatory froth. For an example of restraint and poise in writing, see Ilaiyaraaja. AppleJuggler (talk) 03:35, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

birth year of A R Rahman and birthplace

i read from http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/ar_rahman#/track/theme_music that the birth year of ARR is 1967.

but this page says it is 1966.

which one is correct?

The state of "Tamil Nadu" came about in 1968. Before that it was "Madras State". Hence he was born in Madras State.

Kanthaa (talk) 19:44, 8 April 2008 (UTC)kanthaa, 8th april 2008

Can it be mentioned that the song "Chaiyya Chaiyya" by A. R. Rahman from Dil Se was used in the Hollywood film "Inside Man" by Spike Lee? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.95.30.172 (talk) 04:10, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Clash with puritans

In the early 1990s, several puritan Carnatic maestros used to lambast A.R.Rahman for "spoiling" the lyrics with overbearing sound and gadgetry. I think, one of them was called Subbudu. Can someone please add that material to the article? Anwar (talk) 17:32, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

If you have WP:RS you can add it yourself but remember this claim seems a bit like a WP:REDFLAG claim and might need mainstream source. Thanks Watchdogb (talk) 15:36, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

But Subbudu was more of a Carnatic music critic. And take note of the fact that he was very old when he began criticizing film music.

He was a "purist" who liked to stick to the "rules". He also has the reputation of criticizing just about any composer regardless of his status. More here: http://hawkeyeview.blogspot.com/2007/04/subbudu.html

So his criticisms on film music cannot be taken "seriously".freewit (talk) 08:01, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Encyclopedia or photo blog

Do we really need the "Photo Zone"? This looks more like a blog rather than an encyclopedia!

freewit (talk) 18:28, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

I've removed the photos. If someone disagrees with me, please discuss it here and prove that these photos are not copyrighted.freewit (talk) 14:53, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

WSJ profile

I added the following reference to the Further reading section:

• Wise, Brian. 30 December 2008. One Movie Composer Who Knows the Score. The Wall Street Journal.

An editor deleted the reference stating in the edit summary that the entry was "in blog format" (which is not correct) and was "not accurate" (which was not backed up by anything in particular).

Since the article is not used to reference any particular claim, and it is in what is generally considered to be a reliable source, are there any legitimate grounds for removal of the link?

Bongomatic 00:03, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Well it is in blog format for it has a comments section, is what was meant. As for the inaccuracy, it calls Tamil Nadu cinema classics Roja and Kadhalan Bollywood films for a start. If it's not used to cite any information in the article, and most of its information is on the article anyway, cited by reliable sources, what's the grounds for its inclusion? Whilst it is a good faith edit, It's an unnecessary extra external link, which we're not learning anything new from. It can be removed, as the section is not meant to simply be an aggregate of links. Clubover (talk) 00:21, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Hi a r rahman sir. this is mahendra from tirupati(ap).

your songs is exelent

91.130.91.92

User:91.130.91.92 keeps reverting edits for absolutely no reason at all and fails to provide any valid reasons in his/her edit summary for doing so. If you are reading, please respond and explain why you feel the need to keep reverting those edits before doing it again. Also note that reverting more than three times could get you blocked, so it would be best if you stop reverting and start explaining yourself first. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 22:52, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

Filmfare is a commercial magazine award for regional movies. It's just spam compared to the other awards listed, and hence not apprioriate to list here. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 23:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

Official name of this Filmfare Award is "FAIR ONE Filmfare Award" [[3]]... are you * kidding me? --91.130.91.92 (talk) 23:16, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

I see that you reverted my edit again for the 4th time. You're reference to the Filmfare magazine is pointless, because that was founded in 1967, over a decade after the Filmfare Awards itself was founded in 1956. The Filmfare Awards is the OLDEST film award ceremony in India, alongside the National Film Awards. The Filmfare Awards holds the same importance in India that the Oscars and Golden Globes hold in the US and the BAFTA Awards hold in the UK. Also note that the Oscars, Golden Globes and BAFTAs are also "commercial awards", and yet I don't see you having a problem with them? What's even more puzzling is that you continue to keep the Tamil Nadu State Film Awards, which is far less important than the Filmfare Awards. Why do you feel the need to remove awards from a ceremony as old and prestigious as the Filmfare Awards? Please explain yourself more clearly. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 23:20, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

I just revert your WP:NPOV violations. FAIR ONE Filmfare Awards are just one bullshit award, alongside all the other bullshit awards. There are so many newspapers in the world, older and more important than this one. The Filmfare Award article is stupid. Why does it claim, that Filmfare Awards were introduced in 1956 when they actually were introduced or renamed in 1967? Here is also an example how some actors react to this corrupt commercial filmfare world http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/features/hrithik-roshan-the-star-of-india-547962.html "Ever since, Roshan has been accompanied by minders; two of whom loiter in the doorway during our interview. Roshan says his first instinct after the shooting was to quit the business but, instead, he publicly denounced the corruption of the industry at the Filmfare Awards. "I wanted them to know that I was stronger than them and that the industry is stronger than them," he says. "I wanted to carry on and find even more success, just to prove how weak they really are." I will not allow such bullshit here in A. R. Rahman article. Period. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 23:38, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

And for the record. National Awards or State Awards are official awards of the country, as like Academy Awards and BAFTA are for their countries. Hence, they are eligible to have a stand here. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 23:41, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

At least you'll make it easy for us to have you blocked. That's always appreciated. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 23:47, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

very productive statement, Old Man. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 23:50, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

91.130.91.92, your views of the Filmfare Awards being a "bullshit awards" is a tiny-minority view and therefore an obvious violation of the undue weight policy. The vast majority of the Hindi film industry views the Filmfare Awards as its most important award ceremony, and there are even academic scholars referring to the Filmfare Awards as "Bollywood's Oscars" or even the "Oscars of India", like in the following academic publications for example:

• Mishra, Vijay, Bollywood Cinema: A Critical Genealogy (PDF), Victoria University of Wellington, p. 9, retrieved 2009-02-24
• Mehta, Monika (2005), "Globalizing Bombay Cinema: Reproducing the Indian State and Family", Cultural Dynamics, 17: 135-154 [145], doi:10.1177/0921374005058583
• Boltin, Kylie (Autumn 2003), "Saathiya: South Asian Cinema Otherwise Known as 'Bollywood'", Metro Magazine: Media & Education Magazine (136): 52–5, ISSN 0312-2654

If you are still intent on POV-pushing and desperate to try prove the Filmfare Awards as a "bullshit awards", then you're going to have to try a lot harder than that. If you fail to find any reliable sources to support your fringe claims, then I'll have to start reverting your edits regarding the Filmfare Awards.

Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 10:34, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

And for the record, the Academy Awards, Golden Globes and BAFTA Awards are all completely independent from their governments (like the Filmfare Awards), unlike the National Film Awards and Tamil Nadu State Awards which are run by the Indian government. The only awards that are eligible to stand here are the ones recognized as the most prestigious by the film industries themselves, not by the government. In India's case, the most prestigious awards are the National Film Awards and the Filmfare Awards, which are both far more widely recognized by the Indian film fraternity than the Tamil Nadu State Awards. If you believe otherwise, then I'd like to see some reliable sources to support your fringe claims. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 10:37, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Filmfare Awards are nowhere independent as Academy Awards. Filmfare Awards is not attached to any professional academy or government. They are also just regional and full commercial. It's a "popular" Award also, since regular people, with no professional background chose their winners. It's like all the newspaper votes, kind of ridiculous and commercial, just to make money via TV commercials. They are so many of them in India, eg. Asianet Film Awards, the "biggest Award" http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/22353100.cms in Kerala, but Mohanlal's Homepage is only happy with real State Awards if you look at his homepage. If we go by your opinion, then we would have to put in all these stupid Awards. I already proved the lack of credibility for Filmfare with the statement of Hrithik Roshan as he compared the Filmfare Background Team with Criminals. On the other hand, film makers at least in South are very humbled, when they get an official State award. You can check that at Mohanlal's homepage, when it's online again thecompleteactor.com. He's an 4-time National Award winner too, as A R Rahman is. Also you should answer my questions. Why don't you answer my question about the renaming date? You are desperately trying to enhance Fair One Filmfare Awards in its age. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 14:57, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Mohanlals Award priorities as follows (his homepage is back online): http://www.thecompleteactor.com/achievements.php —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.130.91.92 (talk) 15:57, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Hritik Roshan was criticizing the Hindi film industry as a whole, not just the Filmfare Awards, while Mohanlal was not even criticizing the Filmfare Awards in the first place. At all featured articles about Indian film personalities, it has already been agreed by consensus that the Filmfare Awards and National Film Awards should take priority over all other awards as far as the Hindi film industry is concerned. Check out the featured article Preity Zinta for example, which only includes her Filmfare Awards and no others in the infobox and filmography. Like I said, if you're trying to discredit the Filmfare Awards, then show me some reliable sources that discredit it, instead of resorting to your own original research. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 01:22, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Preity Zinta has not won any National Award or any professional recognition of her work. Filmfare Awards may have the best reputation among all commercial Awards, but there is no way, that they may have exclusive status as seen in the Preity Zinta article. This is clearly a violation against WP:NPOV. If you want to put in commercial Awards, then you have to treat all commercial Awards same. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 14:26, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

Also there must be a visible distinction of professional and commercial Awards. Without this, it would be undue weight, when they are mentioned all in a row. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 14:28, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

For your information, the Preity Zinta article is a featured article. In other words, it's been chosen by the Wikipedian community as one of the best written articles there is about Indian film personalities. Also, Preity Zinta has won an international award for Best Actress from the Chicago International Film Festival, but the Filmfare Awards take priority even over international film festival awards at that article. In order for the A. R. Rahman article or any other article concerning Indian film stars to ever reach featured article status, we'll need to follow the examples of current featured articles, like the Preity Zinta article for example. Since the Filmfare Awards clearly take priority in a featured article, then there is no reason why they should not take priority here. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 06:06, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

In addition, the awards mentioned in this artcle are skewed heavily towards his Tamil works (Tamil Nadu State Film Awards) and English works (Oscars, Golden Globes and BAFTAs), with hardly any mention of the awards he won for his Hindi works, which is clearly a breach of the undue weight policy. Like I said, the most prestigious awards for the Hindi film industry is clearly the Filmfare Awards, therefore it is vital that we include them in order to maintain a neutral point of view. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 06:17, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Sorry dude, Wikipedia or imdb is not that kind of source we need, hence Preity Zinta article is an invalid option. Please cite professional sources, who say, that Filmfare Awards are even more important to Hindi industry than National Awards or international Awards to back your statements. In addition, I would like to see a suggestion here on the talk page, how you would like to make it visible, that Filmfare is a non-professional award. Thanks. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 06:58, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

I've already posted three academic sources above which regard the Filmfare Awards as the Oscars of the Hindi film industry. Do you have any academic sources to back up your claim that the Filmfare Awards are non-professional? Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 11:25, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

It's been two days and I haven't received a response from you yet. I think I've already made my case that the Filmfare Awards are widely regarded as the Oscars of the Hindi film industry on the basis of reliable academic sources, so I don't see any reason why I shouldn't restore them. However, I'm not too sure about the status of the 'Filmfare Awards South' within the Tamil film industry, so I'll agree to leave those out, and only include the original Filmfare Awards for the Hindi film industry. Regards, Jagged 85 (talk) 02:01, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I've added in all filmfare award wins, unless there are objections. Clubover (talk) 03:23, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Well, I'll make it short, dear mister "know-all" anon, 91.130.91.92. Your personal opinion of Filmfare, which is the most veteran--and one of the most prominent--award function in India, does not really interest me. The fact is that it is a very famous, regarded and important award ceremony. And Mr AR Rehman himself attends the ceremony every year and is very happy to get his trophy. You better look at newspapers and websites, which awaited the ceremony and reported any new step towards its beginning. Amitabh Bachchan and many others said they preferred Filmfare to National Film Awards. Books and major encyclopedias also mention Filmfare on every possible ocassion and refer to it as one of the most prominent ceremonies. There is no even sense in comparing articles and throwing policy names. I'm not going to make a very big deal out of a thing that is so obvious and discuss it much further. If you don't wanna get your account blocked, you better let your personal favoritism stay out of Wikipedia. Shahid • ^Talk2me 19:04, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Try to assume good faith on the part of the user. We can't list every award in the intro that he has won, and Rahman has attended several ceremonies winning awards. By this inclusion, we will have to also include the Filmfare Awards South, and every other award he's won in the intro, which is not practical per WP:Lead. Rather than getting into politics of exclusion, it's best this is kept out of the lead. They are mentioned in the notes sections of the table, which is more than enough. Clubover (talk) 19:48, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

What part of my above message you had problems reading? Filmfare is in this case as prominent as the National Film Awards in terms of seniority, notability, importance, prominence, popularity (even more) and whatever else you would like to call it. I can't see why we have to argue over something so obvious as this one. This user is not assuming good faith in this case. We list only notable awards. South Filmfare awards are not necessary because they are just another version (quite insignificant). I'm talking about the Filmfare Awards, not its mimics. State awards have been held for at most 10 years and this user is probably there to add it, highlighting his biasness, not something that I'm gonna tolerate. Shahid • ^Talk2me 22:01, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm on the other hand thinking to remove the Tamil Nadu State Film Awards which constitute one of many insignificant award ceremonies, added in an action driven by POV and favoritism. It's a new award ceremony (how? ten years? huh!) like many others without any notable or major coverage in the press (check google, check the Internet Movie database, chack some books which does not even know what it is). Its notability must be established in the first place. Shahid • ^Talk2me 22:19, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

And you are here to decide what? --91.130.91.92 (talk) 01:01, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

At the rate you're going, you're looking at a block for unwillingness to Assume good faith and edit warring. Please stop, and discuss issues on the talk page. Try to come to a consensus with other users, rather than pushing what you feel is right, and telling users to stay out of things just because your point of view is not being upheld. The article has survived quite fine without this little extra info in the lead. You have not provided evidence to suggest why South based awards are less prominent. They are on A. R. Rahman's official website, are no doubt more prominent, and I'm sure he's very appreciative of them. Please provide reliable sources that state the Filmfare Awards South are not part of the magazine's awards. Refrain from pushing your WP:POV and see things from all angles. Clubover (talk) 03:13, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Dear Clubover, please explain why you think Filmfare shouldn't be mentioned. Don't try to avoid answering it, you're not dealing with a fool. It's the most prominent film ceremony in India, along with NFA, and for that you have sources. Filmfare Awards South have not been particularly mentioned by any source I know, and the fact that they are presented in a separate article says it all. Any source covering Filmfare awards does not mention the south awards as a part of it. I can't see any particular notabiliy given to it, there is no mention of it in any particularly reliable sources, even its article is entirely unsourced, and if you think they are part of the award function, or as notable, YOU have to cite sources for that because you calim so. If they're as notable as the original Filmfare, they can be added too - i have no problem at all. The Filmfare magazine covers only Hindi cinema. The template of "infobox actor" has a particular field for Filmfare, the National Film Awards being the only other Indian Film award existing in the template (I was the one who fought to add NFA a few years ago BTW).

In general, we are not talking here about the south awards and their notability, we are talking about the inclusion of Filmfare in the lead, and it will be included. If you think they shouldn't be, cite a genuine reason for that. Don't make up stories about South Awards now, avoiding the main discussion. Filmfare is a notable and veteran ceremony, whose notaility was proved perfectly, though I still think it was unnecessary because it's quite obvious. If you prove the notability of South Awards, add them.

Oh BTW, I want to know what the notability of the State Awards is. And to answer the question of the anon: "And you are here to decide what?" - I'm not here to decide. WP:N, WP:V will decide. Its article does not cite sources (just like Filmfare South). Shahid • ^Talk2me 14:02, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Listing on his official website is adequate, but here's a source I found for general protocol on the off chance. [4] Published in 1998. It prints that Rahman won a Filmfare Award for 1997 at the 45th Annual Awards for South Indian films. I think the notability of this information trounces you so that's that. Clubover (talk) 18:46, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Notability is established. Fine. Now the awards can remain on Wikipedia. But there is another important thing called "importance". Filmfare Awards is the most prominent film ceremony in India and the oldest and its prominence (not just notability) was established which makes it suitable for the lead.

But what's the importance of the south awards? The list includes the most important of awards, Filmfare and NFA in India, and the other international (Golden Globe, Oscar, BAFTA). Is Filmfare Award south one of the most prominent and important as Filmfare? Is it a top award as well? If yes, prove that with some sources and then re-add. Oh and his website includes all the awards he has won. We are now talking about the lead, and only top awards in their field and place can be added, otherwise it will really be a violation of WP:UNDUE. Thanks, Shahid • ^Talk2me 20:42, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm not here to play silly games. The lead becomes inundated with awards as a result when award notability is established which is why the sensible thing to do is not include any of them in the lead. But as I wrote above at the end of their discussion, I added the Filmfare awards into the article after consensus was reached between Jagged and the anon. That's how things work here. Your unwillingness to deduce they are given by the same magazine body is the problem, along with other issues. This is why you were requested to provide reliable sources that stated the South based awards were not also part of the magazine's awards. To include some in the lead without the others is just stupid - he is held as now having won 24 odd Filmfare Awards. Clubover (talk) 21:25, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Trust me, I know how things work here even without you. Notability is one thing, importance is another. I don't have to cite sources to prove that something is not. You are the one who has to cite sources that something is. South Filmfare Awards is clearly a seaparate function. It even may be part of the magazine, but hey, can you source that it is as nationally important? I doubt it, but try it if you want. Filmfare Awards and Filmfare Awards South is not the same, that's why separate awards exist. And the source you cited does not even say what it is, except that he won an award there. We are not talking about its mention alone, but its mention in the lead. Shahid • ^Talk2me 06:58, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Just looking through the consensus reached between Jagged and the other user, his logic, sources and the page itself describe the Filmfare Awards as being the most notable awards ceremony for the Hindi film industry. Its national importance is a minority view, or it's not viewed as such at all. The National Film Awards, as cited on its page, are viewed as the Indian equivalent of the Academy Awards, probably because of its national recognition/importance, and is cited as such on its page. If it bothers you so much you can verify the Filmfare Awards particular importance in East, West, further North and South India. For your education, as described quite nicely here, the Filmfare Awards South attract people from all over India. In addition to this ceremony being described as "Indian Oscars", what the consensus above was reached on, Jagged's logic on award ceremony prominence in film fraternity/ies and what's obvious, I've added these awards to the lead too, though I still think all these awards in the lead is pointless generally. Thanks.Clubover (talk) 14:31, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Well am not going to respond now. I'm not responding to sock puppets who cite blogs like radiosargam.com. It's far from being an argument to Jagged's one. He cited magazine and encyclopedic articles. You are yet to do that. Shahid • ^Talk2me 14:04, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

I think the filmfare awards should be deleted from the Lead section. The sources of Jagged are inadequate. There are several Indian awards, which are compared to the "Oscars", for instance "International Indian Film Academy Awards" to create a certain type of hype for marketing its own function or industry. Both Filmfare and IIFAA are not treated like Oscars on the professional stage. This can be seen clearly at notable actor's Mohan Lal page, provided by the IP. Both Filmfare and IIFAA are not sponsored by academies or other important film institutions, but by certain companies. The importance of the Filmfare, IIFAA is minor to National or State awards. This is not reflected in lead. I also think, that there should be only the most important wins of the artists displayed. You cannot compare Filmfare Awards and Oscar Awards. I think, Aamir Khan for instance doesn't even accept awards like these. He doesn't attend these shows AFAIK, but he personally would like to win a National or State Award for sure because of their extremely high prestige. Take this as an example, why Filmfare is not in any way appropiate in the lead section. --Bollywood-Turk (talk) 10:56, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Last time I'm discussing it here, next time I'll turn to WP:INCINE. Don't know what Mohanlal has to do with all this. Firstly, whether compared to the Oscars or not, Filmfare awards is the most prominent and veteran award functions in India along with NFA, and it's always been described this way by both books, reliable sources, industry members and A.R. Rahman himself, regardless of what your biased opinion is. In comparison to these two awards, the state awards are a big nothing - just another function held for some 10 years which merely has general notability but no particular prominence whatsoever. Filmfare has a major reference in every possible source. Take for instance IMDb which does not recognise any State Awards. And take Wikipedia itself. The only two Indian film awards being featured on infoboxes are Filmfare and NFA. So what exactly are you trying to prove here except your hard POV, which will NEVER be implemented here?!

Jagged cited sources for Filmfare being prominent, and I can give even more and many. Can you cite ones for the State Awards as being such? Shahid • ^Talk2me 13:55, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

It's also worth noting that Bollywood-Turk is a single-purpose account. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 14:01, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Shshshsh has no reliable sources for this. Just Bollywood Marketing Trash which are in fact meaning only "Oscars of the hindi film industry". This is only a regional description of the Awards, not a national description, which would actually strengthen the arguments of the opponents to keep Filmfare in the lead. And the lead is based on national or international awards - not any awards. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 16:04, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

I know the importance of Filmfare hurts you and the popularity of Bollywood hurts you even more. And I know the reason for that, the reason, just to drop the details, is, in short, POV.

But I will still ask you to contain yourself and your language and be civil, because you are neither on a blog nor a chat nor an anti-Bollywood campaign.

Your words here only confirm and strenghen the fact that you are biased and are against Bollywood, and that's where you edits POV-led edits come from.

I would also ask you not to say what I do or don't have on my behalf, because, trust me, I obviously know a bit more than you about what I have, and what particularly I have. I can cite books, reliable sources and more and more, and I stand behind my claims.

BTW, where are the sources for the State awards? hmm... I'm waiting. Shahid • ^Talk2me 19:14, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Mohanlal homepage, quite enough. Don't say, that I hate Bollywood. You should ask yourself, why you have such hatred against government awards and prefer a magazine award instead. Do you work for Filmfare? Or are you just angered about the fact, that the South industry does have such prestigious awards and Hindi industry not? Sorry about that, but it is fact, that these Awards are comparably prestigious for film artists as a National Award is. Aamir Khan doesn't even attend the Filmfare Awards. I think, this says it all. You maybe hurt by Aamir Khan pretty much because of this, but on the other hand, he is my sign of hope for Northern cinema - make it yours. I frankly believe, that Bollywood deserves a pan-State award, recognised by all States where Hindi is home language, but for now, there is nothing in North except a commercial Times of India prize. I feel sorry for you.. really.. but this is not a playground for Bollywoodfans. This is an encyclopedia. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 22:15, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

You have turned it into a fan argument which I often see on blogs and chats and again started throwing accusations and attacking me. I did not say you hate Bollywood. Did I? Huh.. The Aamir Khan bit particularly made me. So what if he doesn't attend them? He attended the 1989 ceremony happily and got a nice award and after having several unsuccessful nominations, decided to do what he does. BTW, A. R. Rahman, the one who is concerned here, does attand them.

Well you must be kidding now, Times of India is the best selling daily newspaper, it's one. Two, it's not a poll, it has both noted public votes and a committee of experts who decide the winners. And apart from this, a respected jury of critics, whose way of working is similar to NFA. Filmfare's format is modelled after the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences. And it gets worldwide recognition.

And please, if you put Filmfare aside, there's IIFA and Screen Awards, which are both notable, important and significantly recognised.

Now I will be also honest enough to say that I respect National Awards the most because it's a function that respects the smallest of the films with the lowest of budgets in different Indian language, regardless of its market value. That's why I fought to add it to infoboxes back in time when only Filmfare was recognised there. But Filmfare is as veteran, prominent and nationally recognised, even if you try to ignore it.

Whatever you may do or say or claim, you cannot deny Filmfare's importance and high status. Many editors would agree with me on that. I just have to send a few messages to have them all here sharing their opinions, but I'm not interested to do that because the verdict of this so called issue is more than clear to both you and me.

Oh btw, what about the State sources? Shahid • ^Talk2me 23:06, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Filmfare's importance or high status is only regionally scaled for Hindi people. That's the point IP made. National or International awards are the only awards, which will make it to the lead. This was also the previous consensus for this article for a long time until you and your sock "Jagged85" arrived here. Consensus has not changed. --Bollywood-Turk (talk) 07:59, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Sorry to disappoint you baby. I know you are a sock puppet. You'll soon be blocked, don't worry. Jagged cited sources for Filmfare's importance. And what consensus are you talking about? Do you know what consensus is? And Filmfare's importance is national, it has a national recognition, and it's one of the most prominent and veteran in India. And Bollywood is the most popular and productive industry in India. And don't make me laugh, you are not in a position to decide what will and what will not be. Jagged cited sources and I can cite even more for every claim of mine. You can't.

I'm still waiting for sources for these State Awards. Shahid • ^Talk2me 08:57, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Filmfare has no national recognition. This is WP:OR by you :). You once again prooved your hatred against State awards, which explains it all. --Bollywood-Turk (talk) 09:08, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Your disgusting behaviour ("baby") is also thankfully noted. --Bollywood-Turk (talk) 09:11, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

I can cite sources for that OR :)))) Many sources, reliable sources. Can you cite any sources for State Awards' importance?

And it gets worldwide recognition, not only national. Filmfare has a major reference in every possible source. Take for instance IMDb which does not recognise any State Awards. And take Wikipedia itself. The only two Indian film awards being featured in infoboxes are Filmfare and NFA. And forget them all. Facts don't change, and Filmfare is the most veteran and prominent film ceremony in India along with NFA.

If it wasn't nationally recognised, the south wouldn't make a new version of it. Anyway I can cie sources for my claims, you cannot sources for yours (like "Hatred for state awards"...)

Discussion ends here. Facts don't change, Jagged cited reliable sources, you and the anon (and maybe you are the same person??) just throw claims about people hating south awards and being biased when that all should be used to refer mainly to you, and it's shown in your statements, unsourced claims and edits that go against policies.

Next time I'll take it to WP:INCINE, and ask some people to share their opinions, and then, well... Shahid • ^Talk2me 09:31, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Your hatred and jealousness against State awards (including Orissa State Awards, which is in "North") is pretty clear. Here is an example, how Indian states treat Filmfare awards, http://www.prd.kerala.gov.in/stateawares.htm . Here you see, that State awards are important as well as National Awards, but it seems, that Filmfare awards are not recognised at all by government bodies. The claim of "national recognition" of Filmfare awards are therefore nonsense and wholy driven by Bollywood marketing. You are citing "Wikipedia" (where you contributed the most to Bollywood related stuff) and IMDB, the same user-edited Bollywood marketing trash. Maybe you are also writing there? Cite sources from national government bodies of India, which claim, that Filmfare have national importance along National Awards. --Bollywood-Turk (talk) 10:03, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Hehe why should I be jealous? You are talking about a non-notable site which even in the National Awards lists it includes only the south winners. So what's so surprising? The same fate will be for State Awards in a site of say some north states.

The Internet movie database is an international website and the biggest website covering film information on the planet. And its awards sections are considered its "hard data" which users have nothing to do with.

Filmfare is the most veteran ceremony in India. Can you deny it? It receives recognition in every possible notable bosy and source. And sources of its national prominence have already cites perfectly by Jagged from extremely reliable sources. I can site more to prove its prominence and status, from books and whatever you like. "The Filmfare awards are one of the most prominent film awards in the country." [5]

Anything you'd like to add? Maybe some sources for State's national prominence? Shahid • ^Talk2me 21:17, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Times of India is not an independent source regarding Filmfare. It belongs to Times of India itself. Besides that, you have not provided the necessary information, Bollywood-Turk had demanded: An Indian government source, that recognise Filmfare as a national award. --91.130.91.92 (talk) 00:49, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Huh? What demanded turk or you yourself? And who is he to demand something? A mere sock puppet like you. And who said that government sources are the ones to be used? We use reliable sources according to WP:RS no matter what sources they are. And just for the record, his source proved nothing for the State Awards, nothing about them is written, even the national awards are presented partially for south winners, so are you gonna try to make me an argument? Not only national but international recognition it gets. You are talking about the leading award function for the biggest industry in India and one of the most popular industries in the world.

Sorry baby, TOI is the best selling daily in the world. So what if Filmfare belongs to them? Does it mean they're biased? It's not a promotional site, but a newspaper. And the fact that Filmfare is associated with such a prominent newspaper gives it even more importance. And Jagged already gave you enough good sources there above.

I'm sorry to disappoint you. This discussion ends here. Everything is clear and I'm not going to go on with it more so with someone like you two. It is obvious what is what. I just wasted my time for something that is so obvious and does not even need a consensus. Filmfare has always been the most prominent and veteran and yes, many got jealous, but that's not my problem. If you still want to prove the prominence of State, I'm waiting. Shahid • ^Talk2me 06:52, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

You have no reliabe sources, IP does (government). You're the POV warrior, saying it's "not a problem at all", that a company praises its own award show. This violates WP:NPOV in its very deepest sense. I think, Jagged sources are laughable. The first source states "Bollywood's Oscars", kind of sarkasm maybe. The 3rd one has the title "Bollywood is the South Asian cinema". Everybody knows here, that South Asian cinema compromises much more than just Hindi films. These you call reliable sources? I think, you need a doctor. --195.64.23.130 (talk) 09:48, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

I need a doctor? Thank you, I agree with you on that. Have you heard of WP:NPA? Well OK, Jagged's sources are great, my Times of India is better. And I can cite many more book sources. The government site does not say anything about State's importance in the COUNTRY. My sources DO. And I don't really think I have to cite more sources for such an obvious thing. Shahid • ^Talk2me 07:10, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Here are some other articles, who say, that some of the other awards are also considered as Indian Oscars:

V. Shantaram Awards: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/43979567.cms IIFA: http://www.hindu.com/mp/2004/04/19/stories/2004041900410300.htm

I think, every awards ceremony in India should be called Indian Oscars.

--Ultramegasuperstar (talk) 12:46, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Nobody says Indian Oscars, it's not my point. My point is: "The Filmfare awards are one of the most prominent film awards in the country." [6] Shahid • ^Talk2me 12:51, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

It says "in" the country, not "of" the country. The source violates WP:NPOV anyway. Filmfare Awards belong to Times of India. --Ultramegasuperstar (talk) 12:56, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

What's the difference between "in" and "of"? Are you kidding me? That Filmfare belongs to TOI doesn't mean TOI must become biased, It is the most selling daily newspaper. Here you have The Hindu and I can cite many more. Shahid • ^Talk2me 13:03, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Nobody says, that Filmfare isn't prominent in Hindi film industry, also South industry. They are just not in any way "the Indian Oscars"... --Ultramegasuperstar (talk) 13:10, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

It is one of the most prominent and veteran film ceremonies in India, of India or whatever. This was, is and will be even more sourced if someone questions it. It doesn't matter if they're the Indian Oscars, it's an extremely childish view. You cannot fight facts. Just cannot. Shahid • ^Talk2me 13:16, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Read WP:NPA. Thanks. We need reliable sources. This is my view. --Ultramegasuperstar (talk) 13:27, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Your view does not interest me, we are going according to polices. You cannot pretend as if no sources were added. The Hindu and ToI are the two most famous and important newspapers of India. The fact that Filmfare belongs to ToI just adds to its notability. So there are sources and they're reliable. Shahid • ^Talk2me 13:30, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

It adds only to its bias view on Filmfare Awards. --Ultramegasuperstar (talk) 13:32, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

So now everybody who will say a factual thing, including the best selling saily in the world, will be biased? Don't make me laugh. There are sources on the Filmfare page proving its prominence. If you refuse to accept the truth, it's just your problem. Shahid • ^Talk2me 13:39, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

AR Rahman's early career - years 1984-1988

Today only I came to know about Rahman's early life of 1984-1988. He worked as key-board player for couple of music directors of Kannada film industry. Same can read at Deccan Herald news paper link [[7]]. I updated the same in his career section, but for some reason it is being removed (one user is 131.231.181.92). What does this mean? you don't want to give the correct information or you are just biased? Please stop doing that, if you have a valid reason please share. Else people will just lose interest on the biased versions of wikipedia's so called information. For correct info they can refer books, other websites or news papers. Sunwalk (talk) 11:55, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Oscar picture

I have uploaded a picture of Rahman when he received Oscar. However I don't know how to align it to the right. Can anyone please do that? Thanks. --Unitedopinions (talk) 04:25, 29 March 2009 (UTC)am prasad ur fan

New image

{{editsemiprotected}}

Please upload this image [8] in place of the current one for me (main page picture). This new one really shows his global prominence.

Thanks very much.

Not done: Please use [the commons] to upload the image and give information about its source. Someone will be glad to help once the copyright protection issues are dealt with. Celestra (talk) 19:28, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Actually, that image appears to be from the [AP] and would present a copyright infringement problem for Wikipedia. Sorry. Celestra (talk) 19:48, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Ar Rahman isnt popular globally, he has had one hit around the globe but it was a collaboration with the Pussycat dolls, he is popular in india but like most indian celebs he fails to gain global prominence--Gargabook (talk) 22:15, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

His First Movie

His first movie was Yodha in malayalam. You can check this in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yodha. This film was released before Roja. So please make the change. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ravikn123 (talk • contribs) 02:26, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

Couples Retreat (2009) - ARR's new Hollywood project. Please add this to the page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lalithananth (talk • contribs) 18:45, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

23 not 13 .. A.R.Rahman has won 23 Filmfare awards .. not just 13

Please correct the information. A.R.Rahman has won 23 Filmfare awards .. not just 13. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Anildigital (talk • contribs) 07:01,01 january(UTC)

Mozart of Madras

Rahman is called as the "Mozart of the East" not just Madras —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.164.98.84 (talk) 09:51, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

hai sir how are you? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.59.42.84 (talk) 17:18, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Rahman is called as "Mozart of Madras" since he was born and brought up there. So it doesn't mean that, he is a maestro only inside Madras. --Thalapathi (Ping Back) 07:43, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

One more movie in 1994

In 1994 he composed music for a Telugu movie called 'Palnati Pourusham' starring Krishnam raju and Radhika. Please add that.

References:

http://telugusongs.allindiansite.com/palnati_pourusham.html

http://www.ezeemp3.com/2008/08/palnati-pourusham.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bhoga001 (talk • contribs) 03:47, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

Chennai Celebrates the Legend - a musical tribute to A R Rahman[2010]

“Rahmania”, a musical tribute to Rahman - "Rahmania" is in aid of the A R Rahman Foundation. The vision of the A R Rahman Foundation is to eradicate poverty and they propose to do so by setting up educational institutions and providing world class, state-of-the-art infrastructure and education to underprivileged children who do not have the means to access and fund their education.

His craze is more hype than actually making good music. I admit he did few good song but its just as many as most of the popular music directors now but unlike the other directors in all his recent works he is only making one (or none) good song with the rest of the songs basically average or below average. When he was active in Tamil field he did make alot of good songs but what he is making now are just plain bad, no comparision to his old Tamil songs. To be honest if one of the other popular music directors today were given a chance in Hollywood they would of easily overwhelmed them and gain international fandom including immediate requests new movie music scores. Rahman is utterly failing in south now and I don't hear much about him in north India either. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.195.204.137 (talk) 21:25, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

References:

• “Rahmania”, a musical tribute to Rahman (Article)
• "Rahmania" Press Release Pictures

Edit request from 99.247.106.150, 29 May 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} I would like to change the movie Mr.Romeo to Minsara Kanavu because Minsara Kanavu became more popular and take off Duet because that didn't gain him that much of notice.

99.247.106.150 (talk) 16:29, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Not done: Welcome. Minsara Kanavu is already mentioned in the article. If you are referring to the text which reads "...the saxophonic Duet, Indira, and the romantic comedies Mr. Romeo and Love Birds, which gained him ...", please provice a reliable source which supports your request. Thanks, Celestra (talk) 17:23, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 117.204.140.249, 10 June 2010

{{editsemiprotected}}

Criticism Of AR Rahman In India

Though he is universally acclaimed music artish who has won an Oscar award yet there are many right-wing groups in India who have criticised him saying that the reason he got an Oscar was because because he composed the music of a film like Slumdog Millionaire that publicises the poverty and disgrace of India.Right-wing gropus has also criticised him for changing his religion and converting to Islam even wneh there is total freedom of religion in India and anyone can practise the religion they want to. 117.204.140.249 (talk) 16:28, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

 Not done please find sources, and then we can add it. CTJF83 pride 17:00, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Ar rahman filmfare awards

IT is said in the main page that ar rahman has won 14 filmfare awards but actually he has won about 25 filmfare awards till now.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pandbar (talk • contribs) 10:37, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Pranjil, 17 October 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} a r rahman has bagged 25 filmfare awards in all including that of south. please consider that also and edit it.

Pranjil (talk) 08:24, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Thanks, Stickee (talk) 09:47, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

A R Rahman Trinity degree and his studio

Rahman initially before a blast in his career obtained a degree in western classical music from the Trinity College of Music, London. This time around he also set up his own in-house studio called Panchathan Record Inn at Chennai, which arguably rated (as of now) one of Asia’s most sophisticated and high-tech studios. This deserves a mention in the article and this is neutral, surely NOT A HYPE. If better editing is possible I encourage for that, so that it points the fact - which is true,legitimate,appropriate.

Ungal Vettu Pillai (talk) 05:08, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Religion in the introduction

It is not required to mention in the introductory section of the article about his religion. It is already mentioned about his conversion to Islam as a separate topic. Let it be an "Indian composer" than mentioning it as "Indian Muslim Composer". Thanks Vivvt (talk) 14:55, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Don't bring your POV here. What is your problem with his religion? Trialbailiff (talk) 16:18, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

I do not have any problem with his religion, but explicit mention is not required. Saying he is an "Indian composer" suffice in the introductory part. We all know that he converted to Islam and article also does mention about it. Not required to say, he is 'Hindu', 'Muslim', 'Christian' etc. Thanks. Vivvt (talk) 17:04, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Trialbaliff is one of the socks of Anwar Sadaat and has been indef blocked for sockpuppetry. see relevant SPI here - Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Shinas/Archive--Sodabottle (talk) 04:33, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Critics choice award for A R Rahman

Raghuarr (talk) 18:18, 15 January 2011 (UTC)A R Rahman has been awarded the Best Original Song Critics Choice Award,2011 for his single 'If I Rise' from 127 Hours. It needs to be updated on the Awards section.

Its already updated in the List of awards and nominations received by A. R. Rahman. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vivvt (talk • contribs) 04:54, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Bobyieeee, 16 March 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} Please update A R Rahman new picture.

Bobyieeee (talk) 11:27, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Please upload one if you own a free image. -- Arfaz (talk) 12:07, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

As Arfaz points out, it is the responsibility of the editor wishing to make the change to provide everything necessary to do so, like reliable sources, or, in this case, the picture itself. It is often quite difficult to get acceptable pictures, since Wikipedia does not allow the use of non-free images for living people. If you do have such a picture, you can follow the instructions at WP:Files for upload to get that picture added to Wikipedia, at which point it can be linked in this article. Qwyrxian (talk) 01:46, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:A. R. Rahman/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: CallMeNathan • Talk2Me 05:34, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Lead

• film composer by the Time magazine, -> composers -> by Time
• In 2009, Time magazine -> no need to write magazine
• in its list of World's Most Influential People -> whats his numerical rank?
• sold more than 300 million records -> This cannot be used. Their is consensus at List of best-selling music artists that he has not sufficient certifications to back up those claims. If necessary, I can link you.
• making him one of the world's all-time top selling recording artists -> As I said above, due to consensus, he is no longer on this list. Check if you'd like.
• spanning two decades -> 80s, 90s, 00s -> 3 decades

Early life

• The first four lines are not sourced. Plus the following RS source is a dead link, resulting in most of the first section being unsourced
• composers like -> such as

Career

• becoming the highest selling Indian album of all time -> I don't think this is in the source
• You tend to use the word score a bit too often. Try and mix it up a bit
• By the end of 2003, Rahman had sold more than 150 million records of his film scores and soundtracks for over 50 film scores worldwide. -> conflicting with what is said in the lead

Other works

• US -> United States
• U.S. -> US
• 24 November 2009 -> November 24
• My main issue with these sections are the tons of unsourced content. Please provide sources for claims like "Some of his notable compositions were performed live by the London Philharmonic Orchestra in April 2010.", "Rahman has written jingles for ads and composed several orchestrations for athletic events, television and internet media publications, documentaries and short films." etc.
• For the awards, try and give some sort of an introductory sentence instead of just "He won"
• Where is the source for all those four wins, six wins?
• Lots of the personal life is unsourced
• Again, Indian Tsunami info is not sourced
• Similar issues throughout

References

• 1. 1Time, then 2 publishers
  2. 2 needs proper formatting
  3. 3 4, any publishers?
• A lot fo sources need linking and publishers etc.
  • Let me know when these issues are taken care of.--CallMeNathan • Talk2Me 20:47, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
    • This article has been failed. Main issues remain, aside from the fact that the nominator has been gone for a month. A separate editor fixed some issues, ignoring the largest one I specifically pointed out twice.--CallMeNathan • Talk2Me 07:41, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

Biography - Spirit of music

Mr. Rahman's authorized biography has been launched yesterday. Can authorized persons please include the section for same. Ref: http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/ar-rahmans-spirit-of-music/195849?hp —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.44.71.119 (talk) 14:07, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from CryptBala, 23 April 2011

{{edit semi-protected}}

Please add record producer, to the occupation. Balasubramaniyam Senthil Vadivel (talk) 02:58, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Source? -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 08:03, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Rahman has produced almost all his albums himself. He was also a record producer much before he became a composer. His first album production was the album Disco Disco in 1987. Here's the source for that. -- Arfaz (talk) 17:12, 24 April 2011 (UTC)

Already done

Edit request from , 20 October 2011

Rahman's mother was not actually a muslim as mentioned in the paragraph which talks about his conversion to islam. She too had converted along with him and her actual name was Kasturi.

15.211.153.73 (talk) 15:31, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

It is already mentioned as (born Kasturi). -- Karthik Nadar (talk) 17:08, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

Religion

Why isn't his religion written in this article's side bar? It is written for Steve Jobs' article too... Please take not of it... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.99.19.245 (talk) 10:51, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Lifetime award

This guy's getting another lifetime award at the Dubai International Film Festival held from December 7-14th making it his third entry in this category after the one from the Rotary Club of Madras and the Crystal Award. I guess it needs a mention.[9] Secret of success ^{Talk to me} 12:04, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 4 December 2011

Balasubramaniyam Senthil Vadivel 11:07, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

 Not done, as this template says, you need to request a specific edit, not give an idea, and yes there is a need for proof, you need to give a valid citation. Finally the article already mentions in several places that he makes use of technology--Jac16888 ^Talk 11:48, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 6 December 2011

| occupation = Singer-songwriter, composer, record producer, music director, arranger, software and technology, entrepreneur, philanthropist CryptBala (talk) 09:45, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

 Not done: Software and technology??? Could you give me a source please. -- Karthik Nadar (talk) 10:08, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

Proof:

http://www.apple.com/logicstudio/in-action/arrahman/

Also Consider for reference — Preceding unsigned comment added by CryptBala (talk • contribs) 12:39, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karsh_Kale

Instruments Tabla, electric tabla, drum kit, vocals, acoustic and electric guitar, piano, keyboards, electric bass, cello, santoor, string arranger, software and technology. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CryptBala (talk • contribs) 12:38, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 March 2012

Can you kindly add A.R.Rahman's name in Tamil next to his name written in English.His name written in Tamil is அல்லா ரக்கா ஏ. ஆர். ரகுமான். I asked you to do this because everyone else has their name written in their mother tongue.Your consideration is very much appreciated

Raykelan (talk) 11:29, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

✗ Not done Please give me a source that the Tamil is correct since I don't speak Tamil. mabdul 12:02, 16 March 2012 (UTC)